Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Timmothy)

I looked at another one of those programs called "Local Knowledge" They probably compete. Thanks for letting me know what it was. I really appreciate you giving me the link. It is probably overkill for what I do however. Most of my photography is nature but I did take a thousand shots or so at the Big Boat Series this year and that one of Samba Pa Ti and the GG Bridge was one of my favorites although most were close ups of the boats. http://paloaltophoto.com/ and http://www.flickr.com/photos/62843340@N00/ I sell my largest prints for about half what you said the program sells for. As far as current, I am pretty happy with what I have put together. http://l-36.com/current/09110314.png This represents the stitching together of about 35 of these http://sfports.wr.usgs.gov/cgi-bin/SFPORTS/zoom_cb.cgi?x=190&y=282 This particular file on the L-36 site above is two hours before max ebb. Compare that to the one in the tide book some time. The SFPORTS one is always the latest time period. Anyway, thanks for getting back to me with the information. Allen On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 2:54 PM, <ti… [at] ch2m.com> wrote: > > > > The program is Expedition. It is @ $1,000 maybe more... I've had it for 4 years. > > Nick constantly updates it with more stuff-devices-features. > > The primary purpose is a racing -optimized routing software. > > Using Charts, Polars. current, wind it predicts the fastest way to complete a race course. > > It does best in a macro level, as that is where the data points are... but we use it on offshore races of @ 90 miles or so, for input. > > Nick may be open to barter... it is his business. > > His software is the "Swiss army knife of yacht racing and tactics. > > From his website: http://www.iexpedition.org/index.htm > > About Expedition > > Expedition is simply the best tactical and navigation software available. Expedition supports more instrument systems, is easier to use and has the most powerful and useful functions for the racing navigator. > > Expedition has been developed by veteran Volvo Ocean Race navigator and Whitbread winner, physicist Nick White, initially for his use in the 2001-2 Volvo Ocean Race with Team News Corp and the Stars & Stripes Americas Cup team. > > Since then, Expedition has been continually refined by a core group of world-renowned navigators and two-time America’s Cup winning navigator Peter Isler has consulted closely in the development of the system > > The end result is a system that wins more races and is far more advanced and usable in all aspects than any other tactical software available - whether you are racing around the world or your local harbour. > > Features > > Requires Windows 2000, XP or Vista > > XP or Vista preferred. > > Chart-plotter that seamlessly rotates, mosaics and moves between charts, > > C-Map NT & MAX, > > Maptech PCX, > > Bsb charts, including v4 and v5, > > Softcharts, > > NV-verlag > > Day, dusk and night display modes. > > Advanced weather display and tools, > > Integrated PredictWind, Saildocs and Ocens weather services, > > Sophisticated display options, > > Intelligent merge of multiple grib file datasets. > > Simply the best weather routing available, > > Display multiple optimum routes, > > Optimal routes for fleet, > > Reverse isochrone function for graphical interpretation of routing. > > Start display and advanced buoy racing functions, > > What if? functionality, > > Instrument calibration > > Time to marks, laylines etc, > > Start line functions > > Time to ends & line, > > Time to burn, > > Hold wind, > > Display grid > > Rate of turn and acceleration, > > Line bias, > > ... > > ... > > Tides and currents, > > Instrument input and output functions to exchange data with all popular instrument systems, including polars and calibration values > > AIS receivers, > > B&G, > > Koden radar, > > KVH Quadro, > > Nexus NX2, FDX and NXR, > > NKE > > NMEA 0183, > > NMEA 2000, > > Ockam, > > Racing Bravo (as used by the leading Americas Cup teams), > > Tacktick, > > Various compasses, lasers and other sensors. > > Stripchart program to graph and analyse any instrument function, > > Displays marks, courses, laylines, track, AIS targets, race schedule information etc. on the chart, > > Polar functions to output, analyse and create or modify a yacht’s performance polars, > > Race schedule functions to track and analyse competitors, > > Simple handicap support, > > Logging functions to record race data that can be replayed or analysed later to assist with instrument calibration or polar modifications, > > Google Earth interfacing, > > Networking support. > > ... and much more! > > > ________________________________ > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Allen Edwards > Sent: Monday, November 02, 2009 5:10 PM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Mike) > > > > Where did you get that program? It looks most interesting. I am > gathering some charts from PORTS and have one for the same time and > they compare well. You can see my chart at > http://l-36.com/current/09110213.png > > Perhaps I can interest him in a nice big print of Samba Pa Ti against > the GG Bridge as an exchange for his software??? :-) > http://www.flickr.com/photos/62843340@N00/3940305948/ I can print > that up to 16x24. > > Regarding your advice and that of others. I sail in the south bay. I > only get into the central bay were I do these classic races when I do > the races. For example, the leg from Little Harding to Blackhauler > via Yellow Bluff. I took that route for the first time last year. > After the race I asked my opponent how he knew when to make the turn. > He gave me some technical stuff about wind shifts and then said that > he had an advantage on me there because he has raced that leg 1000 > times. I agree with what everyone says about experience but let me > tell another story. > > We had a leg from Harding Rock to Blossom. Alcatraz in exactly in