Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump (Joe)

Thank you for the reply. I found a pump at Golden State Diesel in Alameda just a half mile from my marina! Beats the 6 hour round trip to LA that I had to make for the seawater pump last spring. Since it is under a hundred dollars to replace that seems to be the best option. It is very re-assuring to have your replies for us "do-it-yourselfers" who have some experience, but know the traps that ignorance can lead us to! Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" From: Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:05:05 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump Your pump is rebuildable, however, I suggest you replace the entire pump. That is also Yanmar's recommendation. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinedies el.com From: Wyatt Hendricks To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 1:48 PM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump It is not rebuildable according to the Yanmar shop manual. Wyatt Hendricks ’75 CAL2-46 “Blythe Spirit” From:Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:Cal_ Boats@yahoogroup s.com] On Behalf Of Donald Dutton Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 1:13 PM To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump Joe DeMers and Group, The lift pump on my 3GM Yanmar is leaking fuel badly -- a steady stream. It appears to be leaking from the gasket that seals between the upper and lower halves of this pump. My SELOC Repair Manual only tells how to remove and install this pump and does not give instructions for re-building. Is this pump re-buildable and is there a kit that I can order or should I just order a new lift pump. Thanks in advance for your continued help in these engine matters! Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1732 - Release Date: 10/18/2008 6:01 PM

Thanks again for the updates. My engine has the hose attachments and the new pump that I am getting is for hose attachments and she is including new gaskets and new crush washers for the hoses. The oil change idea hadn't crossed my mind, but since the pump is powered off the cam than any leakage inside would go into the oil sump and dilute the engine oil. I think I will replace both the pre-filter, the engine fuel filter, and the oil and filter all at the same time. Since I only know the Fram filter number and we had the discussion earlier about that idea, I was wondering if you could recommend a specific filter to replace the oil filter. It is a 1986 Yanmar 3GMF and the Fram filter number is PH3593A. I will buy the Yanmar fuel filter for the secondary filter and the Racor filter for the primary fuel filter. Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" From: Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:55:02 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump You may want to perform an oil and filter change, as it is possible that the engine lube oil has been diluted with diesel, fuel, due to the leaking pump. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinedies el.com From: Donald Dutton To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 1:13 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump Joe DeMers and Group, The lift pump on my 3GM Yanmar is leaking fuel badly -- a steady stream. It appears to be leaking from the gasket that seals between the upper and lower halves of this pump. My SELOC Repair Manual only tells how to remove and install this pump and does not give instructions for re-building. Is this pump re-buildable and is there a kit that I can order or should I just order a new lift pump. Thanks in advance for your continued help in these engine matters! Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1732 - Release Date: 10/18/2008 6:01 PM

Don't use Fram filters on any engine you care about. Use real Yanmar or Wix filters. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinediesel.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Donald Dutton To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 3:19 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump (Joe) Thanks again for the updates. My engine has the hose attachments and the new pump that I am getting is for hose attachments and she is including new gaskets and new crush washers for the hoses. The oil change idea hadn't crossed my mind, but since the pump is powered off the cam than any leakage inside would go into the oil sump and dilute the engine oil. I think I will replace both the pre-filter, the engine fuel filter, and the oil and filter all at the same time. Since I only know the Fram filter number and we had the discussion earlier about that idea, I was wondering if you could recommend a specific filter to replace the oil filter. It is a 1986 Yanmar 3GMF and the Fram filter number is PH3593A. I will buy the Yanmar fuel filter for the secondary filter and the Racor filter for the primary fuel filter. Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" ----- Original Message ---- From: Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:55:02 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump You may want to perform an oil and filter change, as it is possible that the engine lube oil has been diluted with diesel, fuel, due to the leaking pump. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinedies el.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Donald Dutton To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 1:13 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump Joe DeMers and Group, The lift pump on my 3GM Yanmar is leaking fuel badly -- a steady stream. It appears to be leaking from the gasket that seals between the upper and lower halves of this pump. My SELOC Repair Manual only tells how to remove and install this pump and does not give instructions for re-building. Is this pump re-buildable and is there a kit that I can order or should I just order a new lift pump. Thanks in advance for your continued help in these engine matters! Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1732 - Release Date: 10/18/2008 6:01 PM ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1732 - Release Date: 10/18/2008 6:01 PM

