cal20 bulkheads

Greats A while back some one posted questions about the original Cal-20 bulkheads rather then the SS supports. craigslist in portland is showing just such an example. see if interested: http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/boa/1122243206.html -- /ch

Hi All, I have been lurking on the list since I sold Annie, my 2-29. I have been considering the purchase of this Cal 20, have contacted the owner, and am about to make an offer. Any comments on the Cal 20 or this one as it relates to the bulkheads or anything else for that matter. Thanks Chris Bowen San Fransisco Pelican #2298 Camano Island, Wa. -----Original Message----- From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of chris h Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2009 4:37 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads Greats A while back some one posted questions about the original Cal-20 bulkheads rather then the SS supports. craigslist in portland is showing just such an example. see if interested: http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/boa/1122243206.html -- /ch

Cal 20s are wonderful. My comment would be: Congratulations! From: Chris Bowen <ck… [at] wavecable.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 9:02:45 PM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads Hi All, I have been lurking on the list since I sold Annie, my 2-29. I have been considering the purchase of this Cal 20, have contacted the owner, and am about to make an offer. Any comments on the Cal 20 or this one as it relates to the bulkheads or anything else for that matter. Thanks Chris Bowen San Fransisco Pelican #2298 Camano Island, Wa. From: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:Cal_ Boats@yahoogroup s.com]On Behalf Of chris h Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2009 4:37 PM To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads Greats A while back some one posted questions about the original Cal-20 bulkheads rather then the SS supports. craigslist in portland is showing just such an example. see if interested: http://portland. craigslist. org/mlt/boa/ 1122243206. html -- /ch

On Saturday 18 April 2009 14:06:57 Lord Nougat wrote: > Cal 20s are wonderful. My comment would be: Congratulations! Here's a summary of an offline conversation I had with a lad who works at Schooner Creek repairing CAL-20's. There is quite a large fleet up there. One thing that is not in the discussion is the cost of keel bolts. Most of the stuff I need to fix up my boat will be purchased from Steve Seals so I don't mind saying that if you drop the quality of stainless steel on the bolts to one grade lower you save over a 100 bucks and available anywhere. Personally, I don't think it makes a difference if the bolts are properly sealed and routinely checked. The bolts specs are here: http://www.go2marine.com/search.do?q=fasco+screw+30995&x=21&y=13 Fasten All in Canada has the same bolts in a lower quality of SS for 17CDN a piece which means I also don't have to deal with the 20 percent exchange rate. Best of luck, they are very nice boats. BTW...if you do buy a CAL-20 I think you will be either the 4th or 5th Crhis on the list with a CAL-20, its getting rather weird, as Chris's seem to like CAL-20's. Perhaps we should run a pole or something on the yahoo page to see what the names of other owners are on this list with a CAL-20 Enjoy the boat.......she's sweet. -- /ch

I believe that better than SS is monel for Cal 20 keel bolts. ----- Original Message ----- From: chris h To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 11:42 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads On Saturday 18 April 2009 14:06:57 Lord Nougat wrote: > Cal 20s are wonderful. My comment would be: Congratulations! Here's a summary of an offline conversation I had with a lad who works at Schooner Creek repairing CAL-20's. There is quite a large fleet up there. One thing that is not in the discussion is the cost of keel bolts. Most of the stuff I need to fix up my boat will be purchased from Steve Seals so I don't mind saying that if you drop the quality of stainless steel on the bolts to one grade lower you save over a 100 bucks and available anywhere. Personally, I don't think it makes a difference if the bolts are properly sealed and routinely checked. The bolts specs are here: http://www.go2marine.com/search.do?q=fasco+screw+30995&x=21&y=13 Fasten All in Canada has the same bolts in a lower quality of SS for 17CDN a piece which means I also don't have to deal with the 20 percent exchange rate. Best of luck, they are very nice boats. BTW...if you do buy a CAL-20 I think you will be either the 4th or 5th Crhis on the list with a CAL-20, its getting rather weird, as Chris's seem to like CAL-20's. Perhaps we should run a pole or something on the yahoo page to see what the names of other owners are on this list with a CAL-20 Enjoy the boat.......she's sweet. -- /ch __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4018 (20090418) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com

