Re: Spreader Fabrication

Thanks Chris, Fin, Alfred, Fred, Mike, et al for your input and photos regarding the spreader fabrication project. As for the loss of weight aloft, I agree it will probably make some difference, but I don't think significant enough to notice, or matter. It's only half-way up the mast and the difference in weight between the spruce and carbon fiber I don't think will be that great after the spreader lights and stainless rubbing strakes are installed. As I remember, the spruce was surprisingly light! My desire is to have something stronger, with installed halyard chafe protection, and requiring less maintenance than the original spruce, not necessarily to save weight. Fred, your description sounds dead-on and reminds me when last I had the stick down. If a photo with something included to give it scale (a ruler?) is not too much trouble, it might be helpful. Mike, thanks for the photo offer. I look forward to receiving it. Again, thanks to all. What a group! Rob "Bandit" Cal 40, #32 Oyster Bay, NY >From: Fred Haas <ol… [at] seanet.com> >Sent: Feb 17, 2009 12:15 PM >To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Sad Day and Spreader Inquiry > >Rob, >I don't know if this would be useful, but... I have just built new >spruce spreaders for Nemesis, due to an "out of warranty" failure of >one of the originals. I tried to contact Jensen Marine to complain, but >they were singularly unresponsive. >In any case, I have an intact 3-30 spreader from 1974 sitting in my >office. While I have recycled the hardware, It's location is pretty >obvious. A pair of more or less triangular plates , top and bottom, >established the contact at the mast. The spreader was tapered from the >plate to the mast tip, and was airfoil shaped to within a few inches of >each end, where it returned to full thickness. The tip was rounded and >had a notch in the center into which the shroud was fitted. This notch >was supported by a strip of stainless steel which wrapped horizontally >around the tip and was secured by two through bolts to the wooden >spreader. >Assuming the spreader design was the same as the earlier 40, I could >certainly shoot pictures of it if you would like. Just let me know. >Fred Haas >3-30 Nemesis >Tacoma >On Feb 16, 2009, at 5:47 PM, rfalcons wrote: > >> On another note, I'm considering experimenting with carbon fiber and >> Divnycell coring to fabricate replacement spreaders for "Bandit", my >> Cal 40. (Mine are the original spruce.) I have the original specs for >> the spreaders, taken off the plans, but it does not show any detail >> for the spreader tip, and my stick is still up and tips are covered >> with chafing gear. >> >> Questions-Does anyone know if there were any differences in spreader >> dimensions over the "40" production run? >> -Does anyone have any photos they can forward that shows the spreader >> tips? >> >> Thanks, >> Rob >> "Bandit" >> Cal 40,#32 >> Oyster Bay, NY >> >>

Rob, I went down to the boat and fished out the extra set of spreaders I made in case my new ones didn't arrive in time for my re-masting last year. They were put together in a hurry and aren't pretty, but they will last at least 10 years in a pinch and I can't see that high up. Anyway, I stayed true to the dimensions of the originals. Here are the pictures with the dimensions 'shopped onto them. Hope this helps... Let me know if the pics don't come through. Sometimes they do, sometimes Yahoo screws it up... Mike /Celtic Naut /1965 Cal-40 #44 Spreaders and dimensions. / /The spreader base. the tip The tip. Ignore the resin globbed all over it. I was in a hurry and then didn't need them. Tip Side view. Base Width. Note Angle of about 10 degrees. //

some wooden CAL spreaders had a cast aluminum end fitting in lieu of the stainless. reggie To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com From: mi… [at] wahini.org Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 20:51:47 -0600 Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Re: Spreader Fabrication (Rob) Cal-40 Dimensions Rob, I went down to the boat and fished out the extra set of spreaders I made in case my new ones didn't arrive in time for my re-masting last year. They were put together in a hurry and aren't pretty, but they will last at least 10 years in a pinch and I can't see that high up. Anyway, I stayed true to the dimensions of the originals. Here are the pictures with the dimensions 'shopped onto them. Hope this helps... Let me know if the pics don't come through. Sometimes they do, sometimes Yahoo screws it up... Mike Celtic Naut 1965 Cal-40 #44 Spreaders and dimensions. The spreader base. The tip. Ignore the resin globbed all over it. I was in a hurry and then didn't need them. Tip Side view. Base Width. Note Angle of about 10 degrees.