Don, I have an '86 3GM30F engine as well, and just ordered a genuine Yanmar oil filter. I am looking at it now, and the part # on the filter is: 119305-35151 Travis ----- Original Message ----- From: Donald Dutton To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 2:19 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump (Joe) Thanks again for the updates. My engine has the hose attachments and the new pump that I am getting is for hose attachments and she is including new gaskets and new crush washers for the hoses. The oil change idea hadn't crossed my mind, but since the pump is powered off the cam than any leakage inside would go into the oil sump and dilute the engine oil. I think I will replace both the pre-filter, the engine fuel filter, and the oil and filter all at the same time. Since I only know the Fram filter number and we had the discussion earlier about that idea, I was wondering if you could recommend a specific filter to replace the oil filter. It is a 1986 Yanmar 3GMF and the Fram filter number is PH3593A. I will buy the Yanmar fuel filter for the secondary filter and the Racor filter for the primary fuel filter. Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" ----- Original Message ---- From: Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:55:02 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump You may want to perform an oil and filter change, as it is possible that the engine lube oil has been diluted with diesel, fuel, due to the leaking pump. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinedies el.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Donald Dutton To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 1:13 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump Joe DeMers and Group, The lift pump on my 3GM Yanmar is leaking fuel badly -- a steady stream. It appears to be leaking from the gasket that seals between the upper and lower halves of this pump. My SELOC Repair Manual only tells how to remove and install this pump and does not give instructions for re-building. Is this pump re-buildable and is there a kit that I can order or should I just order a new lift pump. Thanks in advance for your continued help in these engine matters! Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1732 - Release Date: 10/18/2008 6:01 PM

It seems like yanmar changes the part number annually. The current filter seems too small, IMHO! I doubt it holds a pint of oil in the filter. I guess this means they need to be changed more often. Does the Yanmar have a relief valve in their oil system to by-pass the filter when it gets clogged? I know the automotive system had a similar by-pass system. Would a pressure gauge in the oil line system warn of possible problems? Just thinking out loud, John From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of tr… [at] sbcglobal.net Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:06 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar 3GM30F Oil Filter Part # Don, I have an '86 3GM30F engine as well, and just ordered a genuine Yanmar oil filter. I am looking at it now, and the part # on the filter is: 119305-35151 Travis From: Donald Dutton <mailto:dn… [at] sbcglobal.net> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 2:19 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump (Joe) Thanks again for the updates. My engine has the hose attachments and the new pump that I am getting is for hose attachments and she is including new gaskets and new crush washers for the hoses. The oil change idea hadn't crossed my mind, but since the pump is powered off the cam than any leakage inside would go into the oil sump and dilute the engine oil. I think I will replace both the pre-filter, the engine fuel filter, and the oil and filter all at the same time. Since I only know the Fram filter number and we had the discussion earlier about that idea, I was wondering if you could recommend a specific filter to replace the oil filter. It is a 1986 Yanmar 3GMF and the Fram filter number is PH3593A. I will buy the Yanmar fuel filter for the secondary filter and the Racor filter for the primary fuel filter. Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" From: Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:55:02 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump You may want to perform an oil and filter change, as it is possible that the engine lube oil has been diluted with diesel, fuel, due to the leaking pump. Joe DeMers Sound Marine Diesel LLC www.soundmarinedies <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com> el.com From: Donald Dutton <mailto:dn… [at] sbcglobal.net> To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 1:13 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump Joe DeMers and Group, The lift pump on my 3GM Yanmar is leaking fuel badly -- a steady stream. It appears to be leaking from the gasket that seals between the upper and lower halves of this pump. My SELOC Repair Manual only tells how to remove and install this pump and does not give instructions for re-building. Is this pump re-buildable and is there a kit that I can order or should I just order a new lift pump. Thanks in advance for your continued help in these engine matters! Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" _____ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1732 - Release Date: 10/18/2008 6:01 PM

Guys, I hear you guys talking about filters, and bleeding and the list goes on. Tell me again about how a diesel is an easier engine to maintain. I have an A4 and I change the impeller every other year, change the spark plugs when they get a little rusty, and we're good to go. It's a simple, flathead 4 cylinder engine that will run almost forever with minimal care. In all fairness I must say that I replaced the fuel pump and carb last year, but that's required maintenance, it's a 1972 engine. I fully expect it to run another 20 years or so, and I never bleed anything. Regards, David Dobbs Cal29 411 --- On Tue, 10/21/08, john raxter <jr… [at] triad.rr.com> wrote: > From: john raxter <jr… [at] triad.rr.com> > Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar 3GM30F Oil Filter Part # > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Date: Tuesday, October 21, 2008, 5:06 PM > It seems like yanmar changes the part number annually. The > current filter > seems too small, IMHO! I doubt it holds a pint of oil in > the filter. > > > > I guess this means they need to be changed more often. > Does the Yanmar have > a relief valve in their oil system to by-pass the filter > when it gets > clogged? I know the automotive system had a similar > by-pass system. Would a > pressure gauge in the oil line system warn of possible > problems? > > > > Just thinking out loud, > > > > John > > > > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf > Of tr… [at] sbcglobal.net > Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:06 PM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar 3GM30F Oil Filter Part # > > > > Don, > > I have an '86 3GM30F engine as well, and just ordered a > genuine Yanmar oil > filter. I am looking at it now, and the part # on the > filter is: > 119305-35151 > > Travis > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Donald Dutton <mailto:dn… [at] sbcglobal.net> > > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 2:19 PM > > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump (Joe) > > > > Thanks again for the updates. My engine has the hose > attachments and the > new pump that I am getting is for hose attachments and she > is including new > gaskets and new crush washers for the hoses. The oil > change idea hadn't > crossed my mind, but since the pump is powered off the cam > than any leakage > inside would go into the oil sump and dilute the engine > oil. I think I will > replace both the pre-filter, the engine fuel filter, and > the oil and filter > all at the same time. Since I only know the Fram filter > number and we had > the discussion earlier about that idea, I was wondering if > you could > recommend a specific filter to replace the oil filter. It > is a 1986 Yanmar > 3GMF and the Fram filter number is PH3593A. I will buy the > Yanmar fuel > filter for the secondary filter and the Racor filter for > the primary fuel > filter. > > Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 11:55:02 AM > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump > > You may want to perform an oil and filter change, as it is > possible that the > engine lube oil has been diluted with diesel, fuel, due to > the leaking pump. > > > > > Joe DeMers > Sound Marine Diesel LLC > www.soundmarinedies > <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com> el.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Donald Dutton <mailto:dn… [at] sbcglobal.net> > > To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com > <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > > Sent: Monday, October 20, 2008 1:13 PM > > Subject: [Cal_Boats] Yanmar Fuel Pump > > > > Joe DeMers and Group, > > The lift pump on my 3GM Yanmar is leaking fuel badly -- a > steady stream. It > appears to be leaking from the gasket that seals between > the upper and lower > halves of this pump. My SELOC Repair Manual only tells how > to remove and > install this pump and does not give instructions for > re-building. Is this > pump re-buildable and is there a kit that I can order or > should I just order > a new lift pump. > > Thanks in advance for your continued help in these engine > matters! > > Don Dutton, 1986 Cal 33-2, "Quantum Evolution" > > > > _____ > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG. > Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1732 - Release > Date: 10/18/2008 > 6:01 PM Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com

david dobbs wrote: > > > Guys, > I hear you guys talking about filters, and bleeding and the list goes > on. Tell me again about how a diesel is an easier engine to maintain. > I have an A4 and I change the impeller every other year, change the > spark plugs when they get a little rusty, and we're good to go. It's a > simple, flathead 4 cylinder engine that will run almost forever with > minimal care. > Gee David, you didn't even get into the subject of the invasive diesel-fuel smell that persists forever after you've done all that filter-changing and bleeding and swearing at the @#$%&**!!! thing. I'll confess that diesels have their place and advantages. We have a big Detroit Diesel in the schooner, and since that boat runs on a schedule in the summer ("gotta be in Wisconsin by Friday") the engine gets lots of use. It has pushed that boat without fail for a huge number of hours in the last 18 years. Diesels do extract more energy from their fuel. So there are things to be said. But most of our boats use the engine to get from the mooring spot to the sailing spot, and use their sails for primary propulsion. For those of us who mostly sail our boats, a good gas engine actually serves well. My boats use outboards, devices that used to provoke love-hate relationships until I started reading about diesel woes and the joys of hanging upside-down in a cockpit locker to reach an oil drain plug. Outboards do a good enough job of getting me to the open water so I can sail, and getting me home again on those days when the wind drops to zero. Gas engines do deprive us of those world-cruising daydreams, the reassuring notion in the back of our heads during bad days at work that yes, we could step aboard our well-found vessels and set sail for anywhere in the world. For that, you'd probably chose a diesel. Then you could charge the batteries and do all that stuff. I've always figured that it's the fantasy element, the "I could sail around the world" dream, that prompts many boat-equipment buying decisions. So I've learned to be happy with my outboards. The 1967 Evinrude 6 hp on the Cal 20 actually ran properly all summer. Maybe we've just become better acquainted and tolerant of each other's eccentricities. The 1994 Merc 8 hp on my other boat purred happily all summer with a new high-thrust workboat prop thanks to a comment from a list participant. And there's no diesel smell to put up with (or is it up with which to put?). Chris Campbell

