Fuel tank issues with boats named after a SoCal island

Hi Cal Folks, A few weeks back I helped a friend get his newly purchased 1977 vintage, (26 miles across the sea), 30' sailboat back to my dock from east of here due to his busy schedule. It gave "The Princess" and I an opportunity to get away for a easy day sail and help a friend with his new boat. We kept smelling gasoline,Atomic 4 powered, so I inspected carefully, (after all a 30 year veteran SoCal Firefighter knows about crispy critters). The so called "surveyor" had not mentioned any problems with the tank or fuel leaks. Anyway, after getting back to Bayou Chico and more inspection revealed the tank vent fitting had been "Bondo-ed" to the tank and a questionable method had been used to attach the tank to the hull, I contacted the owner and suggested replacing the tank. In the eleven hour delivery I had replaced the fuel filter four times and was down to my last spare filter when we entered the bayou, so knew some problems were afoot. He said, please do, as a new aluminum tank from West Marine was only $249 and my labor, (for friends, even though they defect), is reasonable. The aluminum tank had been sat on two short pieces of 4 X 4, with some plywood scabbed on then a layer of roving polyestered on to keep it. We all know polyetser resin sticks to aluminum until it dries.... Well, after 29 years of drifting about the tank had developed a hole in its bottom, allowing gas to leak.Thankfully we had chosen to stay in the ICW instead of pounding into the Gulf. Shame on the "surveyor" and 26 miles across the sea builder for their negligence. I notified the new owner, took many photos and saved the evidence. I also, joined the builders on line list and very carefully sent a warning about my experience. I was not published and immediately banned from their list. The original owner of this boat had kept meticulous records, including the builders recall notice regarding the fuel tank! BWTM, an acronym for But Wait There's More from my favorite car mag, "Auto Week". The "surveyor", recommended by BUS Insurance had not found the hollow engine stringers. Tap, tap, tap, with his little hammer would have revealed very hollow sound. I had noticed the Atomic Four dancing around, which is very uncommon, I know I have been servicing A4's since the mid sixties, rebuilding them for years and currently have 10 or so in my shop for rebuilding or parts donors. Commercial message from www.BSHMarine.com. The new owner agreed to have me pull the engine and replace the stringers. I found one piece of wood almost as large as my fist, the rest was powder. Shame on the BUS "surveyor" and 26 miles across the sea. Okay, Cals are not perfect, but Jack Jensen and crew had integrity. Mr. Lapworth is a genius and designed fast, robust boats. Some owners of Cal Boats have possibly contributed to some failures, but we share our problems and are dedicated. Photos available on request. What is the consensus, should I report the "surveyoR' to BUS? Life is short - enjoy - sail - keep the dry side up! Tom Vandiver, Cal Cruising 46 #3, Satori & Cal 25 #737 Bravura

Hiya, Tom -- First of all, you or the owner should call and talk with Butler at Catalina. He DOES care. He may even try to help the owner financially with this, though there are no guarantees in life. Frank's phone is (818) 884-7700. His fax is (818) 884-8795. Please let me know what happens. I would remind everyone that every boat builder in the 70's was still in a steep learning curve. VERY STEEP. Some didn't make it out of that curve. Cal was among them. Pearson. O'Day. Ranger. Islander. Yankee. Newport. Columbia. And many more. The list is a long one. Catalina did. It was mainly through Frank's integrity and personal involvement that they did so. Cals may not have the engine bed and fuel tank support problems, but we do have decks cored with exterior grade plywood (not marine grade or marine balsa), leaky port lights, mild steel (and not stainless) beams and our own long list of mistakes and cut corners. It was just the nature of the business back then that we did what we had to do to make the boats and make a small profit. Again, let me know how it comes out with Frank. \Rog Cal 29+ #1 Swiss Navy Cal 2-30 #77 St. Lori's Comet

Rog Jones wrote: > >First of all, you or the owner should call and talk with Butler at Catalina. > > I've read about Frank Butler's personal involvement with quality control issues several times before. It really is a fine example of how management choices and values can affect the success of a company and the attitudes of its customers. You know, it's nice to see good guys win, isn't it? There are just so many examples of how _not_ to do it all around us (think of the Enron trial) that it's satisfying to have a positive example. If I were inclined to buy a new sailboat, it would be down there at the "Chevrolet" end of the market where Catalina and Hunter hold forth. And quite apart from the unpleasant Hunter spaceship styling excesses, my decision would be Catalina because of their commitment, via the president, to customer satisfaction. Chris Campbell

Hello Group After having a boat named for an Island and one after a viking and now one named after our State The Eric boat was the best for me. I think we should keep all things in there place no boat is perfect or less than perfect. This fuel tank is nothing compared to other problems that boat owners face. My 2 cents Scott Chris Campbell <cl… [at] traverse.com> wrote: Rog Jones wrote: First of all, you or the owner should call and talk with Butler at Catalina. I've read about Frank Butler's personal involvement with quality control issues several times before. It really is a fine example of how management choices and values can affect the success of a company and the attitudes of its customers. You know, it's nice to see good guys win, isn't it? There are just so many examples of how not to do it all around us (think of the Enron trial) that it's satisfying to have a positive example. If I were inclined to buy a new sailboat, it would be down there at the "Chevrolet" end of the market where Catalina and Hunter hold forth. And quite apart from the unpleasant Hunter spaceship styling excesses, my decision would be Catalina because of their commitment, via the president, to customer satisfaction. Chris Campbell SPONSORED LINKS Boating sailing Sailing boat Sailing Boating --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "Cal_Boats" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. --------------------------------- --------------------------------- Relax. Yahoo! Mail virus scanning helps detect nasty viruses!

--- scott <ss… [at] yahoo.com> wrote: > Hello > Group > After having a boat named for an Island and one > after a viking and now one > named after our State > > The Eric boat was the best for me. > > I think we should keep all things in there place > no boat is perfect or less than perfect. > > This fuel tank is - nothing - compared to other > problems that boat owners face. Hi Scott, My emphasis on "nothing". I cannot relate another problem faced by other boat owners greater than life safety. For sure, a boat can sink, but the adequately prepared skipper will have some means, if nothing more that USCG mandated PFD's, to keep you afloat until rescue arrives. We were lucky, a small gasoline leak can reach combustible ratios easily in an enclosed boat bilge, then, any source of ignition can easily spark an explosion or a fast advancing fire. I can still deal with controlling many fires, but given some conditions you do not have a fire but an explosion. I enjoyed a career of saving people from their carelessness or "stupidity". You know when you go to sea that your boat could sink, unlikely, but possible, so you prepare. Many of us assume that when you purchase a vessel that has a good reputation and it's builder has been sales successful, it is safe. Okay, there is Ford Explorers and Firestone tires.... Being somewhat cynical in my old age, I have my doubts about the market place. Enough, not Cal Boat related BS. Over and out. Tom V > > My 2 cents > Scott > > Chris Campbell <cl… [at] traverse.com> wrote: > > > Rog Jones wrote: > First of all, you or the owner should call and > talk with Butler at Catalina. > I've read about Frank Butler's personal involvement > with quality control issues several times before. > It really is a fine example of how management > choices and values can affect the success of a > company and the attitudes of its customers. You > know, it's nice to see good guys win, isn't it? > There are just so many examples of how not to do it > all around us (think of the Enron trial) that it's > satisfying to have a positive example. > > If I were inclined to buy a new sailboat, it would > be down there at the "Chevrolet" end of the market > where Catalina and Hunter hold forth. And quite > apart from the unpleasant Hunter spaceship styling > excesses, my decision would be Catalina because of > their commitment, via the president, to customer > satisfaction. > > Chris Campbell > > > SPONSORED LINKS > Boating sailing Sailing boat Sailing > Boating > > --------------------------------- > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS > > > Visit your group "Cal_Boats" on the web. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email > to: > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the > Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > --------------------------------- > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Relax. Yahoo! Mail virus scanning helps detect nasty viruses!