the > way so you can go in front or behind it. We didn't know but we had a > rather huge lead at that point. We sailed right at the island and > were about 1/3 of the way there before they rounded the mark, about > 2/3 before we saw that they were going out. So, we went out as well. > But by then we were close to the island and they went out. We decided > to head to the mark, perhaps a mistake, and the caught us, we got > tricky and missed the mark and had to do a 360 turn. The tricky was > our only shot of beating them at that point but it didn't work. We > took 2nd. > > The other time, we had no reason to think they would go close to shore > as the current chart we had said stronger close to shore and all the > other boats in other classes went out. We had a huge lead and were > way out by the time we saw they were in to shore. I told the skipper > of the other boat our mistake was not covering. He said "Hard to > cover when you are so far ahead". I see now from the detailed charts > that I am getting that almost no current close to shore and were we > were was probably the maximum with less out even further. So, they > had a 2 kt speed advantage and passed us. > > Had I know to go in to the shore, I would have stayed between them and > the next mark as that was our strategy. We just didn't follow it and > mainly because we didn't know the current. > > So, every race I come away with something I need to do. This time it > is get a better handle on the current. > > Allen > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 10:37 AM, <ti… [at] ch2m.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > I have current predictions for San Francisco, developed by Nick White a "Famous" naviguesser and tactician. > > > > He's participated on (and won) America's Cup, Volvo Races and regularly races on Samba Pi Ti, the famous racer out of SF. > > > > I can print out screen shots of any days/time you want. Here's 2pm today. > > > > Also, please consider this advice. If your competition is a similar rating boat, strongly consider learning boat to boat tactics. > > > > In other words, race the other boat, not the conditions. > > > > If you can cover them it does not really matter the conditions or local knowledge. > > _ > >

Allen, Those are some incredible photos! It never seems to amaze me as the diversity of Cal sailor backgrounds. I wouldn't be surprised if we have a rocket scientist and/or a Nobel prize winner. --Michael-- --- On Tue, 11/3/09, Allen Edwards <al… [at] PaloAltoPhoto.com> wrote: From: Allen Edwards <al… [at] PaloAltoPhoto.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Timmothy) To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, November 3, 2009, 7:54 PM I looked at another one of those programs called "Local Knowledge" They probably compete. Thanks for letting me know what it was. I really appreciate you giving me the link. It is probably overkill for what I do however. Most of my photography is nature but I did take a thousand shots or so at the Big Boat Series this year and that one of Samba Pa Ti and the GG Bridge was one of my favorites although most were close ups of the boats. http://paloaltophot o.com/ and http://www.flickr. com/photos/ 62843340@ N00/ I sell my largest prints for about half what you said the program sells for. As far as current, I am pretty happy with what I have put together. http://l-36. com/current/ 09110314. png This represents the stitching together of about 35 of these http://sfports. wr.usgs.gov/ cgi-bin/SFPORTS/ zoom_cb.cgi? x=190&y=282 This particular file on the L-36 site above is two hours before max ebb. Compare that to the one in the tide book some time. The SFPORTS one is always the latest time period. Anyway, thanks for getting back to me with the information. Allen On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 2:54 PM, <timmothy.lessley@ ch2m.com> wrote: > > > > The program is Expedition. It is @ $1,000 maybe more... I've had it for 4 years. > > Nick constantly updates it with more stuff-devices- features. > > The primary purpose is a racing -optimized routing software. > > Using Charts, Polars. current, wind it predicts the fastest way to complete a race course. > > It does best in a macro level, as that is where the data points are... but we use it on offshore races of @ 90 miles or so, for input. > > Nick may be open to barter... it is his business. > > His software is the "Swiss army knife of yacht racing and tactics. > > From his website: http://www.iexpedit ion.org/index. htm > > About Expedition > > Expedition is simply the best tactical and navigation software available. Expedition supports more instrument systems, is easier to use and has the most powerful and useful functions for the racing navigator. > > Expedition has been developed by veteran Volvo Ocean Race navigator and Whitbread winner, physicist Nick White, initially for his use in the 2001-2 Volvo Ocean Race with Team News Corp and the Stars & Stripes Americas Cup team. > > Since then, Expedition has been continually refined by a core group of world-renowned navigators and two-time America’s Cup winning navigator Peter Isler has consulted closely in the development of the system > > The end result is a system that wins more races and is far more advanced and usable in all aspects than any other tactical software available - whether you are racing around the world or your local harbour. > > Features > > Requires Windows 2000, XP or Vista > > XP or Vista preferred. > > Chart-plotter that seamlessly rotates, mosaics and moves between charts, > > C-Map NT & MAX, > > Maptech PCX, > > Bsb charts, including v4 and v5, > > Softcharts, > > NV-verlag > > Day, dusk and night display modes. > > Advanced weather display and tools, > > Integrated PredictWind, Saildocs and Ocens weather services, > > Sophisticated display options, > > Intelligent merge of multiple grib file datasets. > > Simply the best weather routing available, > > Display multiple optimum routes, > > Optimal routes for