Here in St. Pete in the last 2 weeks we've had 3 fires on boats. 1. Almost brand new SeaRay 30 something gasoline power, total loss in minutes. 2. 20 year old Irwin 40 something, diesel power, electrical fire started at cockpit electric winch, $2,000 loss. 3. Older wooden harbor launch gas powered, presumed to be a total loss. Each fire occurred in the slip. If you were out for a day sail which type of fire accelerant would you prefer to be sharing your vessel with? Wyatt CAL2-46 "Blythe Spirit" From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Campbell Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 9:35 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats]Diesel Issues david dobbs wrote: Guys, I hear you guys talking about filters, and bleeding and the list goes on. Tell me again about how a diesel is an easier engine to maintain. I have an A4 and I change the impeller every other year, change the spark plugs when they get a little rusty, and we're good to go. It's a simple, flathead 4 cylinder engine that will run almost forever with minimal care. Gee David, you didn't even get into the subject of the invasive diesel-fuel smell that persists forever after you've done all that filter-changing and bleeding and swearing at the @#$%&**!!! thing. I'll confess that diesels have their place and advantages. We have a big Detroit Diesel in the schooner, and since that boat runs on a schedule in the summer ("gotta be in Wisconsin by Friday") the engine gets lots of use. It has pushed that boat without fail for a huge number of hours in the last 18 years. Diesels do extract more energy from their fuel. So there are things to be said. But most of our boats use the engine to get from the mooring spot to the sailing spot, and use their sails for primary propulsion. For those of us who mostly sail our boats, a good gas engine actually serves well. My boats use outboards, devices that used to provoke love-hate relationships until I started reading about diesel woes and the joys of hanging upside-down in a cockpit locker to reach an oil drain plug. Outboards do a good enough job of getting me to the open water so I can sail, and getting me home again on those days when the wind drops to zero. Gas engines do deprive us of those world-cruising daydreams, the reassuring notion in the back of our heads during bad days at work that yes, we could step aboard our well-found vessels and set sail for anywhere in the world. For that, you'd probably chose a diesel. Then you could charge the batteries and do all that stuff. I've always figured that it's the fantasy element, the "I could sail around the world" dream, that prompts many boat-equipment buying decisions. So I've learned to be happy with my outboards. The 1967 Evinrude 6 hp on the Cal 20 actually ran properly all summer. Maybe we've just become better acquainted and tolerant of each other's eccentricities. The 1994 Merc 8 hp on my other boat purred happily all summer with a new high-thrust workboat prop thanks to a comment from a list participant. And there's no diesel smell to put up with (or is it up with which to put?). Chris Campbell

X2. Diesel fuel is extremely hard to ignite, even with an open flame. The fuel needs to heated up before it will burn. Harleigh Ewell Cal 31 From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Wyatt Hendricks Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 11:55 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats]Diesel Issues Here in St. Pete in the last 2 weeks we've had 3 fires on boats. 1. Almost brand new SeaRay 30 something gasoline power, total loss in minutes. 2. 20 year old Irwin 40 something, diesel power, electrical fire started at cockpit electric winch, $2,000 loss. 3. Older wooden harbor launch gas powered, presumed to be a total loss. Each fire occurred in the slip. If you were out for a day sail which type of fire accelerant would you prefer to be sharing your vessel with? Wyatt CAL2-46 "Blythe Spirit" _____ From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris Campbell Sent: Wednesday, October 22, 2008 9:35 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats]Diesel Issues david dobbs wrote: Guys, I hear you guys talking about filters, and bleeding and the list goes on. Tell me again about how a diesel is an easier engine to maintain. I have an A4 and I change the impeller every other year, change the spark plugs when they get a little rusty, and we're good to go. It's a simple, flathead 4 cylinder engine that will run almost forever with minimal care. Gee David, you didn't even get into the subject of the invasive diesel-fuel smell that persists forever after you've done all that filter-changing and bleeding and swearing at the @#$%&**!!! thing. I'll confess that diesels have their place and advantages. We have a big Detroit Diesel in the schooner, and since that boat runs on a schedule in the summer ("gotta be in Wisconsin by Friday") the engine gets lots of use. It has pushed that boat without fail for a huge number of hours in the last 18 years. Diesels do extract more energy from their fuel. So there are things to be said. But most of our boats use the engine to get from the mooring spot to the sailing spot, and use their sails for primary propulsion. For those of us who mostly sail our boats, a good gas engine actually serves well. My boats use outboards, devices that used to provoke love-hate relationships until I started reading about diesel woes and the joys of hanging upside-down in a cockpit locker to reach an oil drain plug. Outboards do a good enough job of getting me to the open water so I can sail, and getting me home again on those days when the wind drops to zero. Gas engines do deprive us of those world-cruising daydreams, the reassuring notion in the back of our heads during bad days at work that yes, we could step aboard our well-found vessels and set sail for anywhere in the world. For that, you'd probably chose a diesel. Then you could charge the batteries and do all that stuff. I've always figured that it's the fantasy element, the "I could sail around the world" dream, that prompts many boat-equipment buying decisions. So I've learned to be happy with my outboards. The 1967 Evinrude 6 hp on the Cal 20 actually ran properly all summer. Maybe we've just become better acquainted and tolerant of each other's eccentricities. The 1994 Merc 8 hp on my other boat purred happily all summer with a new high-thrust workboat prop thanks to a comment from a list participant. And there's no diesel smell to put up with (or is it up with which to put?). Chris Campbell

