Got me a Cal 29

Greets All; Well part two is complete. Im fortunate to have been allowed to take possession of Bay Breeze out of Rock Hall MD. This girl is actually a CAL 3-29 that has been meticulousely maintain by Les and Leslie Since its in such good shape, lotta love went into this boat, the name will not change and Im proud to be her new master. As soon as the truck gets repaired, could not be stuck in nicer place so Im hoping it will take a few days, its back to Canada to get the final affairs sorted them back to Rock Hall and down the ICW to Miami and then to Marathon City Marina where the refit will be completed preparing her for her travels into the Islands. All I can say is that Im a very fortuante lad to own this boat and Im sure she will take good care of both me and me dog. Interestingly enough, el poocho loves the boat as well and promptly fell asleep on the startboard lazarette while motor sailing the vessel on her mainden cruise with Les. A really good sign. Best regards Chris H. PS: I was talg with one of the lads at dockside and he mentioned that cruising world ran an article on the top 10 things to prepare/consider when sailing/cruising with pets. Anyone know of the issue no or month when this article ran? Would be an interesting read. ....tks/ch

Good boat, we just got another 1st in 18 knts of breeze with 25 gusts. Keep her on her feet and she will get you to where you want to go. Good luck Randy Out Patient Cal 2-29 Channel Islands, Ca From: chris h <ch… [at] magma.ca> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Sun, November 15, 2009 4:29:14 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Got me a Cal 29 Greets All; Well part two is complete. Im fortunate to have been allowed to take possession of Bay Breeze out of Rock Hall MD. This girl is actually a CAL 3-29 that has been meticulousely maintain by Les and Leslie Since its in such good shape, lotta love went into this boat, the name will not change and Im proud to be her new master. As soon as the truck gets repaired, could not be stuck in nicer place so Im hoping it will take a few days, its back to Canada to get the final affairs sorted them back to Rock Hall and down the ICW to Miami and then to Marathon City Marina where the refit will be completed preparing her for her travels into the Islands. All I can say is that Im a very fortuante lad to own this boat and Im sure she will take good care of both me and me dog. Interestingly enough, el poocho loves the boat as well and promptly fell asleep on the startboard lazarette while motor sailing the vessel on her mainden cruise with Les. A really good sign. Best regards Chris H. PS: I was talg with one of the lads at dockside and he mentioned that cruising world ran an article on the top 10 things to prepare/consider when sailing/cruising with pets. Anyone know of the issue no or month when this article ran? Would be an interesting read. ....tks/ch

Congratulations Chris... the Cal 3-29s are a rare find and it's my understanding there are less than 10 of us out there. When our boat was new, we were told by the Cal dealer that we probably had one of the last hulls made, if not the last... #1008, along with a rare interior. We had never seen another interior like ours in all our years sailing until 3 summer's ago when we meet Star Gazer - hull #1009. We believe he's the last hull produced. Gregg & Dannae Cal 3-29 Puget Sound Greets All; Well part two is complete. Im fortunate to have been allowed to take possession of Bay Breeze out of Rock Hall MD. This girl is actually a CAL 3-29 that has been meticulousely maintain by Les and Leslie Since its in such good shape, lotta love went into this boat, the name will not change and Im proud to be her new master. As soon as the truck gets repaired, could not be stuck in nicer place so Im hoping it will take a few days, its back to Canada to get the final affairs sorted them back to Rock Hall and down the ICW to Miami and then to Marathon City Marina where the refit will be completed preparing her for her travels into the Islands. All I can say is that Im a very fortuante lad to own this boat and Im sure she will take good care of both me and me dog. Interestingly enough, el poocho loves the boat as well and promptly fell asleep on the startboard lazarette while motor sailing the vessel on her mainden cruise with Les. A really good sign. Best regards Chris H. PS: I was talg with one of the lads at dockside and he mentioned that cruising world ran an article on the top 10 things to prepare/consider when sailing/cruising with pets. Anyone know of the issue no or month when this article ran? Would be an interesting read. ....tks/ch .