fleet, > > Reverse isochrone function for graphical interpretation of routing. > > Start display and advanced buoy racing functions, > > What if? functionality, > > Instrument calibration > > Time to marks, laylines etc, > > Start line functions > > Time to ends & line, > > Time to burn, > > Hold wind, > > Display grid > > Rate of turn and acceleration, > > Line bias, > > ... > > ... > > Tides and currents, > > Instrument input and output functions to exchange data with all popular instrument systems, including polars and calibration values > > AIS receivers, > > B&G, > > Koden radar, > > KVH Quadro, > > Nexus NX2, FDX and NXR, > > NKE > > NMEA 0183, > > NMEA 2000, > > Ockam, > > Racing Bravo (as used by the leading Americas Cup teams), > > Tacktick, > > Various compasses, lasers and other sensors. > > Stripchart program to graph and analyse any instrument function, > > Displays marks, courses, laylines, track, AIS targets, race schedule information etc. on the chart, > > Polar functions to output, analyse and create or modify a yacht’s performance polars, > > Race schedule functions to track and analyse competitors, > > Simple handicap support, > > Logging functions to record race data that can be replayed or analysed later to assist with instrument calibration or polar modifications, > > Google Earth interfacing, > > Networking support. > > ... and much more! > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > From: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com] On Behalf Of Allen Edwards > Sent: Monday, November 02, 2009 5:10 PM > To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Mike) > > > > Where did you get that program? It looks most interesting. I am > gathering some charts from PORTS and have one for the same time and > they compare well. You can see my chart at > http://l-36. com/current/ 09110213. png > > Perhaps I can interest him in a nice big print of Samba Pa Ti against > the GG Bridge as an exchange for his software??? :-) > http://www.flickr. com/photos/ 62843340@ N00/3940305948/ I can print > that up to 16x24. > > Regarding your advice and that of others. I sail in the south bay. I > only get into the central bay were I do these classic races when I do > the races. For example, the leg from Little Harding to Blackhauler > via Yellow Bluff. I took that route for the first time last year. > After the race I asked my opponent how he knew when to make the turn. > He gave me some technical stuff about wind shifts and then said that > he had an advantage on me there because he has raced that leg 1000 > times. I agree with what everyone says about experience but let me > tell another story. > > We had a leg from Harding Rock to Blossom. Alcatraz in exactly in the > way so you can go in front or behind it. We didn't know but we had a > rather huge lead at that point. We sailed right at the island and > were about 1/3 of the way there before they rounded the mark, about > 2/3 before we saw that they were going out. So, we went out as well. > But by then we were close to the island and they went out. We decided > to head to the mark, perhaps a mistake, and the caught us, we got > tricky and missed the mark and had to do a 360 turn. The tricky was > our only shot of beating them at that point but it didn't work. We > took 2nd. > > The other time, we had no reason to think they would go close to shore > as the current chart we had said stronger close to shore and all the > other boats in other classes went out. We had a huge lead and were > way out by the time we saw they were in to shore. I told the skipper > of the other boat our mistake was not covering. He said "Hard to > cover when you are so far ahead". I see now from the detailed charts > that I am getting that almost no current close to shore and were we > were was probably the maximum with less out even further. So, they > had a 2 kt speed advantage and passed us. > > Had I know to go in to the shore, I would have stayed between them and > the next mark as that was our strategy. We just didn't follow it and > mainly because we didn't know the current. > > So, every race I come away with something I need to do. This time it > is get a better handle on the current. > > Allen > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 10:37 AM, <timmothy.lessley@ ch2m.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > I have current predictions for San Francisco, developed by Nick White a "Famous" naviguesser and tactician. > > > > He's participated on (and won) America's Cup, Volvo Races and regularly races on Samba Pi Ti, the famous racer out of SF. > > > > I can print out screen shots of any days/time you want. Here's 2pm today. > > > > Also, please consider this advice. If your competition is a similar rating boat, strongly consider learning boat to boat tactics. > > > > In other words, race the other boat, not the conditions. > > > > If you can cover them it does not really matter the conditions or local knowledge. > > _ > >

Thanks! On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 5:04 PM, Michael D <md… [at] yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > Allen, > > Those are some incredible photos! It never seems to amaze me as the diversity of Cal sailor backgrounds. I wouldn't be surprised if we have a rocket scientist and/or a Nobel prize winner. > > --Michael-- > > --- On Tue, 11/3/09, Allen Edwards <al… [at] PaloAltoPhoto.com> wrote: > > From: Allen Edwards <al… [at] PaloAltoPhoto.com> > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Timmothy) > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Date: Tuesday, November 3, 2009, 7:54 PM > > > > I looked at another one of those programs called "Local Knowledge" They probably compete. Thanks for letting me know what it was. I really appreciate you giving me the link. It is probably overkill for what I do however. > > Most of my photography is nature but I did take a thousand shots or so at the Big Boat Series this year and that one of Samba Pa Ti and the GG Bridge was one of my favorites although most were close ups of the boats. http://paloaltophot o.com/ and http://www.flickr. com/photos/ 62843340@ N00/ I sell my largest prints for about half what you said the program sells for. > > As far as current, I am pretty happy with what I have put together. > http://l-36. com/current/ 09110314. png This represents the stitching together of about 35 of these http://sfports. wr.usgs.gov/ cgi-bin/SFPORTS/ zoom_cb.cgi? x=190&y=282 > > This particular file on the L-36 site above is two hours before max ebb. Compare that to the one in the tide book some time. The SFPORTS one is always the latest time period. > > Anyway, thanks for getting back to me with the information. > > Allen > > On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 2:54 PM, <timmothy.lessley@ ch2m.