Mike's pictures highlight an interesting design flaw. Check out the bolt pattern on the in-board end. The bolts-holes do a nice job of cutting through most of the wood fibers. I was on-board to appreciate the effect this can have. It was 196, and we were racing Cal-40 #41, "Kumu" from San Francisco up to Drakes Bay, which involved 30-or-so miles of up-wind slogging in the ocean. The owner/skipper, Aldo Alessio (they later name a regatta in his memory), was one of the best. He took good care of his boat. About half-way to Drakes Bay we were headed offshore on starboard tack. It was time to tack back inshore. We had been hearing an odd sound, an occasional "thunk", "thunk". Not particularly loud, but certainly noticeable. Fortunately, one of the crew went forward to check it out before we were to tack. What he saw was pretty alarming. The inboard end of the port-side spreader had broken free from the mast, and the "thunk" was the spreader tapping on the mast as we worked through the waves. The inboard end looked like a pointy-nosed shark had taken a "V" shaped bite out of it .... right along the bolt pattern. Connect the dots. Instead of tacking, we bore off and headed back to San Francisco. No harm done, and we had new spreaders for the next race 2 weeks later. What I learned many years later was that the primary cause of the failure was the "working" that the leeward spreader does when pounding to weather. The guy who built my new mast a few years ago strongly suggested that the rig be set up just tight enough so that the leeward shrouds are not slack when pounding to weather ... thus eliminating this stress on the spreader connection at the mast. I believe that this works fine on keel-stepped rigs, but may not work on deck-stepped rigs. I also understand that many boats (like Cal-20's) sail faster with a slack rig. Fin Beven Cal-40 #24 Radiant San Pedro, CA ----- Original Message ----- From: r good<mailto:my… [at] hotmail.com> To: ca… [at] yahoogroups.com<mailto:ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 9:30 AM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Re: Spreader Fabrication (Rob) Cal-40 Dimensions some wooden CAL spreaders had a cast aluminum end fitting in lieu of the stainless. reggie ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com<mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> From: mi… [at] wahini.org<mailto:mi… [at] wahini.org> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 20:51:47 -0600 Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Re: Spreader Fabrication (Rob) Cal-40 Dimensions Rob, I went down to the boat and fished out the extra set of spreaders I made in case my new ones didn't arrive in time for my re-masting last year. They were put together in a hurry and aren't pretty, but they will last at least 10 years in a pinch and I can't see that high up. Anyway, I stayed true to the dimensions of the originals. Here are the pictures with the dimensions 'shopped onto them. Hope this helps... Let me know if the pics don't come through. Sometimes they do, sometimes Yahoo screws it up... Mike Celtic Naut 1965 Cal-40 #44 Spreaders and dimensions. The spreader base. The tip. Ignore the resin globbed all over it. I was in a hurry and then didn't need them. Tip Side view. Base Width. Note Angle of about 10 degrees.

Fin, Not visible in the photos is the fact that all of the bolt holes and the holes for the attachment pins were over-drilled, epoxy filled and then re-drilled to the proper size. This eliminates some of the weakening of the wood. Along those bolt holes were exactly where the original spreaders turned into dust after water intrusion had rotted the area. Mike Fin Beven wrote: > > Mike's pictures highlight an interesting design flaw. Check out the > bolt pattern on the in-board end. The bolts-holes do a nice job of > cutting through most of the wood fibers. > > I was on-board to appreciate the effect this can have. It was 196, > and we were racing Cal-40 #41, > "Kumu" from San Francisco up to Drakes Bay, which involved 30-or-so > miles of up-wind slogging in the ocean. The owner/skipper, Aldo > Alessio (they later name a regatta in his memory), was one of the > best. He took good care of his boat. > > About half-way to Drakes Bay we were headed offshore on starboard > tack. It was time to tack back inshore. We had been hearing an odd > sound, an occasional "thunk", "thunk". Not particularly loud, but > certainly noticeable. Fortunately, one of the crew went forward to > check it out before we were to tack. > > What he saw was pretty alarming. The inboard end of the port-side > spreader had broken free from the mast, and the "thunk" was the > spreader tapping on the mast as we worked through the waves. The > inboard end looked like a pointy-nosed shark had taken a "V" shaped > bite out of it .... right along the bolt pattern. Connect the dots. > > Instead of tacking, we bore off and headed back to San Francisco. No > harm done, and we had new spreaders for the next race 2 weeks later. > > What I learned many years later was that the primary cause of the > failure was the "working" that the leeward spreader does when pounding > to weather. The guy who built my new mast a few years ago strongly > suggested that the rig be set up just tight enough so that the leeward > shrouds are not slack when pounding to weather ... thus eliminating > this stress on the spreader connection at the mast. I believe that > this works fine on keel-stepped rigs, but may not work on deck-stepped > rigs. I also understand that many boats (like Cal-20's) sail faster > with a slack rig. > > Fin Beven > Cal-40 #24 > Radiant > San Pedro, CA > . > >