Yup that what Im hoping. The main is getting a second reef point put in and the 155 is being cut back to a 135. Have a spare 150 if needed, Interestingly enough the local sailmaker here, Meade Breese, how appropriate is that, did not recommend a foam luff on the sail as it would change too radically the drive point on the sail as its a 155. So went with his recommendation. Basically I want to set this girl up a cruising machine, that sits nice and straight under a variety of conditions. Meade also sell really nice baseball caps, you know the ones, that actually fit and dont fly off to easily in a blow. Hard to come by. The furler is interesting as its a Famet. Never heard or seen these before so did some reading on the net, and its actually an interesting and simple system. Best and thanks /ch ----- Original Message ----- From: Randy Alcorn To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 12:06 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Got me a Cal 29 Good boat, we just got another 1st in 18 knts of breeze with 25 gusts. Keep her on her feet and she will get you to where you want to go. Good luck Randy Out Patient Cal 2-29 Channel Islands, Ca ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: chris h <ch… [at] magma.ca> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Sun, November 15, 2009 4:29:14 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Got me a Cal 29 Greets All; Well part two is complete. Im fortunate to have been allowed to take possession of Bay Breeze out of Rock Hall MD. This girl is actually a CAL 3-29 that has been meticulousely maintain by Les and Leslie Since its in such good shape, lotta love went into this boat, the name will not change and Im proud to be her new master. As soon as the truck gets repaired, could not be stuck in nicer place so Im hoping it will take a few days, its back to Canada to get the final affairs sorted them back to Rock Hall and down the ICW to Miami and then to Marathon City Marina where the refit will be completed preparing her for her travels into the Islands. All I can say is that Im a very fortuante lad to own this boat and Im sure she will take good care of both me and me dog. Interestingly enough, el poocho loves the boat as well and promptly fell asleep on the startboard lazarette while motor sailing the vessel on her mainden cruise with Les. A really good sign. Best regards Chris H. PS: I was talg with one of the lads at dockside and he mentioned that cruising world ran an article on the top 10 things to prepare/consider when sailing/cruising with pets. Anyone know of the issue no or month when this article ran? Would be an interesting read. ....tks/ch ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.707 / Virus Database: 270.14.67/2506 - Release Date: 11/16/09 02:43:00

Thanks. The hull number is 1005 and its a 78. Looking forward to many good years with this vessel. Too bad were on opposite coasts, which actually is interesting that this boat made it to east coast at all. I have the complete history on the boat thanks to the previouse owner and once I get some spare time will sit down and read it all. /ch

One more thing.. all the 3-29s were only made in 1978. Thanks. The hull number is 1005 and its a 78. Looking forward to many good years with this vessel. Too bad were on opposite coasts, which actually is interesting that this boat made it to east coast at all. I have the complete history on the boat thanks to the previouse owner and once I get some spare time will sit down and read it all. /ch

Interesting. So that was the final year. How cool is that..:) I'll take some pictures tomorrow and put them on line. Gotta get back to Canada to start the final shutdown so the pics will be helpfull on learning the boat. Best regards /ch

Putting up the wing http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/2009/11/video-bmw-oracle-debuts-wing-sail-on.html and http://www.fox5sandiego.com/news/kswb-bor-90-wing,0,7982321.story cb

Gosh, after seeing the Oracle crew take that monster wing and hoist it on top of the 90' by 90' tri I can see why so many people have tuned out of America's cup Racing..like, "What does this have to do with the kind of sailing 'we' do?" "Pretty awesome", tho, I'd still say. After all what does a '30's era J class boat, or even the "skimming dishes" that Nat Herreshoff built around the turn of the century, have to do with everyday amateur cruising and racing? Jerry Sobel, venerable original California 24, Shpritz --- On Mon, 11/16/09, Chris Barszcz <we… [at] yahoo.com> wrote: From: Chris Barszcz <we… [at] yahoo.com> Subject: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, November 16, 2009, 6:47 PM Putting up the wing http://valenciasail ing.blogspot. com/2009/ 11/video- bmw-oracle- debuts-wing- sail-on.html and http://www.fox5sand iego.com/ news/kswb- bor-90-wing, 0,7982321. story cb

I was reading about that and it really doesn't interest me. What is America's Cup now? A race, held elsewhere in boats that no one can relate to. And are they really boats or seabound aircraft? Marsh Chris Barszcz wrote: > > > Putting up the wing > http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/2009/11/video-bmw-oracle-debuts-wing-sail-on.html > > and http://www.fox5sandiego.com/news/kswb-bor-90-wing,0,7982321.story > > cb > > > > -- *´¨) ¸.·´¸.·*´¨) ¸.·*¨) (¸.·´ (¸.·'*Marsh ----------------------------- Marsh Wise Webmaster: -reenactor.Net: <http://www.reenactor.net/> Read my Blog (bore yourself): <http://www.reenactor.net/rnet_admin/marsh/marshblog.html> -1./Infanterie-Regiment 23 <http://www.ir23.org> -Foresthill.US: <http://www.foresthill.us/> -The Dogs Place <http://www.the-dogs-place.com/> -Progress Village Community Website: <http://www.progress-village.com> Assistant Webmaster: -VAQ-33 Squadron site: <http://www.reenactor.net/vaq-33/> Netscape Aim/AOL screen name: Sturmkatze Yahoo Messenger screen name: sturmkatze Alteris renumera duplum de quoquo tibi numeraverunt "A fondness for power is implanted in most men, and it is natural to abuse it when acquired." -- Alexander Hamilton Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress.... But then I repeat myself. ~Mark Twain *Last: Hey Dammit! Have you visited the reenactor.Net FORvMS? If not, WHY NOT? Gett your butt over to: <http://www.reenactor.net/forums/index.php> right now! -=<www.sturmkatze.com>=-

Wow, thanks. I enjoyed watching those. I had no idea what they were doing. Amazing and truly over the top. Allen On Mon, Nov 16, 2009 at 6:47 PM, Chris Barszcz <we… [at] yahoo.com>wrote: > > > Putting up the wing > > http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/2009/11/video-bmw-oracle-debuts-wing-sail-on.html > > and http://www.fox5sandiego.com/news/kswb-bor-90-wing,0,7982321.story > > cb > > >

Chris Barszcz wrote: > > Putting up the wing > http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/2009/11/video-bmw-oracle-debuts-wing-sail-on.html > <http://valenciasailing.blogspot.com/2009/11/video-bmw-oracle-debuts-wing-sail-on.html> > > and http://www.fox5sandiego.com/news/kswb-bor-90-wing,0,7982321.story > <http://www.fox5sandiego.com/news/kswb-bor-90-wing,0,7982321.story> I'm not much interested in the doings of ultra-rich egotists, but this is cool technology, isn't it? I expect that ol' /Martha C/ will be sailing under her used Dacron for a while, but it's interesting to see what the edges of innovation can give us. Chris Campbell

Marsh Wise wrote: > > > I was reading about that and it really doesn't interest me. What is > America's Cup now? A race, held elsewhere in boats that no one can > relate to. And are they really boats or seabound aircraft? > I agree that the race is uninteresting and remote from real sailing, and further, I'm offended by this notion that all public undertakings and all public spaces must be plastered with names and logos for sponsors. But I do like to see what kinds of new approaches can be tried. It's quite a feat if they can keep that big wing vertical, especially when the wind pipes up. It's one thing to keep a wing affixed to a plane. Those are rigid and their relationship to the aircraft doesn't change. But this boat has to have a rotating wing, doesn't it? That makes for an additional set of challenges. As I watched the video, I kept wondering what an accidental jibe would be like in a good breeze. But then it occurred to me that this boat is more like an iceboat. It's sailing on apparent wind and pretty much close hauled all the time, probably. So I may gripe about the America's Cup turning into a big "look at me" event for insecure rich people, and a place for corporations to conduct advertising, but that won't stop me from being interested in new approaches to making a boat go in the wind. That's the fun part. Chris Campbell

This race is being run under basically no rules, which makes it interesting in its own way. The rules they used last time also had some interesting limits. For example, the keel could be made out of any material except gold. They had to put that in there to limit the expense of making the boats. Not my league for sure but interesting. Now, that said, I can see two sides to this. One is the innovation and interest in the extreme side of my sport. The other is the political one that resources in the world have been channeled to rich people by robber barons at the expense of the common man. Take your pick. Allen On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 7:05 AM, Chris Campbell < cl… [at] charterinternet.com> wrote: > > > Marsh Wise wrote: > > > > I was reading about that and it really doesn't interest me. What is > America's Cup now? A race, held elsewhere in boats that no one can relate > to. And are they really boats or seabound aircraft? > > > I agree that the race is uninteresting and remote from real sailing, and > further, I'm offended by this notion that all public undertakings and all > public spaces must be plastered with names and logos for sponsors. > > But I do like to see what kinds of new approaches can be tried. It's > quite a feat if they can keep that big wing vertical, especially when the > wind pipes up. It's one thing to keep a wing affixed to a plane. Those are > rigid and their relationship to the aircraft doesn't change. But this boat > has to have a rotating wing, doesn't it? That makes for an additional set > of challenges. > > As I watched the video, I kept wondering what an accidental jibe would be > like in a good breeze. But then it occurred to me that this boat is more > like an iceboat. It's sailing on apparent wind and pretty much close hauled > all the time, probably. > > So I may gripe about the America's Cup turning into a big "look at me" > event for insecure rich people, and a place for corporations to conduct > advertising, but that won't stop me from being interested in new approaches > to making a boat go in the wind. That's the fun part. > > Chris Campbell > > >

some CAL models were manufactured on both coasts Reggie To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com From: ch… [at] magma.ca Date: Mon, 16 Nov 2009 10:09:10 -0500 Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Got me a Cal 29 Thanks. The hull number is 1005 and its a 78. Looking forward to many good years with this vessel. Too bad were on opposite coasts, which actually is interesting that this boat made it to east coast at all. I have the complete history on the boat thanks to the previouse owner and once I get some spare time will sit down and read it all. /ch

Please allow me to add my voice to the chorus decrying those few among us who have actually done something of tremendous and rare commercial value. How dare they expect to feel good about their success. How dare they leverage that success into activities intended only to rub our noses in our own mediocrity. Anyway, why would anyone want to watch something like Formula 1 racing when life is really all about backing your Ford into a parking space at Wal-Mart? Damn those “insecure”, “egotistical” well-doers. This would never be allowed to happen in North Korea! Hugs and Kisses Comrades! Wayne Gillikin From: Chris Campbell <cl… [at] charterinternet.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Tue, November 17, 2009 10:05:35 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites Marsh Wise wrote: > >I was reading about >that and >it really doesn't interest me. What is America's Cup now? A race, held >elsewhere in boats that no one can relate to. And are they really boats >or seabound aircraft? > I agree that the race is uninteresting and remote from real sailing, and further, I'm offended by this notion that all public undertakings and all public spaces must be plastered with names and logos for sponsors. But I do like to see what kinds of new approaches can be tried. It's quite a feat if they can keep that big wing vertical, especially when the wind pipes up. It's one thing to keep a wing affixed to a plane. Those are rigid and their relationship to the aircraft doesn't change. But this boat has to have a rotating wing, doesn't it? That makes for an additional set of challenges. As I watched the video, I kept wondering what an accidental jibe would be like in a good breeze. But then it occurred to me that this boat is more like an iceboat. It's sailing on apparent wind and pretty much close hauled all the time, probably. So I may gripe about the America's Cup turning into a big "look at me" event for insecure rich people, and a place for corporations to conduct advertising, but that won't stop me from being interested in new approaches to making a boat go in the wind. That's the fun part. Chris Campbell

You are exhibiting binary thinking. If someone doesn't like this particular excess, they must be a Walmart shopping, Ford truck driving, commie loving Nazi. Everyone on this list (most anyway) own a yacht and are therefore by definition a cut above the masses so lighten up. Notice how I put in a line about yachting to keep it on topic? Imho, all viewpoints about this yachting excess of the America Cup (anyone think it isn't an excess?) are valid and we should all respect others opinions. Excesses are fun to watch but they do have a cost. There is a negative cost to society but they are also the spice of life. Better to enjoy them and hope some of the technology will find its way on to our boats and make our yachts more pleasurable for us. Formula 1 racing is a good example. I have been to several Formula 1 races and they are a blast to watch. A formula 1 car goes 200 MPH which is a lot closer to the speed of an airplane than to the speed of a car. So, what do they have to do with my car? Around here there are these concrete barriers along the freeway to keep drivers out of the oncoming traffic. They are kind of ramped at the bottom and if you hit one you actually end up driving on it. You see a lot of skid marks on them and hardly ever any paint. They were developed in formula 1 driving. They actually had to turn them around so that they would hurt the cars in formula 1 because the drivers were hitting them on purpose to get around the corner faster thus decreasing their value of protecting the spectators. So, there is a value to all of us that comes from these excesses. Enough. Allen On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 7:46 AM, Wayne Gillikin <wa… [at] yahoo.com>wrote: > > > Please allow me to add my voice to the chorus decrying those few among us > who have actually done something of tremendous and rare commercial value. > How dare they expect to feel good about their success. How dare they > leverage that success into activities intended only to rub our noses in our > own mediocrity. Anyway, why would anyone want to watch something like > Formula 1 racing when life is really all about backing your Ford into a > parking space at Wal-Mart? Damn those “insecure”, “egotistical” > well-doers. This would never be allowed to happen in North Korea! > > > Hugs and Kisses Comrades! > > Wayne Gillikin > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Chris Campbell <cl… [at] charterinternet.com> > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Sent:* Tue, November 17, 2009 10:05:35 AM > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites > > > > Marsh Wise wrote: > > > > I was reading about that and it really doesn't interest me. What is > America's Cup now? A race, held elsewhere in boats that no one can relate > to. And are they really boats or seabound aircraft? > > > I agree that the race is uninteresting and remote from real sailing, and > further, I'm offended by this notion that all public undertakings and all > public spaces must be plastered with names and logos for sponsors. > > But I do like to see what kinds of new approaches can be tried. It's > quite a feat if they can keep that big wing vertical, especially when the > wind pipes up. It's one thing to keep a wing affixed to a plane. Those are > rigid and their relationship to the aircraft doesn't change. But this boat > has to have a rotating wing, doesn't it? That makes for an additional set > of challenges. > > As I watched the video, I kept wondering what an accidental jibe would be > like in a good breeze. But then it occurred to me that this boat is more > like an iceboat. It's sailing on apparent wind and pretty much close hauled > all the time, probably. > > So I may gripe about the America's Cup turning into a big "look at me" > event for insecure rich people, and a place for corporations to conduct > advertising, but that won't stop me from being interested in new approaches > to making a boat go in the wind. That's the fun part. > > Chris Campbell > > > >

So, IMHO, the only thing that matters is a diversity of opinions. I get nervous when the pendulum seems to swing too far in any direction. While we were rich-bashing I thought I would add some balance (and believe me, not because I can relate). It’s the dialectic that matters. The tension keeps the planet spinning on its axis. You might want to know that my sails (here’s the content) really, really old, like so many other's. Nope, no near term plan for new ones. Just going to muddle through as best I can. Its all good, clean fun. BTW - I'm light as a zephyr and not a cut above anything. Wayne From: Allen Edwards <al… [at] PaloAltoPhoto.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Tue, November 17, 2009 11:58:47 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites You are exhibiting binary thinking. If someone doesn't like this particular excess, they must be a Walmart shopping, Ford truck driving, commie loving Nazi. Everyone on this list (most anyway) own a yacht and are therefore by definition a cut above the masses so lighten up. Notice how I put in a line about yachting to keep it on topic? Imho, all viewpoints about this yachting excess of the America Cup (anyone think it isn't an excess?) are valid and we should all respect others opinions. Excesses are fun to watch but they do have a cost. There is a negative cost to society but they are also the spice of life. Better to enjoy them and hope some of the technology will find its way on to our boats and make our yachts more pleasurable for us. Formula 1 racing is a good example. I have been to several Formula 1 races and they are a blast to watch. A formula 1 car goes 200 MPH which is a lot closer to the speed of an airplane than to the speed of a car. So, what do they have to do with my car? Around here there are these concrete barriers along the freeway to keep drivers out of the oncoming traffic. They are kind of ramped at the bottom and if you hit one you actually end up driving on it. You see a lot of skid marks on them and hardly ever any paint. They were developed in formula 1 driving. They actually had to turn them around so that they would hurt the cars in formula 1 because the drivers were hitting them on purpose to get around the corner faster thus decreasing their value of protecting the spectators. So, there is a value to all of us that comes from these excesses. Enough. Allen On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 7:46 AM, Wayne Gillikin <waynegillikin@ yahoo.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > >> > >> >Please allow me to add my voice to the chorus decrying those >few among us who have actually done something of tremendous and rare commercial >value. How dare they expect to feel good >about their success. How dare they leverage >that success into activities intended only to rub our noses in our own >mediocrity. Anyway, why would anyone >want to watch something like Formula 1 racing when life is really all about >backing your Ford into a parking space at Wal-Mart? Damn those “insecure”, “egotistical” >well-doers. This would never be allowed >to happen in North Korea! > > >Hugs and Kisses Comrades! >Wayne Gillikin > > > > >From: Chris Campbell <clcampbell@charteri nternet.com> >To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com >Sent: Tue, November 17, 2009 10:05:35 AM >Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites > > > > > > >> > >> > > >Marsh Wise wrote: > > >> >>I was reading about >>that and >>it really doesn't interest me. What is America's Cup now? A race, held >>elsewhere in boats that no one can relate to. And are they really boats >>or seabound aircraft? >> >>I agree that the race is uninteresting and remote from real sailing, >and further, I'm offended by this notion that all public undertakings >and all public spaces must be plastered with names and logos for >sponsors. > >>But I do like to see what kinds of new approaches can be tried. It's >quite a feat if they can keep that big wing vertical, especially when >the wind pipes up. It's one thing to keep a wing affixed to a plane. >Those are rigid and their relationship to the aircraft doesn't change. >But this boat has to have a rotating wing, doesn't it? That makes for >an additional set of challenges. > >>As I watched the video, I kept wondering what an accidental jibe would >be like in a good breeze. But then it occurred to me that this boat is >more like an iceboat. It's sailing on apparent wind and pretty much >close hauled all the time, probably. > >>So I may gripe about the America's Cup turning into a big "look at me" >event for insecure rich people, and a place for corporations to conduct >advertising, but that won't stop me from being interested in new >approaches to making a boat go in the wind. That's the fun part. > >>Chris Campbell > > >