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > The program is Expedition. It is @ $1,000 maybe more... I've had it for 4 years. > > > > Nick constantly updates it with more stuff-devices- features. > > > > The primary purpose is a racing -optimized routing software. > > > > Using Charts, Polars. current, wind it predicts the fastest way to complete a race course. > > > > It does best in a macro level, as that is where the data points are... but we use it on offshore races of @ 90 miles or so, for input. > > > > Nick may be open to barter... it is his business. > > > > His software is the "Swiss army knife of yacht racing and tactics. > > > > From his website: http://www.iexpedit ion.org/index. htm > > > > About Expedition > > > > Expedition is simply the best tactical and navigation software available. Expedition supports more instrument systems, is easier to use and has the most powerful and useful functions for the racing navigator. > > > > Expedition has been developed by veteran Volvo Ocean Race navigator and Whitbread winner, physicist Nick White, initially for his use in the 2001-2 Volvo Ocean Race with Team News Corp and the Stars & Stripes Americas Cup team. > > > > Since then, Expedition has been continually refined by a core group of world-renowned navigators and two-time America’s Cup winning navigator Peter Isler has consulted closely in the development of the system > > > > The end result is a system that wins more races and is far more advanced and usable in all aspects than any other tactical software available - whether you are racing around the world or your local harbour. > > > > Features > > > > Requires Windows 2000, XP or Vista > > > > XP or Vista preferred. > > > > Chart-plotter that seamlessly rotates, mosaics and moves between charts, > > > > C-Map NT & MAX, > > > > Maptech PCX, > > > > Bsb charts, including v4 and v5, > > > > Softcharts, > > > > NV-verlag > > > > Day, dusk and night display modes. > > > > Advanced weather display and tools, > > > > Integrated PredictWind, Saildocs and Ocens weather services, > > > > Sophisticated display options, > > > > Intelligent merge of multiple grib file datasets. > > > > Simply the best weather routing available, > > > > Display multiple optimum routes, > > > > Optimal routes for fleet, > > > > Reverse isochrone function for graphical interpretation of routing. > > > > Start display and advanced buoy racing functions, > > > > What if? functionality, > > > > Instrument calibration > > > > Time to marks, laylines etc, > > > > Start line functions > > > > Time to ends & line, > > > > Time to burn, > > > > Hold wind, > > > > Display grid > > > > Rate of turn and acceleration, > > > > Line bias, > > > > ... > > > > ... > > > > Tides and currents, > > > > Instrument input and output functions to exchange data with all popular instrument systems, including polars and calibration values > > > > AIS receivers, > > > > B&G, > > > > Koden radar, > > > > KVH Quadro, > > > > Nexus NX2, FDX and NXR, > > > > NKE > > > > NMEA 0183, > > > > NMEA 2000, > > > > Ockam, > > > > Racing Bravo (as used by the leading Americas Cup teams), > > > > Tacktick, > > > > Various compasses, lasers and other sensors. > > > > Stripchart program to graph and analyse any instrument function, > > > > Displays marks, courses, laylines, track, AIS targets, race schedule information etc. on the chart, > > > > Polar functions to output, analyse and create or modify a yacht’s performance polars, > > > > Race schedule functions to track and analyse competitors, > > > > Simple handicap support, > > > > Logging functions to record race data that can be replayed or analysed later to assist with instrument calibration or polar modifications, > > > > Google Earth interfacing, > > > > Networking support. > > > > ... and much more! > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > > From: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com] On Behalf Of Allen Edwards > > Sent: Monday, November 02, 2009 5:10 PM > > To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com > > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Mike) > > > > > > > > Where did you get that program? It looks most interesting. I am > > gathering some charts from PORTS and have one for the same time and > > they compare well. You can see my chart at > > http://l-36. com/current/ 09110213. png > > > > Perhaps I can interest him in a nice big print of Samba Pa Ti against > > the GG Bridge as an exchange for his software??? :-) > > http://www.flickr. com/photos/ 62843340@ N00/3940305948/ I can print > > that up to 16x24. > > > > Regarding your advice and that of others. I sail in the south bay. I > > only get into the central bay were I do these classic races when I do > > the races. For example, the leg from Little Harding to Blackhauler > > via Yellow Bluff. I took that route for the first time last year. > > After the race I asked my opponent how he knew when to make the turn. > > He gave me some technical stuff about wind shifts and then said that > > he had an advantage on me there because he has raced that leg 1000 > > times. I agree with what everyone says about experience but let me > > tell another