Wyatt Hendricks wrote: > > 1. > > > > > Each fire occurred in the slip. If you were out for a day sail which > type of fire accelerant would you prefer to be sharing your vessel with? > Wooden oars, preferably. Chris Campbell > > > > . > >

Chris, On my previous boat, an O'Day 22, I had 3 outboards, a British Seagull, an Evenrude, and a Merc, and I hated them all. They would fail me when I needed them most. When it didn't matter they would purr like a lapcat. My club owns a Boston Whaler with a big Yamaha outboard, and I drive sometimes, and so far it has not found out about my outboard doubt, but ...... But I love my A4!! Regards, David Dobbs --- On Wed, 10/22/08, Chris Campbell <cl… [at] charterinternet.com> wrote: > From: Chris Campbell <cl… [at] charterinternet.com> > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats]Diesel Issues > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Date: Wednesday, October 22, 2008, 8:34 AM > david dobbs wrote: > > > > > > Guys, > > I hear you guys talking about filters, and bleeding > and the list goes > > on. Tell me again about how a diesel is an easier > engine to maintain. > > I have an A4 and I change the impeller every other > year, change the > > spark plugs when they get a little rusty, and > we're good to go. It's a > > simple, flathead 4 cylinder engine that will run > almost forever with > > minimal care. > > > > > > > > > > > Gee David, you didn't even get into the subject of the > invasive > diesel-fuel smell that persists forever after you've > done all that > filter-changing and bleeding and swearing at the > @#$%&**!!! thing. > > I'll confess that diesels have their place and > advantages. We have a > big Detroit Diesel in the schooner, and since that boat > runs on a > schedule in the summer ("gotta be in Wisconsin by > Friday") the engine > gets lots of use. It has pushed that boat without fail for > a huge > number of hours in the last 18 years. Diesels do extract > more energy > from their fuel. So there are things to be said. > > But most of our boats use the engine to get from the > mooring spot to the > sailing spot, and use their sails for primary propulsion. > For those of > us who mostly sail our boats, a good gas engine actually > serves well. > My boats use outboards, devices that used to provoke > love-hate > relationships until I started reading about diesel woes and > the joys of > hanging upside-down in a cockpit locker to reach an oil > drain plug. > Outboards do a good enough job of getting me to the open > water so I can > sail, and getting me home again on those days when the wind > drops to > zero. > > Gas engines do deprive us of those world-cruising > daydreams, the > reassuring notion in the back of our heads during bad days > at work that > yes, we could step aboard our well-found vessels and set > sail for > anywhere in the world. For that, you'd probably chose > a diesel. Then > you could charge the batteries and do all that stuff. > I've always > figured that it's the fantasy element, the "I > could sail around the > world" dream, that prompts many boat-equipment buying > decisions. > > So I've learned to be happy with my outboards. The > 1967 Evinrude 6 hp > on the Cal 20 actually ran properly all summer. Maybe > we've just become > better acquainted and tolerant of each other's > eccentricities. The 1994 > Merc 8 hp on my other boat purred happily all summer with a > new > high-thrust workboat prop thanks to a comment from a list > participant. > And there's no diesel smell to put up with (or is it up > with which to put?). > > Chris Campbell