My apologies. I guess I was trying to do the same. My sails are new btw. Best thing I ever did for the boat. But I bought Dacron because 1) I am cheap and 2) I didn't want to make it seem you needed high tech sails to race 50 year old boats or our races would truly become match races. More fun when you come in 2nd out of 5 then 2nd out of 2. Allen On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 9:18 AM, Wayne Gillikin <wa… [at] yahoo.com>wrote: > > > So, IMHO, the only thing that matters is a diversity of opinions. I get > nervous when the pendulum seems to swing too far in any direction. While > we were rich-bashing I thought I would add some balance (and believe me, not > because I can relate). It’s the dialectic that matters. The tension > keeps the planet spinning on its axis. You might want to know that my > sails (here’s the content) really, really old, like so many other's. Nope, > no near term plan for new ones. Just going to muddle through as best I > can. Its all good, clean fun. BTW - I'm light as a zephyr and not a cut > above anything. > > > Wayne > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Allen Edwards <al… [at] PaloAltoPhoto.com> > > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Sent:* Tue, November 17, 2009 11:58:47 AM > > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites > > > > You are exhibiting binary thinking. If someone doesn't like this > particular excess, they must be a Walmart shopping, Ford truck driving, > commie loving Nazi. Everyone on this list (most anyway) own a yacht and are > therefore by definition a cut above the masses so lighten up. > > Notice how I put in a line about yachting to keep it on topic? > > Imho, all viewpoints about this yachting excess of the America Cup (anyone > think it isn't an excess?) are valid and we should all respect others > opinions. Excesses are fun to watch but they do have a cost. There is a > negative cost to society but they are also the spice of life. Better to > enjoy them and hope some of the technology will find its way on to our boats > and make our yachts more pleasurable for us. > > Formula 1 racing is a good example. I have been to several Formula 1 races > and they are a blast to watch. A formula 1 car goes 200 MPH which is a lot > closer to the speed of an airplane than to the speed of a car. So, what do > they have to do with my car? Around here there are these concrete barriers > along the freeway to keep drivers out of the oncoming traffic. They are > kind of ramped at the bottom and if you hit one you actually end up driving > on it. You see a lot of skid marks on them and hardly ever any paint. They > were developed in formula 1 driving. They actually had to turn them around > so that they would hurt the cars in formula 1 because the drivers were > hitting them on purpose to get around the corner faster thus decreasing > their value of protecting the spectators. So, there is a value to all of us > that comes from these excesses. > > Enough. > > Allen > > On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 7:46 AM, Wayne Gillikin <waynegillikin@ yahoo.com<wa… [at] yahoo.com> > > wrote: > >> >> >> Please allow me to add my voice to the chorus decrying those few among us >> who have actually done something of tremendous and rare commercial value. >> How dare they expect to feel good about their success. How dare they >> leverage that success into activities intended only to rub our noses in our >> own mediocrity. Anyway, why would anyone want to watch something like >> Formula 1 racing when life is really all about backing your Ford into a >> parking space at Wal-Mart? Damn those “insecure”, “egotistical” >> well-doers. This would never be allowed to happen in North Korea! >> >> >> Hugs and Kisses Comrades! >> >> Wayne Gillikin >> >> ------------------------------ >> *From:* Chris Campbell <clcampbell@charteri nternet.com<cl… [at] charterinternet.com> >> > >> *To:* Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> >> >> *Sent:* Tue, November 17, 2009 10:05:35 AM >> *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites >> >> >> >> Marsh Wise wrote: >> >> >> >> I was reading about that and it really doesn't interest me. What is >> America's Cup now? A race, held elsewhere in boats that no one can relate >> to. And are they really boats or seabound aircraft? >> >> >> I agree that the race is uninteresting and remote from real sailing, and >> further, I'm offended by this notion that all public undertakings and all >> public spaces must be plastered with names and logos for sponsors. >> >> But I do like to see what kinds of new approaches can be tried. It's >> quite a feat if they can keep that big wing vertical, especially when the >> wind pipes up. It's one thing to keep a wing affixed to a plane. Those are >> rigid and their relationship to the aircraft doesn't change. But this boat >> has to have a rotating wing, doesn't it? That makes for an additional set >> of challenges. >> >> As I watched the video, I kept wondering what an accidental jibe would be >> like in a good breeze. But then it occurred to me that this boat is more >> like an iceboat. It's sailing on apparent wind and pretty much close hauled >> all the time, probably. >> >> So I may gripe about the America's Cup turning into a big "look at me" >> event for insecure rich people, and a place for corporations to conduct >> advertising, but that won't stop me from being interested in new approaches >> to making a boat go in the wind. That's the fun part. >> >> Chris Campbell >> >> >> > > >

On Nov 17, 2009, at 7:05 AM, Chris Campbell wrote: > Marsh Wise wrote: > >> >> I was reading about that and it really doesn't interest me. What is >> America's Cup now? A race, held elsewhere in boats that no one can >> relate to. And are they really boats or seabound aircraft? >> > > I agree that the race is uninteresting and remote from real sailing, > and further, I'm offended by this notion that all public > undertakings and all public spaces must be plastered with names and > logos for sponsors. > > But I do like to see what kinds of new approaches can be tried. > It's quite a feat if they can keep that big wing vertical, > especially when the wind pipes up. It's one thing to keep a wing > affixed to a plane. Those are rigid and their relationship to the > aircraft doesn't change. But this boat has to have a rotating wing, > doesn't it? That makes for an additional set of challenges. C class catamarans have been using hard sails for years, I believe. This is just bigger. At least he is giving some people work. Aside from that I can't work up an interest. The America's Cup is long past the point I would walk across the street to see it. On the other hand, I went to Australia to watch the 1987 races. Mike Kennedy Conquest Cal 40 # 96 > > As I watched the video, I kept wondering what an accidental jibe > would be like in a good breeze. But then it occurred to me that > this boat is more like an iceboat. It's sailing on apparent wind > and pretty much close hauled all the time, probably. > > So I may gripe about the America's Cup turning into a big "look at > me" event for insecure rich people, and a place for corporations to > conduct advertising, but that won't stop me from being interested in > new approaches to making a boat go in the wind. That's the fun part. > > Chris Campbell > > >