story. > > > > We had a leg from Harding Rock to Blossom. Alcatraz in exactly in the > > way so you can go in front or behind it. We didn't know but we had a > > rather huge lead at that point. We sailed right at the island and > > were about 1/3 of the way there before they rounded the mark, about > > 2/3 before we saw that they were going out. So, we went out as well. > > But by then we were close to the island and they went out. We decided > > to head to the mark, perhaps a mistake, and the caught us, we got > > tricky and missed the mark and had to do a 360 turn. The tricky was > > our only shot of beating them at that point but it didn't work. We > > took 2nd. > > > > The other time, we had no reason to think they would go close to shore > > as the current chart we had said stronger close to shore and all the > > other boats in other classes went out. We had a huge lead and were > > way out by the time we saw they were in to shore. I told the skipper > > of the other boat our mistake was not covering. He said "Hard to > > cover when you are so far ahead". I see now from the detailed charts > > that I am getting that almost no current close to shore and were we > > were was probably the maximum with less out even further. So, they > > had a 2 kt speed advantage and passed us. > > > > Had I know to go in to the shore, I would have stayed between them and > > the next mark as that was our strategy. We just didn't follow it and > > mainly because we didn't know the current. > > > > So, every race I come away with something I need to do. This time it > > is get a better handle on the current. > > > > Allen > > > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 10:37 AM, <timmothy.lessley@ ch2m.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I have current predictions for San Francisco, developed by Nick White a "Famous" naviguesser and tactician. > > > > > > He's participated on (and won) America's Cup, Volvo Races and regularly races on Samba Pi Ti, the famous racer out of SF. > > > > > > I can print out screen shots of any days/time you want. Here's 2pm today. > > > > > > Also, please consider this advice. If your competition is a similar rating boat, strongly consider learning boat to boat tactics. > > > > > > In other words, race the other boat, not the conditions. > > > > > > If you can cover them it does not really matter the conditions or local knowledge. > > > _ > > > > > >

Allen, Local Knowledge does get some high marks from one sailor I know (Jim Quanci a Cal 40 sailor), but his "complaint" is that it is a Dos-like old school type program... a bit on the nerdy side to operate. I've read the website a number of times and cannot figure out the program - or what version to buy... so I took Stan Honey's advice and got Expedition. (Stan also uses "Deckman". ) The Local Knowledge guys did do a nice write-up on California Girl (using Expedition) crushing the other Cal 40 (using Local Knowledge) by 21 hours in the 2006 Pacific Cup, implying that we too were "using Local Knowledge" information. THe fun part of Expedition, after the initial "gulp" of paying for it, is hooking it into the instruments and logging a race. It gives you real time feedback on how well you are maintaining the polar speeds and the effects of current. As it logs, the program draws your snail trail, with the wind and current effects attached to the trail, so you can easily determine what the boat is doing, and the effect of sail trim. You can replay the race and critique what you did (or did not do). Oddly - as I was typing this, Nick emailed me.. I told him about your photo of Samba... maybe the stage is set? I'll see what his comment is.. BTW Nick lives in New Zealand. Kind Regards, Timm From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Allen Edwards Sent: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 4:54 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Timmothy) I looked at another one of those programs called "Local Knowledge" They probably compete. Thanks for letting me know what it was. I really appreciate you giving me the link. It is probably overkill for what I do however. Most of my photography is nature but I did take a thousand shots or so at the Big Boat Series this year and that one of Samba Pa Ti and the GG Bridge was one of my favorites although most were close ups of the boats. http://paloaltophoto.com/ and http://www.flickr.com/photos/62843340@N00/ I sell my largest prints for about half what you said the program sells for. As far as current, I am pretty happy with what I have put together. http://l-36.com/current/09110314.png This represents the stitching together of about 35 of these http://sfports.wr.usgs.gov/cgi-bin/SFPORTS/zoom_cb.cgi?x=190&y=282 This particular file on the L-36 site above is two hours before max ebb. Compare that to the one in the tide book some time. The SFPORTS one is always the latest time period. Anyway, thanks for getting back to me with the information. Allen On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 2:54 PM, <ti… [at] ch2m.com<mailto:ti… [at] ch2m.com>> wrote: > > > > The program is Expedition. It is @ $1,000 maybe more... I've had it for 4 years. > > Nick constantly updates it with more stuff-devices-features. > > The primary purpose is a racing -optimized routing software. > > Using Charts, Polars. current, wind it predicts the fastest way to complete a race course. > > It does best in a macro level, as that is where the data points are... but we use it on offshore races of @ 90 miles or so, for input. > > Nick may be open to barter... it is his business. > > His software is the "Swiss army knife of yacht racing and tactics. > > From his website: http://www.iexpedition.org/index.htm > > About Expedition > > Expedition is simply the best tactical and navigation software available. Expedition supports more instrument systems, is easier to use and has the most powerful and useful functions for the racing navigator. > > Expedition has been developed by veteran Volvo