Re: Re: [Cal_Boats] Water Lift Exhaust (Joe D.)

Joe - ABYC recommendations notwithstanding (I'm sure this is not the only thing on my boat that isn't done per ABYC), is this something that one should undertake to change, if the boat comes that way from the factory? I guess I could relocate the exhaust on my 33, but it is on the (reverse) transom, a few inches above the point where the transom meets the hull. Its just that, under way, that location is buried in the stern wave. IIRC, it is also a few inches off center, which means that, while sailing it will be buried on one tack and above water on the other. Thanks, Al

Joe / Al, I should add that mine is the same way - clear of the water when the boat is at slow powered speeds or just idling at the dock, but at 50% power or greater it becomes buried under the water. -John _____ From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of aw… [at] bellsouth.net Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 2:05 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Re: [Cal_Boats] Water Lift Exhaust (Joe D.) Joe - ABYC recommendations notwithstanding (I'm sure this is not the only thing on my boat that isn't done per ABYC), is this something that one should undertake to change, if the boat comes that way from the factory? I guess I could relocate the exhaust on my 33, but it is on the (reverse) transom, a few inches above the point where the transom meets the hull. Its just that, under way, that location is buried in the stern wave. IIRC, it is also a few inches off center, which means that, while sailing it will be buried on one tack and above water on the other. Thanks, Al

--- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, "John Vronay" <jvronay@...> wrote: > > Joe / Al, > > > > I should add that mine is the same way - clear of the water when the boat is > at slow powered speeds or just idling at the dock, but at 50% power or > greater it becomes buried under the water. > I doubt these boats are floating on their design lines. I would be concerned about back pressure. Not being a mechanic, I will defer to Joe. Mike Kennedy Conquest Cal 40 # 96

In the regatta yesterday I saw a 1D35, Tabasco, with an exhaust at least a foot long and a foot above the water. Probably the most extreme exhaust outlet I've seen on a sailboat Robert dedicated crewmate CAL T/2 Elysium ----- Original Message ----- From: John Vronay To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 3:57 PM Subject: RE: Re: [Cal_Boats] Water Lift Exhaust (Joe D.) Joe / Al, I should add that mine is the same way - clear of the water when the boat is at slow powered speeds or just idling at the dock, but at 50% power or greater it becomes buried under the water. -John ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of aw… [at] bellsouth.net Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 2:05 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Re: [Cal_Boats] Water Lift Exhaust (Joe D.) Joe - ABYC recommendations notwithstanding (I'm sure this is not the only thing on my boat that isn't done per ABYC), is this something that one should undertake to change, if the boat comes that way from the factory? I guess I could relocate the exhaust on my 33, but it is on the (reverse) transom, a few inches above the point where the transom meets the hull. Its just that, under way, that location is buried in the stern wave. IIRC, it is also a few inches off center, which means that, while sailing it will be buried on one tack and above water on the other. Thanks, Al

FYI First Happy Holidays to All The 1975 2-29 has the same problem. I ask Joe what he thinks. Any quick solution (nothing never quick and cheap on a boat) I have read that long as the exhaust outlet is above the W.L. there should be no problem and a vented loop into the injection point which my does not have Note the engine is still ok after all the years and this boat went to Mexico. and back to SF bay area. I have been thinking of adding a riser in back of transom to prevent the back flow into the exhaust or a flapper valve or both. There must of been some thought into the aux. power installed in the CAL boats as to the concern of water displacement wave at hull speed or following seas. If this was a big problem a lot of engines would have bad valves and pistons. My 5 cents on this on. Scott Walker Dona Mia 2-29 And I will change the name with no champange. mtkennedy1 <mt… [at] cox.net> wrote: --- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, "John Vronay" <jvronay@...> wrote: > > Joe / Al, > > > > I should add that mine is the same way - clear of the water when the boat is > at slow powered speeds or just idling at the dock, but at 50% power or > greater it becomes buried under the water. > I doubt these boats are floating on their design lines. I would be concerned about back pressure. Not being a mechanic, I will defer to Joe. Mike Kennedy Conquest Cal 40 # 96 --------------------------------- Have a burning question? Go to Yahoo! Answers and get answers from real people who know.