I have a Suzuki 4 right now, it's been totally reliable except for, before i knew what to do when it refused to start, it was because I'd flooded it; I needed to open the choke and throttle wide and pull the starter cord till it caught. Yessss!!!! One thing that helps very much to keep you out of trouble, is to run the outboard with the tank disconnected so it empties the carburetor. My Evinrude 6 would have to go to the mechanic once a year for gummed up carb repair. I finally blew my Evinrude in a rush to get to the starting line, I suspect it was insufficient oil in the gas, but the mechanic didn't think so, he said the motor's bearing siezed. All I know is I gave the gas a quick shot of oil, a wild guess, while in a hurry, and I don't think it had the recommended 50:1 ratio. Maybe less than 100:1, and then I was running the engine wide open. Of course, I always rinse the motor in fresh water by running it with a vynil flush bag attached to a dock hose, while I run the carb dry. The other dumb thing I've done is run the motor without servicing it for years, until the water pump impeller thru a vane which blocked the water intake, causing the engine to overheat and die. Thankfully, before it did any damage to the engine. Rebuilding/replacing the impeller is no big deal except a little tricky to hook the bottom and top up with the gear shifter in the right position, if you forget to check it still has F-N-R. I also don't recommend waiting five years to get around to finding that old grease gun, loading it with marine grease, and shooting up the old xerks fittings, like I did. Let's hear it for good old two cycle outboards, lightweight, mostly reliable, and...yes, lightweight, especially good if you're still fanatic and taking the motor off the transom to get that last little bit of speed. And let's hear it for our slick sailboat hulls, easily driven with very little HP and not much throttle. Jerry --- On Sat, 10/25/08, david dobbs <tm… [at] yahoo.com> wrote: From: david dobbs <tm… [at] yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats]Diesel Issues, Outboards To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, October 25, 2008, 8:14 PM Chris, On my previous boat, an O'Day 22, I had 3 outboards, a British Seagull, an Evenrude, and a Merc, and I hated them all. They would fail me when I needed them most. When it didn't matter they would purr like a lapcat. My club owns a Boston Whaler with a big Yamaha outboard, and I drive sometimes, and so far it has not found out about my outboard doubt, but ...... But I love my A4!! Regards, David Dobbs --- On Wed, 10/22/08, Chris Campbell <clcampbell@charteri nternet.com> wrote: > From: Chris Campbell <clcampbell@charteri nternet.com> > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats]Diesel Issues > To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com > Date: Wednesday, October 22, 2008, 8:34 AM > david dobbs wrote: > > > > > > Guys, > > I hear you guys talking about filters, and bleeding > and the list goes > > on. Tell me again about how a diesel is an easier > engine to maintain. > > I have an A4 and I change the impeller every other > year, change the > > spark plugs when they get a little rusty, and > we're good to go. It's a > > simple, flathead 4 cylinder engine that will run > almost forever with > > minimal care. > > > > > > > > > > > Gee David, you didn't even get into the subject of the > invasive > diesel-fuel smell that persists forever after you've > done all that > filter-changing and bleeding and swearing at the > @#$%&**!!! thing. > > I'll confess that diesels have their place and > advantages. We have a > big Detroit Diesel in the schooner, and since that boat > runs on a > schedule in the summer ("gotta be in Wisconsin by > Friday") the engine > gets lots of use. It has pushed that boat without fail for > a huge > number of hours in the last 18 years. Diesels do extract > more energy > from their fuel. So there are things to be said. > > But most of our boats use the engine to get from the > mooring spot to the > sailing spot, and use their sails for primary propulsion. > For those of > us who mostly sail our boats, a good gas engine actually > serves well. > My boats use outboards, devices that used to provoke > love-hate > relationships until I started reading about diesel woes and > the joys of > hanging upside-down in a cockpit locker to reach an oil > drain plug. > Outboards do a good enough job of getting me to the open > water so I can > sail, and getting me home again on those days when the wind > drops to > zero. > > Gas engines do deprive us of those world-cruising > daydreams, the > reassuring notion in the back of our heads during bad days > at work that > yes, we could step aboard our well-found vessels and set > sail for > anywhere in the world. For that, you'd probably chose > a diesel. Then > you could charge the batteries and do all that stuff. > I've always > figured that it's the fantasy element, the "I > could sail around the > world" dream, that prompts many boat-equipment buying > decisions. > > So I've learned to be happy with my outboards. The > 1967 Evinrude 6 hp > on the Cal 20 actually ran properly all summer. Maybe > we've just become > better acquainted and tolerant of each other's > eccentricities. The 1994 > Merc 8 hp on my other boat purred happily all summer with a > new > high-thrust workboat prop thanks to a comment from a list > participant. > And there's no diesel smell to put up with (or is it up > with which to put?). > > Chris Campbell

Gerald Sobel wrote: > > > > One thing that helps very much to keep you out of trouble, is to run > the outboard with the tank disconnected so it empties the carburetor. > My Evinrude 6 would have to go to the mechanic once a year for gummed > up carb repair. > Good advice! During the sailing season, I start my outboards at least every two weeks and let them run just a bit, to get some fresh fuel in the carburetor. And then when I haul out, I disconnect the fuel line and run the gas out (it takes longer than you would expect). > > > > Let's hear it for good old two cycle outboards, lightweight, mostly > reliable, and...yes, lightweight, especially good if you're still > fanatic and taking the motor off the transom to get that last little > bit of speed. And let's hear it for our slick sailboat hulls, easily > driven with very little HP and not much throttle. > Right on, both with regard to the useful little outboards and the wonders of an efficient hull form. In Bay City, MI, where one of my boats lives, a local guy has built a 40 foot displacement hull powerboat, one that can be driven easily by a low-hp engine. It was written up in the Gougeon Bros.' publication, /Epoxyworks/, and I have seen it gliding along, quietly and inexpensively, while the high-hp planing powerboats roar by at multiple gallons per mile. The builder wanted to be able to cruise at low fuel cost, something he wasn't able to do in his former powerboat with a planing hull. As I recall, he used a hull design from the '20s, updated a bit. Chris Campbell > >

Chris, I run my carburetor dry every time I use the outboard. You never know how long it will be between times you use the motor. Sometimes, tho I sail the boat once or twice a week, I may not start and run it for over a month. Our last series featured a start and finish inside the marina, so most of us were sailing to the start and sailing back to our docks. I don't know how long it will take for the gas in the carb to evaporate and get gummy, and I don't know whether the 10% ethanol gas we all use now is making the situation better or worse. All I can say is I've yet to need to have my Suzuki professionally serviced, and I've had it seven years. The Evinrude needed to see the doctor at least twice a year. On the otherhand, I still have my dad's 1960 "Golden Aniversery" 5.5 HP Fisherman, which I'd be using except it's a short shaft. It was also totally trouble free. The Evenrude 6 long shaft I'd bought from the ourboard mechanic had sat for well over ten years unused on the back of a Catalina Capri; apparently when the former owner was told what the bill would be for overhauling the motor, he abandoned it with the mechanic. This next year I hope I'll do more fishing and cruising. But I have to admit, entering races, and pre-paying for race series kinda forces you to use your boat. And, maybe I'm an adreniline junkie. If sailing is fun, racing is fun times ten. Jerry --- On Mon, 10/27/08, Chris Campbell <cl… [at] charterinternet.com> wrote: From: Chris Campbell <cl… [at] charterinternet.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Outboards To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, October 27, 2008, 7:31 AM Gerald Sobel wrote: One thing that helps very much to keep you out of trouble, is to run the outboard with the tank disconnected so it empties the carburetor. My Evinrude 6 would have to go to the mechanic once a year for gummed up carb repair. Good advice! During the sailing season, I start my outboards at least every two weeks and let them run just a bit, to get some fresh fuel in the carburetor. And then when I haul out, I disconnect the fuel line and run the gas out (it takes longer than you would expect). Let's hear it for good old two cycle outboards, lightweight, mostly reliable, and...yes, lightweight, especially good if you're still fanatic and taking the motor off the transom to get that last little bit of speed. And let's hear it for our slick sailboat hulls, easily driven with very little HP and not much throttle. Right on, both with regard to the useful little outboards and the wonders of an efficient hull form. In Bay City, MI, where one of my boats lives, a local guy has built a 40 foot displacement hull powerboat, one that can be driven easily by a low-hp engine. It was written up in the Gougeon Bros.' publication, Epoxyworks, and I have seen it gliding along, quietly and inexpensively, while the high-hp planing powerboats roar by at multiple gallons per mile. The builder wanted to be able to cruise at low fuel cost, something he wasn't able to do in his former powerboat with a planing hull. As I recall, he used a hull design from the '20s, updated a bit. Chris Campbell

Gerald Sobel wrote: > > Chris, > I run my carburetor dry every time I use the outboard. You never know > how long it will be between times you use the motor. > About 20 years ago, my brother was visiting and made an idle inquiry, "do you know how much it costs you per trip to own this boat?" Well, I did a quick mental calculation and the answer was so unfavorable that I pretended I didn't know. But I also realized there are two ways to alter the cost per sailing event: pay less or sail more. The marina doesn't bargain on dockage, hauling, or winter storage, so I resolved to sail more. As a result, the outboard doesn't sit idle too long. > > Sometimes, tho I sail the boat once or twice a week, I may not start > and run it for over a month. > Me too, so that's why I started running the motor when I got back onto my mooring, just to keep the gas moving a bit. The gas tank sits in the cockpit, in the sun, so I made a cover for it from foil-faced foam insulation to keep it cool. That reduces the losses of the most volatile components of the gasoline through the tank vent. > > > I don't know how long it will take for the gas in the carb to > evaporate and get gummy, and I don't know whether the 10% ethanol gas > we all use now is making the situation better or worse. > Everything I've read says "worse." Chris > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG. > Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.4/1751 - Release Date: 10/27/2008 10:44 PM >

Jerry, I have an Evenrude 6hp 2 stroke longshaft that I use to push my Cal 25. With the exception of a tune up and carb job when I first purchased the boat (engine had been stored aboard for 5 years and never used) I've only had it checked and tuned once every 3 years. It's basically a bulletproof motor. I guess I'm lucky that I take the boat out sailing probably 30 weekends per year or more, so the engine sees about 30 minutes of use every week or so. I also add fuel stabilizer with every fill-up when I add the oil. BTW, I have to agree with your comment that racing is fun x 10. I also believe that I've learned a great deal from racing that I would never have picked up just cruising around the bay. Have a Happy New Year! Scott Sauvageot Cal 25 #1651 Indefatigable Annapolis, MD _____ From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Sobel Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 10:06 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Outboards(Chris) Chris, I run my carburetor dry every time I use the outboard. You never know how long it will be between times you use the motor. Sometimes, tho I sail the boat once or twice a week, I may not start and run it for over a month. Our last series featured a start and finish inside the marina, so most of us were sailing to the start and sailing back to our docks. I don't know how long it will take for the gas in the carb to evaporate and get gummy, and I don't know whether the 10% ethanol gas we all use now is making the situation better or worse. All I can say is I've yet to need to have my Suzuki professionally serviced, and I've had it seven years. The Evinrude needed to see the doctor at least twice a year. On the otherhand, I still have my dad's 1960 "Golden Aniversery" 5.5 HP Fisherman, which I'd be using except it's a short shaft. It was also totally trouble free. The Evenrude 6 long shaft I'd bought from the ourboard mechanic had sat for well over ten years unused on the back of a Catalina Capri; apparently when the former owner was told what the bill would be for overhauling the motor, he abandoned it with the mechanic. This next year I hope I'll do more fishing and cruising. But I have to admit, entering races, and pre-paying for race series kinda forces you to use your boat. And, maybe I'm an adreniline junkie. If sailing is fun, racing is fun times ten. Jerry --- On Mon, 10/27/08, Chris Campbell <cl… [at] charterinternet.com> wrote: From: Chris Campbell <cl… [at] charterinternet.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Outboards To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, October 27, 2008, 7:31 AM Gerald Sobel wrote: One thing that helps very much to keep you out of trouble, is to run the outboard with the tank disconnected so it empties the carburetor. My Evinrude 6 would have to go to the mechanic once a year for gummed up carb repair. Good advice! During the sailing season, I start my outboards at least every two weeks and let them run just a bit, to get some fresh fuel in the carburetor. And then when I haul out, I disconnect the fuel line and run the gas out (it takes longer than you would expect). Let's hear it for good old two cycle outboards, lightweight, mostly reliable, and...yes, lightweight, especially good if you're still fanatic and taking the motor off the transom to get that last little bit of speed. And let's hear it for our slick sailboat hulls, easily driven with very little HP and not much throttle. Right on, both with regard to the useful little outboards and the wonders of an efficient hull form. In Bay City, MI, where one of my boats lives, a local guy has built a 40 foot displacement hull powerboat, one that can be driven easily by a low-hp engine. It was written up in the Gougeon Bros.' publication, Epoxyworks, and I have seen it gliding along, quietly and inexpensively, while the high-hp planing powerboats roar by at multiple gallons per mile. The builder wanted to be able to cruise at low fuel cost, something he wasn't able to do in his former powerboat with a planing hull. As I recall, he used a hull design from the '20s, updated a bit. Chris Campbell