Howdy, All. I have an analog to Fin's spreader stress lesson. Years ago, I was in a night race in my CAL 25 when one heck of a thunder storm hit. We temporarily dumped jib and reefed main, and just went into reaching mode in the darkness in a direction where we hoped we wouldn't hit anything. In one particularly nasty puff, the boom just split in two - right at the vang. Vang too tight? Maybe, maybe not, but main sheet was flogging. Post mortem said the tang for the vang on the boom had 3 screws on each side in a vertical arrangement (looked a little like a wishbone). Boom split exactly where the screws were. Lesson is that mounted parts should not have multiple attachments along the line of greatest stress in a spar or other rigging element. Might be good to do a boat check to see if you have a lot of lateral screws (or holes) on the side of your mast or vertical screws on the side of your boom. Attachments should be angled to the greatest stress. Just a little note. Cheers Charlie From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Fin Beven Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 2:20 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Re: Spreader Fabrication (Rob) Cal-40 Dimensions Mike's pictures highlight an interesting design flaw. Check out the bolt pattern on the in-board end. The bolts-holes do a nice job of cutting through most of the wood fibers. I was on-board to appreciate the effect this can have. It was 196, and we were racing Cal-40 #41, "Kumu" from San Francisco up to Drakes Bay, which involved 30-or-so miles of up-wind slogging in the ocean. The owner/skipper, Aldo Alessio (they later name a regatta in his memory), was one of the best. He took good care of his boat. About half-way to Drakes Bay we were headed offshore on starboard tack. It was time to tack back inshore. We had been hearing an odd sound, an occasional "thunk", "thunk". Not particularly loud, but certainly noticeable. Fortunately, one of the crew went forward to check it out before we were to tack. What he saw was pretty alarming. The inboard end of the port-side spreader had broken free from the mast, and the "thunk" was the spreader tapping on the mast as we worked through the waves. The inboard end looked like a pointy-nosed shark had taken a "V" shaped bite out of it .... right along the bolt pattern. Connect the dots. Instead of tacking, we bore off and headed back to San Francisco. No harm done, and we had new spreaders for the next race 2 weeks later. What I learned many years later was that the primary cause of the failure was the "working" that the leeward spreader does when pounding to weather. The guy who built my new mast a few years ago strongly suggested that the rig be set up just tight enough so that the leeward shrouds are not slack when pounding to weather ... thus eliminating this stress on the spreader connection at the mast. I believe that this works fine on keel-stepped rigs, but may not work on deck-stepped rigs. I also understand that many boats (like Cal-20's) sail faster with a slack rig. Fin Beven Cal-40 #24 Radiant San Pedro, CA ----- Original Message ----- From: r good <mailto:my… [at] hotmail.com> To: ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 9:30 AM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Re: Spreader Fabrication (Rob) Cal-40 Dimensions some wooden CAL spreaders had a cast aluminum end fitting in lieu of the stainless. reggie To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com From: mi… [at] wahini.org Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 20:51:47 -0600 Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Re: Spreader Fabrication (Rob) Cal-40 Dimensions Rob, I went down to the boat and fished out the extra set of spreaders I made in case my new ones didn't arrive in time for my re-masting last year. They were put together in a hurry and aren't pretty, but they will last at least 10 years in a pinch and I can't see that high up. Anyway, I stayed true to the dimensions of the originals. Here are the pictures with the dimensions 'shopped onto them. Hope this helps... Let me know if the pics don't come through. Sometimes they do, sometimes Yahoo screws it up... Mike Celtic Naut 1965 Cal-40 #44 Spreaders and dimensions. The spreader base. The tip. Ignore the resin globbed all over it. I was in a hurry and then didn't need them. Tip Side view. Base Width. Note Angle of about 10 degrees.