From: <aw… [at] bellsouth.net> To: <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 5:05 PM Subject: Re: Re: [Cal_Boats] Water Lift Exhaust (Joe D.) > Joe - > > ABYC recommendations notwithstanding (I'm sure this is not the only thing on my boat that isn't done per ABYC), is this something that one should undertake to change, if the boat comes that way from the factory? ***** ABYC has voluntary standards. Boatbuilders can ignore ABYC recommendations if they wish. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinediesel.com I guess I could relocate the exhaust on my 33, but it is on the (reverse) transom, a few inches above the point where the transom meets the hull. Its just that, under way, that location is buried in the stern wave. IIRC, it is also a few inches off center, which means that, while sailing it will be buried on one tack and above water on the other. > > Thanks, > > Al > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >

From: scott To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 9:59 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Water Lift Exhaust (Joe D.) FYI First Happy Holidays to All The 1975 2-29 has the same problem. I ask Joe what he thinks. ****** I would follow ABYC recommendations, if at all possible. Any quick solution (nothing never quick and cheap on a boat) I have read that long as the exhaust outlet is above the W.L. there should be no problem and a vented loop into the injection point which my does not have Note the engine is still ok after all the years and this boat went to Mexico. and back to SF bay area. I have been thinking of adding a riser in back of transom to prevent the back flow into the exhaust or a flapper valve or both. There must of been some thought into the aux. power installed in the CAL boats as to the concern of water displacement wave at hull speed or following seas. ******* A VERY BIG assumption. Also note that since Cal boats were built, the exhaust systems standards have changed. If this was a big problem a lot of engines would have bad valves and pistons. ***** It only takes ONE event, with water flowing the wrong way through the exhaust system, to distroy an engine. Here's what we suggest - Do everything possible to help prevent exhaust or sea water from backflooding the engine. This includes installing a high rise elbow on the engine [ if needed ] a vent loop [ correctly located and mounted ] a fiberglass muffler of the correct capacity and correct location, a correctly designed high loop of hose aft of the muffler, a marine exhaust check valve, a thru hull with flapper, and the use of MARINE GRADE approved wet exhaust hose with stainless T bolt hose clamps. Install these parts to the latest design standard, and you will have an efficient exhaust system that will protect your expensive engine. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinediesel.com My 5 cents on this on. Scott Walker Dona Mia 2-29 And I will change the name with no champange. mtkennedy1 <mt… [at] cox.net> wrote: --- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, "John Vronay" <jvronay@...> wrote: > > Joe / Al, > > > > I should add that mine is the same way - clear of the water when the boat is > at slow powered speeds or just idling at the dock, but at 50% power or > greater it becomes buried under the water. > I doubt these boats are floating on their design lines. I would be concerned about back pressure. Not being a mechanic, I will defer to Joe. Mike Kennedy Conquest Cal 40 # 96 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Have a burning question? Go to Yahoo! Answers and get answers from real people who know.

Uh, just a question but if this is how it was stock and you didn't have any problems, why mess w/ it? If it really bugs you, I remember my jet boat had a coupla rubber flaps that kept the water from coming back in. Just my 2 Pfennige. Marsh scott wrote: > FYI > First Happy Holidays to All > The 1975 2-29 has the same problem. > > I ask Joe what he thinks. Any quick solution (nothing never quick and > cheap on a boat) > > I have read that long as the exhaust outlet is above the W.L. there > should be no problem > and a vented loop into the injection point which my does not have > > Note the engine is still ok after all the years and this boat went to > Mexico. and back > to SF bay area. > > I have been thinking of adding a riser in back of transom to prevent > the back flow into > the exhaust or a flapper valve or both. > > There must of been some thought into the aux. power installed in the > CAL boats as to > the concern of water displacement wave at hull speed or following seas. > > If this was a big problem a lot of engines would have bad valves and > pistons. > > My 5 cents on this on. > > Scott Walker > Dona Mia 2-29 And I will change the name with no champange. > > > > > mtkennedy1 <mt… [at] cox.net> wrote: > > --- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <mailto:Cal_Boats%40yahoogroups.com>, "John Vronay" <jvronay@...> > wrote: > > > > Joe / Al, > > > > > > > > I should add that mine is the same way - clear of the water when > the boat is > > at slow powered speeds or just idling at the dock, but at 50% > power or > > greater it becomes buried under the water. > > > > I doubt these boats are floating on their design lines. I would be > concerned about back > pressure. Not being a mechanic, I will defer to Joe. > > Mike Kennedy > Conquest Cal 40 # 96 > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Have a burning question? Go to Yahoo! Answers > <http://answers.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcwMzOTY1NDUxMDMEc2VjA21haWxfdGFnbGluZQRzbGsDbWFpbF90YWcx> > and get answers from real people who know.