Seriously? Monel can handle those kinds of loads? Either way, I'm considering changing my name to chris. From: Mark Alan Stahnke (MAS Consulting) <ma… [at] cox.net> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 12:57:14 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads  I believe that better than SS is monel for Cal 20 keel bolts. From: chris h To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 11:42 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads On Saturday 18 April 2009 14:06:57 Lord Nougat wrote: > Cal 20s are wonderful. My comment would be: Congratulations! Here's a summary of an offline conversation I had with a lad who works at Schooner Creek repairing CAL-20's. There is quite a large fleet up there. One thing that is not in the discussion is the cost of keel bolts. Most of the stuff I need to fix up my boat will be purchased from Steve Seals so I don't mind saying that if you drop the quality of stainless steel on the bolts to one grade lower you save over a 100 bucks and available anywhere. Personally, I don't think it makes a difference if the bolts are properly sealed and routinely checked. The bolts specs are here: http://www.go2marin e.com/search. do?q=fasco+ screw+30995& x=21&y=13 Fasten All in Canada has the same bolts in a lower quality of SS for 17CDN a piece which means I also don't have to deal with the 20 percent exchange rate. Best of luck, they are very nice boats. BTW...if you do buy a CAL-20 I think you will be either the 4th or 5th Crhis on the list with a CAL-20, its getting rather weird, as Chris's seem to like CAL-20's. Perhaps we should run a pole or something on the yahoo page to see what the names of other owners are on this list with a CAL-20 Enjoy the boat.......she' s sweet. -- /ch __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4018 (20090418) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset. com

I believe that's what we were sold back in the 80's for Cal 20 keel bolt replacement. The keel never did fall off even after going aground a couple of times. They had to be stronger than the rusted out Iron that were replace. ----- Original Message ----- From: Lord Nougat To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 7:16 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads Seriously? Monel can handle those kinds of loads? Either way, I'm considering changing my name to chris. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: Mark Alan Stahnke (MAS Consulting) <ma… [at] cox.net> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 12:57:14 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads  I believe that better than SS is monel for Cal 20 keel bolts. ----- Original Message ----- From: chris h To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2009 11:42 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads On Saturday 18 April 2009 14:06:57 Lord Nougat wrote: > Cal 20s are wonderful. My comment would be: Congratulations! Here's a summary of an offline conversation I had with a lad who works at Schooner Creek repairing CAL-20's. There is quite a large fleet up there. One thing that is not in the discussion is the cost of keel bolts. Most of the stuff I need to fix up my boat will be purchased from Steve Seals so I don't mind saying that if you drop the quality of stainless steel on the bolts to one grade lower you save over a 100 bucks and available anywhere. Personally, I don't think it makes a difference if the bolts are properly sealed and routinely checked. The bolts specs are here: http://www.go2marin e.com/search. do?q=fasco+ screw+30995& x=21&y=13 Fasten All in Canada has the same bolts in a lower quality of SS for 17CDN a piece which means I also don't have to deal with the 20 percent exchange rate. Best of luck, they are very nice boats. BTW...if you do buy a CAL-20 I think you will be either the 4th or 5th Crhis on the list with a CAL-20, its getting rather weird, as Chris's seem to like CAL-20's. Perhaps we should run a pole or something on the yahoo page to see what the names of other owners are on this list with a CAL-20 Enjoy the boat.......she' s sweet. -- /ch __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4018 (20090418) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset. com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4019 (20090418) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com

Chris Bowen wrote: > > > Hi All, > > I have been lurking on the list since I sold Annie, my 2-29. > > I have been considering the purchase of this Cal 20, have contacted > the owner, and am about to make an offer. Any comments on the Cal 20 > or this one as it relates to the bulkheads or anything else for that > matter. I've just read Chris H's advice and it sounds good to me. My Cal 20 is #1220 (1967) and has the twin compression posts under the mast step, not the bulkhead. My boat is pretty much original. Original rudder, keel bolts, deck core, etc. I replaced the spreader brackets with the Steve Seal heavier-guage version. A friend here had his original brackets fail last year just as we were stepping his mast (!). I have not replaced keel bolts but keep thinking that I should do so. My boat has always been in fresh water. The nuts look OK. My boat's deck core is intact, but my friend here had to recore his. He did it the "easy" way (less complex way, maybe). He just cut out the old core, faired up the under side of the deck, then epoxied in a new core from underneath. The guy who sailed his Cal 20 in the Single-Handed Transpac this past year had his new fiberglass rudder break, so he simply replaced it with the original mahogany one. My mahogany one has a sorta foil shape under water but probably not a real , official NACA (?) foil shape. Another weak point is the backstay, which apparently fails often enough to be worrisome. Steve Seal sells a heavier one with the right terminals to fit the existing chainplate and masthead pins. Mine started failing so I bought his bigger one. My boat had the forward lower shroud moved inboard by a previous owner. My boat's collection of sails is a bit motley, but the forward lower isn't the problem--it's the upper and the spreader end that interferes with sail shape on the genoa. These are fantastic little boats. If you haven't read John Vigor's assessment in /Good Old Boat/ magazine or the similar pieces in his book, /Twenty Small Sailboats to Take You Anywhere/, do find it. I love my little boat for her simplicity, for handling well in a blow, and for looking cool. As I say often, she makes me grin with delight when I row away from the mooring. And perhaps you can explain why being named Chris draws one to Cal 20s.... Chris Campbell >

On Monday 20 April 2009 11:49:34 Chris Campbell wrote: > My boat's deck core is intact, but my friend here had to recore his. He > did it the "easy" way (less complex way, maybe). He just cut out the > old core, faired up the under side of the deck, then epoxied in a new > core from underneath. Story goes you need lots of hair nets for this job....:) > The guy who sailed his Cal 20 in the Single-Handed Transpac this past > year had his new fiberglass rudder break, so he simply replaced it with > the original mahogany one. My mahogany one has a sorta foil shape under > water but probably not a real , official NACA (?) foil shape. Check out former Phils foils now Competetive Composites if this interest you. They can build one out of anything and with the US > CDN exchange you 20 percent. http://www.fastcomposites.ca/home.php > Another weak point is the backstay, which apparently fails often enough > to be worrisome. Thanks, was not aware of that issue. > > My boat had the forward lower shroud moved inboard by a previous owner. > My boat's collection of sails is a bit motley, but the forward lower > isn't the problem--it's the upper and the spreader end that interferes > with sail shape on the genoa. Interesting. > And perhaps you can explain why being named Chris draws one to Cal 20s.... What would be really freaky is if everyone was a taurus...:) tks CC. -- /ch

On Monday 20 April 2009 17:23:10 chris h wrote: Here is the last of the conversation with Steve Radner, specifically dealing with keel bolts. This is forwarded with permission. -------------------- The problem is if you are not going to do the keel sandblast epoxy thing until next year you need to look seriously at the bolts this year. Take a hammer and a cold chisel and smack the nuts if it turns out that they are gone you do need to do something about them. We have used a cut off wheel in a grinder to cut them away and then drive the bolts down through the keel. You might find that they have been glassed over at the keel (grind off the glass). It would be possible to simply take some Dolphinite and a little cotton caulking wrapped around the new bolts and drive them back in and tighten the nuts with BIG, THICK washers. I don't get my torque wrench out I just pull as hard as I can with a 1/2" driver and call it good as long as I go around a couple times. Once you start to remove the keel it gets more complex. Sand blast the top and epoxy coat it. Now what to bed it with? 5200 is a SOB if you ever want to get it off again, 4200 or Lifecaulk will work; originally Dolphinite was used for everything on the 20's. If you are very happy with the final epoxy coated fairness of the keel epoxy works to glue it back on. Before you do check that it is straight fore and aft in the boat (some are not) and look at the keel and see how badly it is warped (some have a curve from top to bottom some are twisted) If you are epoxying it on you can shim it with a washer between the hull and keel and the epoxy will fill everything else. When you get all done remember that the sides of the keel to hull can only have a 1/4" radius for fairing but you can fair out the front and back as much as you want. Steve ------------------------eof---------------------- -- /ch

Thanks for the information. It seems that I should be checking the keel bolts above all, and of coarse the standing rigging, which I always seem to replace sometime after acquiring a new to me sailboat. I guess I am drawn to it first because its a Cal, ( cool looking ) and because its simple and much cheaper to keep in a slip and maintain. I like that. I should be looking at it sometime this week. Thanks again. Chris Bowen San Fransisco Pelican #2298 Camano Island,Wa. -----Original Message----- From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Chris Campbell Sent: Monday, April 20, 2009 8:50 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads Chris Bowen wrote: Hi All, I have been lurking on the list since I sold Annie, my 2-29. I have been considering the purchase of this Cal 20, have contacted the owner, and am about to make an offer. Any comments on the Cal 20 or this one as it relates to the bulkheads or anything else for that matter. I've just read Chris H's advice and it sounds good to me. My Cal 20 is #1220 (1967) and has the twin compression posts under the mast step, not the bulkhead. My boat is pretty much original. Original rudder, keel bolts, deck core, etc. I replaced the spreader brackets with the Steve Seal heavier-guage version. A friend here had his original brackets fail last year just as we were stepping his mast (!). I have not replaced keel bolts but keep thinking that I should do so. My boat has always been in fresh water. The nuts look OK. My boat's deck core is intact, but my friend here had to recore his. He did it the "easy" way (less complex way, maybe). He just cut out the old core, faired up the under side of the deck, then epoxied in a new core from underneath. The guy who sailed his Cal 20 in the Single-Handed Transpac this past year had his new fiberglass rudder break, so he simply replaced it with the original mahogany one. My mahogany one has a sorta foil shape under water but probably not a real , official NACA (?) foil shape. Another weak point is the backstay, which apparently fails often enough to be worrisome. Steve Seal sells a heavier one with the right terminals to fit the existing chainplate and masthead pins. Mine started failing so I bought his bigger one. My boat had the forward lower shroud moved inboard by a previous owner. My boat's collection of sails is a bit motley, but the forward lower isn't the problem--it's the upper and the spreader end that interferes with sail shape on the genoa. These are fantastic little boats. If you haven't read John Vigor's assessment in Good Old Boat magazine or the similar pieces in his book, Twenty Small Sailboats to Take You Anywhere, do find it. I love my little boat for her simplicity, for handling well in a blow, and for looking cool. As I say often, she makes me grin with delight when I row away from the mooring. And perhaps you can explain why being named Chris draws one to Cal 20s.... Chris Campbell

My backstay seems fine... but Steve Seal has me worrying about my weak little spreader brackets every time we have any bit of real weather here in paradise [San Pedro CA] From: chris h <ch… [at] magma.ca> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, April 20, 2009 2:23:10 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] cal20 bulkheads On Monday 20 April 2009 11:49:34 Chris Campbell wrote: > My boat's deck core is intact, but my friend here had to recore his. He > did it the "easy" way (less complex way, maybe). He just cut out the > old core, faired up the under side of the deck, then epoxied in a new > core from underneath. Story goes you need lots of hair nets for this job....:) > The guy who sailed his Cal 20 in the Single-Handed Transpac this past > year had his new fiberglass rudder break, so he simply replaced it with > the original mahogany one. My mahogany one has a sorta foil shape under > water but probably not a real , official NACA (?) foil shape. Check out former Phils foils now Competetive Composites if this interest you. They can build one out of anything and with the US > CDN exchange you 20 percent. http://www.fastcomposites.ca/home.php > Another weak point is the backstay, which apparently fails often enough > to be worrisome. Thanks, was not aware of that issue. > > My boat had the forward lower shroud moved inboard by a previous owner. > My boat's collection of sails is a bit motley, but the forward lower > isn't the problem--it' s the upper and the spreader end that interferes > with sail shape on the genoa. Interesting. > And perhaps you can explain why being named Chris draws one to Cal 20s.... What would be really freaky is if everyone was a taurus...:) tks CC. -- /ch

On Monday 20 April 2009 23:03:14 Chris Bowen wrote: > I guess I am drawn to it first because its a Cal, ( cool looking ) and > because its simple and much cheaper to keep in a slip and maintain. I like > that. If you read the sails literature these are two of the design criteria. The third was to be a top notch SFBay sailing vessel given the wind conditions. Seems those design criteria were met in spades as it still attracts people today. > I should be looking at it sometime this week. Best of luck -- /ch

Lord Nougat wrote: > > > My backstay seems fine... but Steve Seal has me worrying about my weak > little spreader brackets every time we have any bit of real weather > here in paradise [San Pedro CA] Let me reiterate: my friend's spreader bracket broke off as we were just getting ready to push the mast up last spring--you know, doing the final check of rigging to make sure nothing was snagged, and a spreader just fell off. So you should worry. Buy a set of Steve's nice heavy-duty brackets. And the backstay...mine started going with one strand broken & unravelling. It seemed fine, too, until that moment. These are known weak design points, which is why Steve sells the heavier versions. Chris Campbell > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > **