Re: Garhauer (Rebuttle....)

my particulars, Boys; putting together US nuclear submarine's to hunt for the enemies of this country down too unimaginable depths and speeds. and you mite say that i learned in the hardest school of all; the school of "Admiral Hyman Rickover". this Guy too, had just one way of doing things. that way was His way. but you never had to worry about it as even i will guarantee you that *That* Man's Way was The Right-Damn-Way! He wasn't an engineer earthier, but He Sure-As-Hell knew the right way from the wrong too build something. there are right now, Two of this Nation's Nuclear Submarine's that are resting on the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean with Their Crew's. Both of these Boat's sank during the last War because of just one thing folks. that was people just like me and you, people who could have built those boats with the best damn hardware in the Free-world. but who didn't. in the loss of those two boat's, and the 300 men who served in them. we didn't just lose them. We lost their Strategic protection, and their Intelligence gathering potential. and this during a time when the Nation could little afford it. so, what's fiver's point in all of this......... the way this observer see it there three things that you just can't make mistakes with, or use sub-standard material on when your building them. crap that you go up and fly around in. crap that you go off-world, or to other world's in. and Submarine's......... just one mistake will kill you dead and probably un-retrievable in any of the three. and i used to be a specialist on one of the three. I am most certainly not sarcastic! However, i most certainly can see the crucial fabrication steps that have been "Skipped" in a order to facilitate the bottom-line of in-expensive folded-metal & riveted running-rigging. i don't buy any such item's, Folk's. i have spent too bloody much time out on the big lake. i have seen Typhoons; never want too see another one! seen the totally weird stuff that comes out of nowhere; the crap that your own mother will never believe. great for sea-stories. great when your in a ship with lot's of big guns and stuff. make you wake up in a puddle of warm piss and really bad night-mares some early morning; that's what it'll do. when you are making something for your boat, do you ever try and measure to the 1/32 of an inch? well, for those of you who have one of those above-ground swimming pools. find something around the house that is 1/32 of an inch in size and floats. go out and drop it on your 3 foot deep swimming pool. that is you and your Cal-30 in 30,000 foot of Pacific Ocean........... Oh, and your just a little dust-mot on that little 1/32" boat. now do you want to buy pretty-looking rigging at a good price just because they will replace it if the thing brakes? in the sub-service we had a sure-fire test for stuff that didn't stand-up. it was called the "Float-Test". sadly, or not. there are only two things that stand-up too a float-test. a drunken-sailor, and a life jacket. and sometimes the sailor didn't even stand-up......... it's not just your butt on the line out there. it's the crew that You have now taken responsibility for with that rigging you have bought. it's the family's those crew have left on-shore and who expect them home for supper. it's their children who need their father's emotional support and wisdom, as they are getting older and starting to find their way out in the world. hell, and lets not forget the young "Coasties" that are so very eager to come and rescue your fat-old-ass when you get it between a rock and a hard-spot. but as much as i hate to say this, every-so-often, one or more of those young "Hot-Shots" gives His life trying to rescue a man at sea. lets just hope it's not some fool in a Cal with cheap running-rigging; Aey....... there is one hell of a lot of people depending on the choice of just what sort of "Safety" You Build Into Your Boat..... and unless they can beat my engineering experience, or my sea-time. this girl doesn't give two hoots and a holler what is being said online. she generally goes right-on down to the local marine-store and fondles every bloody block and such on the shelf. been known to bring tools and take things apart sometimes too. but then that is just me......... :)(: fiver, Master of The "BB-54" one of the famous Cal-28 flush-decks out of Sierra-5, Papa Hotel (in days gone by) now resting outside my shop Federal Way, Wa. (built like a Battleship; sails like a Sub......) ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

So are you saying that Garhauer blocks are cheaply made and not worth the money? I agree with you, to hell with service if the produce will continually break due to shoty engineering. Greg Former Cal 34 III ----- Original Message ----- From: fi… [at] aol.com To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, June 15, 2007 5:49 AM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Re: Garhauer (Rebuttle....) my particulars, Boys; putting together US nuclear submarine's to hunt for the enemies of this country down too unimaginable depths and speeds. and you mite say that i learned in the hardest school of all; the school of "Admiral Hyman Rickover". this Guy too, had just one way of doing things. that way was His way. but you never had to worry about it as even i will guarantee you that *That* Man's Way was The Right-Damn-Way! He wasn't an engineer earthier, but He Sure-As-Hell knew the right way from the wrong too build something. there are right now, Two of this Nation's Nuclear Submarine's that are resting on the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean with Their Crew's. Both of these Boat's sank during the last War because of just one thing folks. that was people just like me and you, people who could have built those boats with the best damn hardware in the Free-world. but who didn't. in the loss of those two boat's, and the 300 men who served in them. we didn't just lose them. We lost their Strategic protection, and their Intelligence gathering potential. and this during a time when the Nation could little afford it. so, what's fiver's point in all of this......... the way this observer see it there three things that you just can't make mistakes with, or use sub-standard material on when your building them. crap that you go up and fly around in. crap that you go off-world, or to other world's in. and Submarine's......... just one mistake will kill you dead and probably un-retrievable in any of the three. and i used to be a specialist on one of the three. I am most certainly not sarcastic! However, i most certainly can see the crucial fabrication steps that have been "Skipped" in a order to facilitate the bottom-line of in-expensive folded-metal & riveted running-rigging. i don't buy any such item's, Folk's. i have spent too bloody much time out on the big lake. i have seen Typhoons; never want too see another one! seen the totally weird stuff that comes out of nowhere; the crap that your own mother will never believe. great for sea-stories. great when your in a ship with lot's of big guns and stuff. make you wake up in a puddle of warm piss and really bad night-mares some early morning; that's what it'll do. when you are making something for your boat, do you ever try and measure to the 1/32 of an inch? well, for those of you who have one of those above-ground swimming pools. find something around the house that is 1/32 of an inch in size and floats. go out and drop it on your 3 foot deep swimming pool. that is you and your Cal-30 in 30,000 foot of Pacific Ocean........... Oh, and your just a little dust-mot on that little 1/32" boat. now do you want to buy pretty-looking rigging at a good price just because they will replace it if the thing brakes? in the sub-service we had a sure-fire test for stuff that didn't stand-up. it was called the "Float-Test". sadly, or not. there are only two things that stand-up too a float-test. a drunken-sailor, and a life jacket. and sometimes the sailor didn't even stand-up......... it's not just your butt on the line out there. it's the crew that You have now taken responsibility for with that rigging you have bought. it's the family's those crew have left on-shore and who expect them home for supper. it's their children who need their father's emotional support and wisdom, as they are getting older and starting to find their way out in the world. hell, and lets not forget the young "Coasties" that are so very eager to come and rescue your fat-old-ass when you get it between a rock and a hard-spot. but as much as i hate to say this, every-so-often, one or more of those young "Hot-Shots" gives His life trying to rescue a man at sea. lets just hope it's not some fool in a Cal with cheap running-rigging; Aey....... there is one hell of a lot of people depending on the choice of just what sort of "Safety" You Build Into Your Boat..... and unless they can beat my engineering experience, or my sea-time. this girl doesn't give two hoots and a holler what is being said online. she generally goes right-on down to the local marine-store and fondles every bloody block and such on the shelf. been known to bring tools and take things apart sometimes too. but then that is just me......... :)(: fiver, Master of The "BB-54" one of the famous Cal-28 flush-decks out of Sierra-5, Papa Hotel (in days gone by) now resting outside my shop Federal Way, Wa. (built like a Battleship; sails like a Sub......) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ See what's free at AOL.com.

Let's see, where to begin...no I'll keep it short: 1. When my sailboat cost as much per crew as a US Nuclear Sub costs per crew, then I will expect that my blocks won't break. 2. When you go off-shore, you should be self-reliant to the extent possible in a small boat. That means spares and repairs. 3. I have never served on a sub; nuclear or otherwise. So I'm curious, there's no machine shop on board? no underway-repairs? td From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of fi… [at] aol.com Sent: Friday, June 15, 2007 5:49 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Re: Garhauer (Rebuttle....) my particulars, Boys; putting together US nuclear submarine's to hunt for the enemies of this country down too unimaginable depths and speeds. and you mite say that i learned in the hardest school of all; the school of "Admiral Hyman Rickover". this Guy too, had just one way of doing things. that way was His way. but you never had to worry about it as even i will guarantee you that *That* Man's Way was The Right-Damn-Way! He wasn't an engineer earthier, but He Sure-As-Hell knew the right way from the wrong too build something. there are right now, Two of this Nation's Nuclear Submarine's that are resting on the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean with Their Crew's. Both of these Boat's sank during the last War because of just one thing folks. that was people just like me and you, people who could have built those boats with the best damn hardware in the Free-world. but who didn't. in the loss of those two boat's, and the 300 men who served in them. we didn't just lose them. We lost their Strategic protection, and their Intelligence gathering potential. and this during a time when the Nation could little afford it. so, what's fiver's point in all of this......... the way this observer see it there three things that you just can't make mistakes with, or use sub-standard material on when your building them. crap that you go up and fly around in. crap that you go off-world, or to other world's in. and Submarine's......... just one mistake will kill you dead and probably un-retrievable in any of the three. and i used to be a specialist on one of the three. I am most certainly not sarcastic! However, i most certainly can see the crucial fabrication steps that have been "Skipped" in a order to facilitate the bottom-line of in-expensive folded-metal & riveted running-rigging. i don't buy any such item's, Folk's. i have spent too bloody much time out on the big lake. i have seen Typhoons; never want too see another one! seen the totally weird stuff that comes out of nowhere; the crap that your own mother will never believe. great for sea-stories. great when your in a ship with lot's of big guns and stuff. make you wake up in a puddle of warm piss and really bad night-mares some early morning; that's what it'll do. when you are making something for your boat, do you ever try and measure to the 1/32 of an inch? well, for those of you who have one of those above-ground swimming pools. find something around the house that is 1/32 of an inch in size and floats. go out and drop it on your 3 foot deep swimming pool. that is you and your Cal-30 in 30,000 foot of Pacific Ocean........... Oh, and your just a little dust-mot on that little 1/32" boat. now do you want to buy pretty-looking rigging at a good price just because they will replace it if the thing brakes? in the sub-service we had a sure-fire test for stuff that didn't stand-up. it was called the "Float-Test". sadly, or not. there are only two things that stand-up too a float-test. a drunken-sailor, and a life jacket. and sometimes the sailor didn't even stand-up......... it's not just your butt on the line out there. it's the crew that You have now taken responsibility for with that rigging you have bought. it's the family's those crew have left on-shore and who expect them home for supper. it's their children who need their father's emotional support and wisdom, as they are getting older and starting to find their way out in the world. hell, and lets not forget the young "Coasties" that are so very eager to come and rescue your fat-old-ass when you get it between a rock and a hard-spot. but as much as i hate to say this, every-so-often, one or more of those young "Hot-Shots" gives His life trying to rescue a man at sea. lets just hope it's not some fool in a Cal with cheap running-rigging; Aey....... there is one hell of a lot of people depending on the choice of just what sort of "Safety" You Build Into Your Boat..... and unless they can beat my engineering experience, or my sea-time. this girl doesn't give two hoots and a holler what is being said online. she generally goes right-on down to the local marine-store and fondles every bloody block and such on the shelf. been known to bring tools and take things apart sometimes too. but then that is just me......... :)(: fiver, Master of The "BB-54" one of the famous Cal-28 flush-decks out of Sierra-5, Papa Hotel (in days gone by) now resting outside my shop Federal Way, Wa. (built like a Battleship; sails like a Sub......) _____ See what's free at AOL.com <http://www.aol.com?ncid=AOLAOF00020000000503> . DISCLAIMER: Important Notice ************************************************* This e-mail may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from disclosure. If you are not an intended recipient of this e-mail, do not duplicate or redistribute it by any means. Please delete it and any attachments and notify the sender that you have received it in error. Unintended recipients are prohibited from taking action on the basis of information in this e-mail.E-mail messages may contain computer viruses or other defects, may not be accurately replicated on other systems, or may be intercepted, deleted or interfered with without the knowledge of the sender or the intended recipient. If you are not comfortable with the risks associated with e-mail messages, you may decide not to use e-mail to communicate with IPC. IPC reserves the right, to the extent and under circumstances permitted by applicable law, to retain, monitor and intercept e-mail messages to and from its systems.

your question is has no simple answer; there is so little space in the boat's these days that only about a third of the crew have a bunk at any given time. so no, they don't have anything like a machine-shop. in fact, some of the old "594's" were lucky if they even had a power-drill on-board. and absolutly; things did brake! but here's the thing. if the coffee machine or the big water-maker brakes-down, well. that really sucks..... and it happened more than one would think. but it just meant that the "XO" had to bribe the "A- gange" Chief to put one of His boys on the mud-maker between watches while the rest of the crew quit shaving or showering. anyway you look at it "O-Div" always got what they wanted and came out smelling sweet in the end. water is devided up like this; "XO" first Reactor Primary-Loop coolent make-up second "O-Div" third the crew if there was any left........ but just so you don't get me wrong here; there are a vast majority of systems (and things) in a sub that just can't go bad. take for example, the man torpedo shipping hatch on the 594-class boat's. of the four 23" hatch's on those boats; each one having a "back-up" or second-hatch just inside of the first. both the outer and inner hatch opening out so-as to "seat" with the sea-pressure. well, that is excpt for the torpedo shipping where the back-up actually opens down, or inward. it's just aft of the control-room on the first-level, and if you could imangen yourself just passing that point on your way from the "con" to "engeering" with night-orders for the EOW to read and sign. but pause for a minute as the "con" was dark being regged for red as it's 0200 hour's. and the passage-way your headed into is well lit, so it hurts your eyes for a moment. and as your leaning there agenst the "ELT-lab" door, you glance up at this big forging that weighs just over a ton. and it hits you, the boat's down about 800 or so the last time you were on the plans. and the sea is just 18" the other-side of that damn-big hole up there....... and you can feel the cool-are drifting gently down off the bare steel of the hatch now that your thinking of it all...... the "593" She out there on the bottom. you have seen the pictures, every pipe-jocky has. and you get on-about your dutys........... (i would talk about systems, but a lot of system's we used back then we still use today.....) ********************************************* > -----Original Message----- > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of fiverhrairoo@... > Sent: Friday, June 15, 2007 5:49 AM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Subject: [Cal_Boats] Re: Garhauer (Rebuttle....) > > > > > > ************************* --- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, "Downing, Thomas" <Thomas.Downing@...> wrote: > > Let's see, where to begin...no I'll keep it short: > > 1. When my sailboat cost as much per crew as a US Nuclear Sub costs per crew, > then I will expect that my blocks won't break. > > 2. When you go off-shore, you should be self-reliant to the extent possible in a small > boat. That means spares and repairs. > > 3. I have never served on a sub; nuclear or otherwise. So I'm curious, there's no > machine shop on board? no underway-repairs? > > td > >

XO before reactor - I like that :-) td From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of slickbutfoxbuger Sent: Friday, June 15, 2007 10:03 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Re: Garhauer (Rebuttle....) your question is has no simple answer; there is so little space in the boat's these days that only about a third of the crew have a bunk at any given time. so no, they don't have anything like a machine-shop. in fact, some of the old "594's" were lucky if they even had a power-drill on-board. and absolutly; things did brake! but here's the thing. if the coffee machine or the big water-maker brakes-down, well. that really sucks..... and it happened more than one would think. but it just meant that the "XO" had to bribe the "A- gange" Chief to put one of His boys on the mud-maker between watches while the rest of the crew quit shaving or showering. anyway you look at it "O-Div" always got what they wanted and came out smelling sweet in the end. water is devided up like this; "XO" first Reactor Primary-Loop coolent make-up second "O-Div" third the crew if there was any left........ but just so you don't get me wrong here; there are a vast majority of systems (and things) in a sub that just can't go bad. take for example, the man torpedo shipping hatch on the 594-class boat's. of the four 23" hatch's on those boats; each one having a "back-up" or second-hatch just inside of the first. both the outer and inner hatch opening out so-as to "seat" with the sea-pressure. well, that is excpt for the torpedo shipping where the back-up actually opens down, or inward. it's just aft of the control-room on the first-level, and if you could imangen yourself just passing that point on your way from the "con" to "engeering" with night-orders for the EOW to read and sign. but pause for a minute as the "con" was dark being regged for red as it's 0200 hour's. and the passage-way your headed into is well lit, so it hurts your eyes for a moment. and as your leaning there agenst the "ELT-lab" door, you glance up at this big forging that weighs just over a ton. and it hits you, the boat's down about 800 or so the last time you were on the plans. and the sea is just 18" the other-side of that damn-big hole up there....... and you can feel the cool-are drifting gently down off the bare steel of the hatch now that your thinking of it all...... the "593" She out there on the bottom. you have seen the pictures, every pipe-jocky has. and you get on-about your dutys........... (i would talk about systems, but a lot of system's we used back then we still use today.....) ********************************************* > -----Original Message----- > From: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou <mailto:Cal_Boats%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com [mailto: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou <mailto:Cal_Boats%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com] On Behalf Of fiverhrairoo@... > Sent: Friday, June 15, 2007 5:49 AM > To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou <mailto:Cal_Boats%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com > Subject: [Cal_Boats] Re: Garhauer (Rebuttle....) > > > > > > ************************* --- In Cal_Boats@yahoogrou <mailto:Cal_Boats%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com, "Downing, Thomas" <Thomas.Downing@...> wrote: > > Let's see, where to begin...no I'll keep it short: > > 1. When my sailboat cost as much per crew as a US Nuclear Sub costs per crew, > then I will expect that my blocks won't break. > > 2. When you go off-shore, you should be self-reliant to the extent possible in a small > boat. That means spares and repairs. > > 3. I have never served on a sub; nuclear or otherwise. So I'm curious, there's no > machine shop on board? no underway-repairs? > > td > > DISCLAIMER: Important Notice ************************************************* This e-mail may contain information that is confidential, privileged or otherwise protected from disclosure. If you are not an intended recipient of this e-mail, do not duplicate or redistribute it by any means. Please delete it and any attachments and notify the sender that you have received it in error. Unintended recipients are prohibited from taking action on the basis of information in this e-mail.E-mail messages may contain computer viruses or other defects, may not be accurately replicated on other systems, or may be intercepted, deleted or interfered with without the knowledge of the sender or the intended recipient. If you are not comfortable with the risks associated with e-mail messages, you may decide not to use e-mail to communicate with IPC. IPC reserves the right, to the extent and under circumstances permitted by applicable law, to retain, monitor and intercept e-mail messages to and from its systems.