Thanks Joe I know CAL boats where not to the lastest ABYC regards Scott Walker Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> wrote: ----- Original Message ----- From: scott To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 9:59 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Water Lift Exhaust (Joe D.) FYI First Happy Holidays to All The 1975 2-29 has the same problem. I ask Joe what he thinks. ****** I would follow ABYC recommendations, if at all possible. Any quick solution (nothing never quick and cheap on a boat) I have read that long as the exhaust outlet is above the W.L. there should be no problem and a vented loop into the injection point which my does not have Note the engine is still ok after all the years and this boat went to Mexico. and back to SF bay area. I have been thinking of adding a riser in back of transom to prevent the back flow into the exhaust or a flapper valve or both. There must of been some thought into the aux. power installed in the CAL boats as to the concern of water displacement wave at hull speed or following seas. ******* A VERY BIG assumption. Also note that since Cal boats were built, the exhaust systems standards have changed. If this was a big problem a lot of engines would have bad valves and pistons. ***** It only takes ONE event, with water flowing the wrong way through the exhaust system, to distroy an engine. Here's what we suggest - Do everything possible to help prevent exhaust or sea water from backflooding the engine. This includes installing a high rise elbow on the engine [ if needed ] a vent loop [ correctly located and mounted ] a fiberglass muffler of the correct capacity and correct location, a correctly designed high loop of hose aft of the muffler, a marine exhaust check valve, a thru hull with flapper, and the use of MARINE GRADE approved wet exhaust hose with stainless T bolt hose clamps. Install these parts to the latest design standard, and you will have an efficient exhaust system that will protect your expensive engine. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinediesel.com My 5 cents on this on. Scott Walker Dona Mia 2-29 And I will change the name with no champange. mtkennedy1 <mt… [at] cox.net> wrote: --- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, "John Vronay" <jvronay@...> wrote: > > Joe / Al, > > > > I should add that mine is the same way - clear of the water when the boat is > at slow powered speeds or just idling at the dock, but at 50% power or > greater it becomes buried under the water. > I doubt these boats are floating on their design lines. I would be concerned about back pressure. Not being a mechanic, I will defer to Joe. Mike Kennedy Conquest Cal 40 # 96 --------------------------------- Have a burning question? Go to Yahoo! Answers and get answers from real people who know. --------------------------------- Check out the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster.

Thanks for the suggestions, Joe. Its been so long since I've been back by the end of the exhaust I don't have a clue how it is configured. The only thing I know for sure is my elbow is above the W/L. I'll look for the loop at the transom and look into a check valve and a through hull with a flapper. Those things are all pretty easy to do. Al Here's what we suggest - Do everything possible to help prevent exhaust or sea water from backflooding the engine. This includes installing a high rise elbow on the engine [ if needed ] a vent loop [ correctly located and mounted ] a fiberglass muffler of the correct capacity and correct location, a correctly designed high loop of hose aft of the muffler, a marine exhaust check valve, a thru hull with flapper, and the use of MARINE GRADE approved wet exhaust hose with stainless T bolt hose clamps. Install these parts to the latest design standard, and you will have an efficient exhaust system that will protect your expensive engine. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinediesel.com

Hi, Joe. Unfortunately I have found that when a surveyor starts quoting ABYC concerning a boat that was built before these standards existed, the insurance company will start taking the stuff as religion. Cheers Charlie From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joe DeMers Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 11:18 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] ABYC [ was Water Lift Exhaust ] From: <aw… [at] bellsouth.net> To: <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 5:05 PM Subject: Re: Re: [Cal_Boats] Water Lift Exhaust (Joe D.) > Joe - > > ABYC recommendations notwithstanding (I'm sure this is not the only thing on my boat that isn't done per ABYC), is this something that one should undertake to change, if the boat comes that way from the factory? ***** ABYC has voluntary standards. Boatbuilders can ignore ABYC recommendations if they wish. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinediesel.com I guess I could relocate the exhaust on my 33, but it is on the (reverse) transom, a few inches above the point where the transom meets the hull. Its just that, under way, that location is buried in the stern wave. IIRC, it is also a few inches off center, which means that, while sailing it will be buried on one tack and above water on the other. > > Thanks, > > Al > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links

Yes, that can happen. I've also encountered insurance companies that insist private yachts comply with commercial vessel standards. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinediesel.com From: "Husar, Charlie" <hu… [at] bah.com> To: <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2006 11:44 PM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] ABYC [ was Water Lift Exhaust ] > Hi, Joe. Unfortunately I have found that when a surveyor starts quoting > ABYC concerning a boat that was built before these standards existed, > the insurance company will start taking the stuff as religion. > > Cheers > Charlie > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On > Behalf Of Joe DeMers > Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 11:18 PM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Subject: [Cal_Boats] ABYC [ was Water Lift Exhaust ] > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <aw… [at] bellsouth.net> > To: <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 5:05 PM > Subject: Re: Re: [Cal_Boats] Water Lift Exhaust (Joe D.) > > > > Joe - > > > > ABYC recommendations notwithstanding (I'm sure this is not the only > thing > on my boat that isn't done per ABYC), is this something that one should > undertake to change, if the boat comes that way from the factory? > > ***** ABYC has voluntary standards. Boatbuilders can ignore ABYC > recommendations if they wish. > > Joe DeMers > Sound Marine Diesel LLC > www.soundmarinediesel.com > > I guess I could relocate the exhaust on my 33, but it is on the > (reverse) > transom, a few inches above the point where the transom meets the hull. > Its > just that, under way, that location is buried in the stern wave. IIRC, > it > is also a few inches off center, which means that, while sailing it will > be > buried on one tack and above water on the other. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Al > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >