Osmosis in Cal 39s

Hi All I'm looking at buying a Cal 39 and wondering what the incidence of blisters/osmosis is in the boats. Any Cal 39 owners out there have experience with this problem. I've read that osmosis in fibreglass boats generally wasn't a big problem until the early eighties when resins used were changed. Is this true of the pre 81 Cals? Do the 88/89 Ray Hunt Cal have blister problems? Thanks in advance. J-P Quigley

I have a 1979 Cal (built in 1978 in California). In 1989 I noticed some evidence of minor blistering. The bottom was ready for a major maintenance job so I had it taken back to the gelcoat. All the blisters were opened and after drying out over the winter they were filled and the entire bottom covered with Interlux barrier coat. In 2002 it was time for another major maintenance and I took the bottom back the barrier coat. Although there was no evidence of blistering, I applied two more barrier coats before new bottom paint. I still own the boat and it lives in the water most of the time, coming out for short hauls and for on shore lay-up every 3rd year or so. I continue to see no evidence of blistering. Bob Andrew Cal 39 Nereid Norwalk CT From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John-Paul Quigley Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 10:04 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Osmosis in Cal 39s Hi All I'm looking at buying a Cal 39 and wondering what the incidence of blisters/osmosis is in the boats. Any Cal 39 owners out there have experience with this problem. I've read that osmosis in fibreglass boats generally wasn't a big problem until the early eighties when resins used were changed. Is this true of the pre 81 Cals? Do the 88/89 Ray Hunt Cal have blister problems? Thanks in advance. J-P Quigley

John-Paul, I own a 87 Cal 33, the smaller sister of the Cal 39 you are looking to buy. We have owned the boat since '97. This year we have owned the boat longer that the two (2) PO. Here is the brief history of our boa as it relates to the bottom (osmosis question) The boat was ordered from the factory with an epoxy barrier coat. This was an option at the time and mostly picked up by those putting the boat into a charter service. Our boat was available for charter in NC until the early to mid 90's. the second owner sailed the boat to Charleston where she lived until he decided to sale sometime in '97. During our survey, the surveyor prepped us for the worse, describing all the tales of woe. Cheap labor, material cost, bad workmanship, etc. On haul out he was surprised at the lack of blisters on a boat of this vintage. It was late that I learned from someone in the charter fleet that this was one of the original boat for their use and the barrier coat installed from the factory. We had the bottom painted and splashed ready for our first year of use! We waited two years to have her hauled and even though the yard had instruction to call us at haul out, they pulled, painted and splashed her without our inspection. We hauled her again about 18 months later and did the bottom ourselves for the first time. We had many small, blisters about the size of a pencil erasure, mostly concentrated at the areas where there is a water or fuel tank inside. I would guess I popped, ground out (to about a size of a quarter to half dollar) and faired about two dozen blisters. In sanding off the previous layers of bottom paint I revealed some more blisters through the barrier coat, but since they were not "weeping" I left them alone. I used a epoxy barrier coat to cover any new fairing, bottom painted and splashed for another two years. On the next haul out, again there were approximately two dozen new blisters the size of pencil erasure. I prepped and faired as before but this time if I had any spots that where I sanded below the barrier coat, I added a coats of epoxy barrier paint to all exposed areas. This past spring ('07) our most recent haul out, I still had the small blisters. I think there were fewer than the previous haul out, but still had to be ground out and repaired. This past year I used interlux 2000 barrier coat to cover all areas where I had patched or exposed the gelcoat. I am hoping this will limit blisters for the next haul out. Our boat is in the water 12/52/7/24. We do not haul for winter storage or have to provide "bubblers" for winter. The water is brackish, fairly salty (we have dolphin, crabs, flounder and other salt water life) water which does promote blisters more than fresh water. Since I have performed the work at a DIY yard, I have witnessed saucers sized repairs and more severe blister problems. Based on my observations, my repairs are minimal, an probably would be overlooked by a yard waiting on a hull with more severe problems. The hull layout is over an inch thick solid glass. I have the thru hull cutouts to verify this. Based on my experience, the late 87-89 Cal hulls were as good or better than any of the production boats of the era. It will take an experienced surveyor to determine the status of the boat you are looking at. In my opinon, if there are no problems evident from 20 years of use, you will have a solid boat to rely on for your future cruising needs. It is my understanding that the Cal 39 (hunt model) is a great boat. A supersized version of the boat we have enjoyed for the past 10 years. I doubt you will be able to find a better value and boat for your family. YMMV John Cal 33 Oriental NC From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John-Paul Quigley Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 10:04 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [SPAM][Cal_Boats] Osmosis in Cal 39s Hi All I'm looking at buying a Cal 39 and wondering what the incidence of blisters/osmosis is in the boats. Any Cal 39 owners out there have experience with this problem. I've read that osmosis in fibreglass boats generally wasn't a big problem until the early eighties when resins used were changed. Is this true of the pre 81 Cals? Do the 88/89 Ray Hunt Cal have blister problems? Thanks in advance. J-P Quigley

Thanks everyone. The whole osmosis thing is getting less scarey for me, it sounds like something of an enigma but not the end of the world and not a serious problem with the Cals. John, your experience with the barrier coat was reassuring until you got to the bit where it also became infected by the dreaded disease, damn! I'll definitely be getting a survey done, don't know what I'll do if the survey comes back with minor blisters. If this is par for the course with most glass boats should I just treat it as ongoing maintenance and knock the price down accordingly? Or run? Thanks again. J-P --- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, "john raxter" <jraxter@...> wrote: > > John-Paul, > > > > I own a 87 Cal 33, the smaller sister of the Cal 39 you are looking to buy. > We have owned the boat since '97. This year we have owned the boat longer > that the two (2) PO. Here is the brief history of our boa as it relates to > the bottom (osmosis question) > > > > The boat was ordered from the factory with an epoxy barrier coat. This was > an option at the time and mostly picked up by those putting the boat into a > charter service. Our boat was available for charter in NC until the early > to mid 90's. the second owner sailed the boat to Charleston where she lived > until he decided to sale sometime in '97. During our survey, the surveyor > prepped us for the worse, describing all the tales of woe. Cheap labor, > material cost, bad workmanship, etc. On haul out he was surprised at the > lack of blisters on a boat of this vintage. It was late that I learned from > someone in the charter fleet that this was one of the original boat for > their use and the barrier coat installed from the factory. > > > > We had the bottom painted and splashed ready for our first year of use! We > waited two years to have her hauled and even though the yard had instruction > to call us at haul out, they pulled, painted and splashed her without our > inspection. We hauled her again about 18 months later and did the bottom > ourselves for the first time. > > > > We had many small, blisters about the size of a pencil erasure, mostly > concentrated at the areas where there is a water or fuel tank inside. I > would guess I popped, ground out (to about a size of a quarter to half > dollar) and faired about two dozen blisters. In sanding off the previous > layers of bottom paint I revealed some more blisters through the barrier > coat, but since they were not "weeping" I left them alone. I used a epoxy > barrier coat to cover any new fairing, bottom painted and splashed for > another two years. > > > > On the next haul out, again there were approximately two dozen new blisters > the size of pencil erasure. I prepped and faired as before but this time if > I had any spots that where I sanded below the barrier coat, I added a coats > of epoxy barrier paint to all exposed areas. > > > > This past spring ('07) our most recent haul out, I still had the small > blisters. I think there were fewer than the previous haul out, but still > had to be ground out and repaired. This past year I used interlux 2000 > barrier coat to cover all areas where I had patched or exposed the gelcoat. > I am hoping this will limit blisters for the next haul out. > > > > Our boat is in the water 12/52/7/24. We do not haul for winter storage or > have to provide "bubblers" for winter. The water is brackish, fairly salty > (we have dolphin, crabs, flounder and other salt water life) water which > does promote blisters more than fresh water. Since I have performed the > work at a DIY yard, I have witnessed saucers sized repairs and more severe > blister problems. Based on my observations, my repairs are minimal, an > probably would be overlooked by a yard waiting on a hull with more severe > problems. The hull layout is over an inch thick solid glass. I have the > thru hull cutouts to verify this. > > > > Based on my experience, the late 87-89 Cal hulls were as good or better > than any of the production boats of the era. It will take an experienced > surveyor to determine the status of the boat you are looking at. In my > opinon, if there are no problems evident from 20 years of use, you will have > a solid boat to rely on for your future cruising needs. > > > > It is my understanding that the Cal 39 (hunt model) is a great boat. A > supersized version of the boat we have enjoyed for the past 10 years. I > doubt you will be able to find a better value and boat for your family. > > > > > > YMMV > > John > > Cal 33 > > Oriental NC > > > > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf > Of John-Paul Quigley > Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 10:04 AM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Subject: [SPAM][Cal_Boats] Osmosis in Cal 39s > > > > Hi All > > I'm looking at buying a Cal 39 and wondering what the incidence of > blisters/osmosis is in the boats. Any Cal 39 owners out there have > experience with this problem. > > I've read that osmosis in fibreglass boats generally wasn't a big > problem until the early eighties when resins used were changed. Is > this true of the pre 81 Cals? Do the 88/89 Ray Hunt Cal have blister > problems? > > Thanks in advance. > > J-P Quigley >

J-P, unless it is severe (big bubbles, lots of them), it is maintenance. The small bubble descriptions I've seen are maintenance level. Don't run. Look at the bright side. You have a thick glas hull (I assume the Hunt designs were solid glas). Imagine having one of those thin skinned, built over balsa core, boats where you would soak down the interior balsa and really have a mess. Cheers Charlie From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John-Paul Quigley Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2008 11:39 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [SPAM][Cal_Boats] Osmosis in Cal 39s Thanks everyone. The whole osmosis thing is getting less scarey for me, it sounds like something of an enigma but not the end of the world and not a serious problem with the Cals. John, your experience with the barrier coat was reassuring until you got to the bit where it also became infected by the dreaded disease, damn! I'll definitely be getting a survey done, don't know what I'll do if the survey comes back with minor blisters. If this is par for the course with most glass boats should I just treat it as ongoing maintenance and knock the price down accordingly? Or run? Thanks again. J-P