Ocean Race navigator and Whitbread winner, physicist Nick White, initially for his use in the 2001-2 Volvo Ocean Race with Team News Corp and the Stars & Stripes Americas Cup team. > > Since then, Expedition has been continually refined by a core group of world-renowned navigators and two-time America's Cup winning navigator Peter Isler has consulted closely in the development of the system > > The end result is a system that wins more races and is far more advanced and usable in all aspects than any other tactical software available - whether you are racing around the world or your local harbour. > > Features > > Requires Windows 2000, XP or Vista > > XP or Vista preferred. > > Chart-plotter that seamlessly rotates, mosaics and moves between charts, > > C-Map NT & MAX, > > Maptech PCX, > > Bsb charts, including v4 and v5, > > Softcharts, > > NV-verlag > > Day, dusk and night display modes. > > Advanced weather display and tools, > > Integrated PredictWind, Saildocs and Ocens weather services, > > Sophisticated display options, > > Intelligent merge of multiple grib file datasets. > > Simply the best weather routing available, > > Display multiple optimum routes, > > Optimal routes for fleet, > > Reverse isochrone function for graphical interpretation of routing. > > Start display and advanced buoy racing functions, > > What if? functionality, > > Instrument calibration > > Time to marks, laylines etc, > > Start line functions > > Time to ends & line, > > Time to burn, > > Hold wind, > > Display grid > > Rate of turn and acceleration, > > Line bias, > > ... > > ... > > Tides and currents, > > Instrument input and output functions to exchange data with all popular instrument systems, including polars and calibration values > > AIS receivers, > > B&G, > > Koden radar, > > KVH Quadro, > > Nexus NX2, FDX and NXR, > > NKE > > NMEA 0183, > > NMEA 2000, > > Ockam, > > Racing Bravo (as used by the leading Americas Cup teams), > > Tacktick, > > Various compasses, lasers and other sensors. > > Stripchart program to graph and analyse any instrument function, > > Displays marks, courses, laylines, track, AIS targets, race schedule information etc. on the chart, > > Polar functions to output, analyse and create or modify a yacht's performance polars, > > Race schedule functions to track and analyse competitors, > > Simple handicap support, > > Logging functions to record race data that can be replayed or analysed later to assist with instrument calibration or polar modifications, > > Google Earth interfacing, > > Networking support. > > ... and much more! > > > ________________________________ > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com<mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com<mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>] On Behalf Of Allen Edwards > Sent: Monday, November 02, 2009 5:10 PM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com<mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Mike) > > > > Where did you get that program? It looks most interesting. I am > gathering some charts from PORTS and have one for the same time and > they compare well. You can see my chart at > http://l-36.com/current/09110213.png > > Perhaps I can interest him in a nice big print of Samba Pa Ti against > the GG Bridge as an exchange for his software??? :-) > http://www.flickr.com/photos/62843340@N00/3940305948/ I can print > that up to 16x24. > > Regarding your advice and that of others. I sail in the south bay. I > only get into the central bay were I do these classic races when I do > the races. For example, the leg from Little Harding to Blackhauler > via Yellow Bluff. I took that route for the first time last year. > After the race I asked my opponent how he knew when to make the turn. > He gave me some technical stuff about wind shifts and then said that > he had an advantage on me there because he has raced that leg 1000 > times. I agree with what everyone says about experience but let me > tell another story. > > We had a leg from Harding Rock to Blossom. Alcatraz in exactly in the > way so you can go in front or behind it. We didn't know but we had a > rather huge lead at that point. We sailed right at the island and > were about 1/3 of the way there before they rounded the mark, about > 2/3 before we saw that they were going out. So, we went out as well. > But by then we were close to the island and they went out. We decided > to head to the mark, perhaps a mistake, and the caught us, we got > tricky and missed the mark and had to do a 360 turn. The tricky was > our only shot of beating them at that point but it didn't work. We > took 2nd. > > The other time, we had no reason to think they would go close to shore > as the current chart we had said stronger close to shore and all the > other boats in other classes went out. We had a huge lead and were > way out by the time we saw they were in to shore. I told the skipper > of the other boat our mistake was not covering. He said "Hard to > cover when you are so far ahead". I see now from the detailed charts > that I am getting that almost no current close to shore and were we > were was probably the maximum with less out even further. So, they > had a 2 kt speed advantage and passed us. > > Had I know to go in to the shore, I would have stayed between them and > the next mark as that was our strategy. We just didn't follow it and > mainly because we didn't know the current. > > So, every race I come away with something I need to do. This time it > is get a better handle on the current. > > Allen > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 10:37 AM, <ti… [at] ch2m.com<mailto:ti… [at] ch2m.com>> wrote: > > > > > > > > I have current predictions for San Francisco, developed by Nick White a "Famous" naviguesser and tactician. > > > > He's participated on (and won) America's Cup, Volvo Races and regularly races on Samba Pi Ti, the famous racer out of SF. > > > > I can print out screen shots of any days/time you want. Here's 2pm today. > > > > Also, please consider this advice. If your competition is a similar rating boat, strongly consider learning boat to boat tactics. > > > > In other words, race the other boat, not the conditions. > > > > If you can cover them it does not really matter the conditions or local knowledge. > > _ > >

I too could not figure out what the price would be or what the differences in versions were on Local Knowledge. The guy I am racing against, David James, has been very helpful and suggested it when I was asking about getting local current information. He also mentioned Kame's lecture which I will attend in March. I don't have much in the way of instruments, just a GPS that I like very much and of a very old knot meter and a compass. This is an old boat, not new like the Cal-40 ;-) By the way, David is the tactician on Expeditious and that was the crew I was racing against. He is very good but equally as helpful to me when I ask him questions. A real gentleman. He even thanked me when I made that stupid mistake that handed him the first race. Speaking of TP-52's, my mainsheet trimmer has a friend with one in San Diego. They were in the Transpac and sounds like they almost lost it (literally). We have been promised a ride and I am looking forward to it. The problem is finding a time when there is wind and the boat isn't getting ready for a race. Allen On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 5:34 PM, <ti… [at] ch2m.com> wrote: > > > > Allen, > > Local Knowledge does get some high marks from one sailor I know (Jim Quanci a Cal 40 sailor), but his "complaint" is that it is a Dos-like old school type program... a bit on the nerdy side to operate. > > I've read the website a number of times and cannot figure out the program - or what version to buy... so I took Stan Honey's advice and got Expedition. (Stan also uses "Deckman". ) > > The Local Knowledge guys did do a nice write-up on California Girl (using Expedition) crushing the other Cal 40 (using Local Knowledge) by 21 hours in the 2006 Pacific Cup, implying that we too were "using Local Knowledge" information. > > THe fun part of Expedition, after the initial "gulp" of paying for it, is hooking it into the instruments and logging a race. It gives you real time feedback on how well you are maintaining the polar speeds and the effects of current. > > As it logs, the program draws your snail trail, with the wind and current effects attached to the trail, so you can easily determine what the boat is doing, and the effect of sail trim. > > You can replay the race and critique what you did (or did not do). > > Oddly - as I was typing this, Nick emailed me.. I told him about your photo of Samba... maybe the stage is set? I'll see what his comment is.. BTW Nick lives in New Zealand. > > Kind Regards, > > Timm > ________________________________ > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Allen Edwards > Sent: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 4:54 PM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Timmothy) > > > > I looked at another one of those programs called "Local Knowledge" They probably compete. Thanks for letting me know what it was. I really appreciate you giving me the link. It is probably overkill for what I do however. > > Most of my photography is nature but I did take a thousand shots or so at the Big Boat Series this year and that one of Samba Pa Ti and the GG Bridge was one of my favorites although most were close ups of the boats. http://paloaltophoto.com/ and http://www.flickr.com/photos/62843340@N00/ I sell my largest prints for about half what you said the program sells for. > > As far as current, I am pretty happy with what I have put together. > http://l-36.com/current/09110314.png This represents the stitching together of about 35 of these http://sfports.wr.usgs.gov/cgi-bin/SFPORTS/zoom_cb.cgi?x=190&y=282 > > This particular file on the L-36 site above is two hours before max ebb. Compare that to the one in the tide book some time. The SFPORTS one is always the latest time period. > > Anyway, thanks for getting back to me with the information. > Allen > > On Tue, Nov 3, 2009 at 2:54 PM, <ti… [at] ch2m.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > The program is Expedition. It is @ $1,000 maybe more... I've had it for 4 years. > > > > Nick constantly updates it with more stuff-devices-features. > > > > The primary purpose is a racing -optimized routing software. > > > > Using Charts, Polars. current, wind it predicts the fastest way to complete a race course. > > > > It does best in a macro level, as that is where the data points are... but we use it on offshore races of @ 90 miles or so, for input. > > > > Nick may be open to barter... it is his business. > > > > His software is the "Swiss army knife of yacht racing and tactics. > > > > From his website: http://www.iexpedition.org/index.htm > > > > About Expedition > > > > Expedition is simply the best tactical and navigation software available. Expedition supports more instrument systems, is easier to use and has the most powerful and useful functions for the racing navigator. > > > > Expedition has been developed by veteran Volvo Ocean Race navigator and Whitbread winner, physicist Nick White, initially for his use in the 2001-2 Volvo Ocean Race with Team News Corp and the Stars & Stripes Americas Cup team. > > > > Since then, Expedition has been continually refined by a core group of world-renowned navigators and two-time America’s Cup winning navigator Peter Isler has consulted closely in the development of the system > > > > The end result is a system that wins more races and is far more advanced and usable in all aspects than any other tactical software available - whether you are racing around the world or your local harbour. > > > > Features > > > > Requires Windows 2000, XP or Vista > > > > XP or Vista preferred. > > > > Chart-plotter that seamlessly rotates, mosaics and moves between charts, > > > > C-Map NT & MAX, > > > > Maptech PCX, > > > > Bsb charts, including v4 and v5, > > > > Softcharts, > > > > NV-verlag > > > > Day, dusk and night display modes. > > > > Advanced weather display and tools, > > > > Integrated PredictWind, Saildocs and Ocens weather services, > > > > Sophisticated display options, > > > > Intelligent merge of multiple grib file datasets. > > > > Simply the best weather routing available, > > > > Display multiple optimum routes, > > > > Optimal routes for fleet, > > > > Reverse isochrone function for graphical interpretation of routing. > > > > Start display and advanced buoy racing functions, > > > > What if? functionality, > > > > Instrument calibration > > > > Time to marks, laylines etc, > > > > Start line functions > > > > Time to ends & line, > > > > Time to burn, > > > > Hold wind, > > > > Display grid > > > > Rate of turn and acceleration, > > > > Line bias, > > > > ... > > > > ... > > > > Tides and currents, > > > > Instrument input and output functions to exchange data with all popular instrument systems, including polars and calibration values > > > > AIS receivers, > > > > B&G, > > > > Koden radar, > > > > KVH Quadro, > > > > Nexus NX2, FDX and NXR, > > > > NKE > > > > NMEA 0183, > > > > NMEA 2000, > > > > Ockam, > > > > Racing Bravo (as used by the leading Americas Cup teams), > > > > Tacktick, > > > > Various compasses, lasers and other sensors. > > > > Stripchart program to graph and analyse any instrument function, > > > > Displays marks, courses, laylines, track, AIS targets, race schedule information etc. on the chart, > > > > Polar functions to output, analyse and create or modify a yacht’s performance polars, > > > > Race schedule functions to track and analyse competitors, > > > > Simple handicap support, > > > > Logging functions to record race data that can be replayed or analysed later to assist with instrument calibration or polar modifications, > > > > Google Earth interfacing, > > > > Networking support. > > > > ... and much more! > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Allen Edwards > > Sent: Monday, November 02, 2009 5:10 PM > > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] SF Bay Currents/ Rambler Racing (Mike) > > > > > > > > Where did you get that program? It looks most interesting. I am > > gathering some charts from PORTS and have one for the same time and > > they compare well. You can see my chart at > > http://l-36.com/current/09110213.png > > > > Perhaps I can interest him in a nice big print of Samba Pa Ti against > > the GG Bridge as an exchange for his software??? :-) > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/62843340@N00/3940305948/ I can print > > that up to 16x24. > > > > Regarding your advice and that of others. I sail in the south bay. I > > only get into the central bay were I do these classic races when I do > > the races. For example, the leg from Little Harding to Blackhauler > > via Yellow Bluff. I took that route for the first time last year. > > After the race I asked my opponent how he knew when to make the turn. > > He gave me some technical stuff about wind shifts and then said that > > he had an advantage on me there because he has raced that leg 1000 > > times. I agree with what everyone says about experience but let me > > tell another story. > > > > We had a leg from Harding Rock to Blossom. Alcatraz in exactly in the > > way so you can go in front or behind it. We didn't know but we had a > > rather huge lead at that point. We sailed right at the island and > > were about 1/3 of the way there before they rounded the mark, about > > 2/3 before we saw that they were going out. So, we went out as well. > > But by then we were close to the island and they went out. We decided > > to head to the mark, perhaps a mistake, and the caught us, we got > > tricky and missed the mark and had to do a 360 turn. The tricky was > > our only shot of beating them at that point but it didn't work. We > > took 2nd. > > > > The other time, we had no reason to think they would go close to shore > > as the current chart we had said stronger close to shore and all the > > other boats in other classes went out. We had a huge lead and were > > way out by the time we saw they were in to shore. I told the skipper > > of the other boat our mistake was not covering. He said "Hard to > > cover when you are so far ahead". I see now from the detailed charts > > that I am getting that almost no current close to shore and were we > > were was probably the maximum with less out even further. So, they > > had a 2 kt speed advantage and passed us. > > > > Had I know to go in to the shore, I would have stayed between them and > > the next mark as that was our strategy. We just didn't follow it and > > mainly because we didn't know the current. > > > > So, every race I come away with something I need to do. This time it > > is get a better handle on the current. > > > > Allen > > > > On Mon, Nov 2, 2009 at 10:37 AM, <ti… [at] ch2m.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I have current predictions for San Francisco, developed by Nick White a "Famous" naviguesser and tactician. > > > > > > He's participated on (and won) America's Cup, Volvo Races and regularly races on Samba Pi Ti, the famous racer out of SF. > > > > > > I can print out screen shots of any days/time you want. Here's 2pm today. > > > > > > Also, please consider this advice. If your competition is a similar rating boat, strongly consider learning boat to boat tactics. > > > > > > In other words, race the other boat, not the conditions. > > > > > > If you can cover them it does not really matter the conditions or local knowledge. > > > _ > > > > > >

Michael D wrote: > > > Allen, > > Those are some incredible photos! It never seems to amaze me as the > diversity of Cal sailor backgrounds. I wouldn't be surprised if we > have a rocket scientist and/or a Nobel prize winner. > Well, many years ago, I was named the Official Cat Pee Eradicator for the 1937-38 Buick Club. Chris Campbell Cal 20 #1220 > > > - >