On Mar 14, 2006, at 7:29 PM, Tom Vandiver wrote: > > > snip > > > > This fuel tank is - nothing - compared to other > > problems that boat owners face. > > Hi Scott, > My emphasis on "nothing". > > I cannot relate another problem faced by other boat > owners greater than life safety. For sure, a boat can > sink, but the adequately prepared skipper will have > some means, if nothing more that USCG mandated PFD's, > to keep you afloat until rescue arrives. > > We were lucky, a small gasoline leak can reach > combustible ratios easily in an enclosed boat bilge, My partner had a gas powered power boat and found a leak in the fuel line the hard way. He had smelled gas a week or so before and asked a mechanic who had done some work for him to check it. Of course, the guy hadn't done it. He was leaving on a vacation in the morning (I was flying back from Europe that night) and got a call from the harbor patrol that his boat was backed into the slip and they would tow it away unless he turned it around (they obviously were underworked). He and his youngest son (16) went down to turn it around in the slip. He smelled gas in the bilge and got the bright idea of running a hose into the bilge, then pumping the water and gas out into the harbor. I know. He ran the hose into the bilge for a while, then tried to start the bilge pump. It didn't go. He leaned down into the gas filled bilge and wiggled the battery cable connection. The boat blew up and blew him into the water. His son pulled him out of the water, saving his life. I got a call about an hour after I got home telling me what happened. I went over the the hospital where he was in ICU. I didn't recognize him. He spent a month in the Sherman Oaks burn center and you can still see the scars. He now has a diesel boat. Mike Kennedy Conquest Cal 40 # 96 > >

When I purchased my '77 2-29 3 years ago the first thing I had to replace was my fuel tank. My surveyor had missed it as well. I was halfway between LaConner and Bellingham when the whole boat began to reek like diesel. I pulled the tank and several holes had corroded through the bottom of steel tank. Short of actually pulling the tank and inspecting the bottom, I don't know how he would have found it. And believe me when I say pulling that tank really sucked! Rick Lobb Cal 2-29 "Rebecca Shea" Bellingham, Wa. From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of scott Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2006 10:32 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Fuel tank issues with boats named after a SoCal island (Tom V) Hello Group After having a boat named for an Island and one after a viking and now one named after our State The Eric boat was the best for me. I think we should keep all things in there place no boat is perfect or less than perfect. This fuel tank is nothing compared to other problems that boat owners face. My 2 cents Scott Chris Campbell <cl… [at] traverse.com> wrote: Rog Jones wrote: First of all, you or the owner should call and talk with Butler at Catalina. I've read about Frank Butler's personal involvement with quality control issues several times before. It really is a fine example of how management choices and values can affect the success of a company and the attitudes of its customers. You know, it's nice to see good guys win, isn't it? There are just so many examples of how not to do it all around us (think of the Enron trial) that it's satisfying to have a positive example. If I were inclined to buy a new sailboat, it would be down there at the "Chevrolet" end of the market where Catalina and Hunter hold forth. And quite apart from the unpleasant Hunter spaceship styling excesses, my decision would be Catalina because of their commitment, via the president, to customer satisfaction. Chris Campbell _____ Relax. Yahoo! Mail virus <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail_us/taglines/virusall/*http:/communications. yahoo.com/features.php?page=221> scanning helps detect nasty viruses! SPONSORED LINKS Boating <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating+sailing&w1=Boating+sailing& w2=Sailing+boat&w3=Sailing&w4=Boating&c=4&s=65&.sig=KgsPLsahA8AB__qRyAt_ XQ> sailing Sailing <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Sailing+boat&w1=Boating+sailing&w2= Sailing+boat&w3=Sailing&w4=Boating&c=4&s=65&.sig=oZUJLnrR0FEbvZ5o13Ffaw> boat Sailing <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Sailing&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Saili ng+boat&w3=Sailing&w4=Boating&c=4&s=65&.sig=eGOXnwatS3x0LYN3XxVdNA> Boating <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Boating&w1=Boating+sailing&w2=Saili ng+boat&w3=Sailing&w4=Boating&c=4&s=65&.sig=yMCAyUrqzhoqLD5Ydiy-Rg> _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "Cal_Boats <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Cal_Boats> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____