Here is my take on this, my $0.02 (or .0136759 in today's dollars) The America's cup has always been about rice boy and their toy boats. Occasionally, someone wants to take his ball and go home because nobody wants to play by his rules. From what I understand, I wasn't around back in the early days, the current litigation and dirty tricks have not come close to the best of them. It is interesting to follow, just to see who is doing what, getting caught in their own spider web, and how to weasel out of the current mess they have destined to follow. The Americas Cup is about as relevant to current sailboats as Formula 1 and NASCAR are to the showroom models or your daily driver daily driver. Automotive racing has brought (eventually) great innovations to the showroom, disc brakes, suspension control, and EFI, just to name a few. And sailing has also been improved, winged keels, planning hulls and hi-tech sail materials. Doyle is very proud of their input into high performance sailing and sail cloth, but will also provide you with a good Dacron cruising sail if needed. After all the litigation, money spent, and technology developments, I would love to see the following happen: -RAK keep the SNG boat hostage until the February date has passed. -BMW current boat is deemed non-compliant due to ________(fill in the blanks) -the original Date in Valencia is deemed "the date" so whoever shows up is the winner and -if both Larry and Ernest show up, they have to race single handed in Lasers (the current rule is a Max size) I will stay up late to watch that! John

what are you talking about? Hmmm, damn, I DO have a Ford and was just AT WalMart. Hmmm, I also have a Mercedes Benz but it's an older one, so I'm one of the untermensch to you, right.... Wayne Gillikin wrote: > > > Please allow me to add my voice to the chorus decrying those few among > us who have actually done something of tremendous and rare commercial > value. How dare they expect to feel good about their success. How > dare they leverage that success into activities intended only to rub > our noses in our own mediocrity. Anyway, why would anyone want to > watch something like Formula 1 racing when life is really all about > backing your Ford into a parking space at Wal-Mart? Damn those > “insecure”, “egotistical” well-doers. This would never be allowed to > happen in North Korea! > > > Hugs and Kisses Comrades! > > Wayne Gillikin > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *From:* Chris Campbell <cl… [at] charterinternet.com> > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Sent:* Tue, November 17, 2009 10:05:35 AM > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites > > > > Marsh Wise wrote: > >> >> >> I was reading about that and it really doesn't interest me. What is >> America's Cup now? A race, held elsewhere in boats that no one can >> relate to. And are they really boats or seabound aircraft? >> > > I agree that the race is uninteresting and remote from real sailing, > and further, I'm offended by this notion that all public undertakings > and all public spaces must be plastered with names and logos for > sponsors. > > But I do like to see what kinds of new approaches can be tried. It's > quite a feat if they can keep that big wing vertical, especially when > the wind pipes up. It's one thing to keep a wing affixed to a plane. > Those are rigid and their relationship to the aircraft doesn't > change. But this boat has to have a rotating wing, doesn't it? That > makes for an additional set of challenges. > > As I watched the video, I kept wondering what an accidental jibe would > be like in a good breeze. But then it occurred to me that this boat > is more like an iceboat. It's sailing on apparent wind and pretty > much close hauled all the time, probably. > > So I may gripe about the America's Cup turning into a big "look at me" > event for insecure rich people, and a place for corporations to > conduct advertising, but that won't stop me from being interested in > new approaches to making a boat go in the wind. That's the fun part. > > Chris Campbell > > > > > -- *´¨) ¸.·´¸.·*´¨) ¸.·*¨) (¸.·´ (¸.·'*Marsh ----------------------------- Marsh Wise Webmaster: -reenactor.Net: <http://www.reenactor.net/> Read my Blog (bore yourself): <http://www.reenactor.net/rnet_admin/marsh/marshblog.html> -1./Infanterie-Regiment 23 <http://www.ir23.org> -Foresthill.US: <http://www.foresthill.us/> -The Dogs Place <http://www.the-dogs-place.com/> -Progress Village Community Website: <http://www.progress-village.com> Assistant Webmaster: -VAQ-33 Squadron site: <http://www.reenactor.net/vaq-33/> Netscape Aim/AOL screen name: Sturmkatze Yahoo Messenger screen name: sturmkatze Alteris renumera duplum de quoquo tibi numeraverunt "A fondness for power is implanted in most men, and it is natural to abuse it when acquired." -- Alexander Hamilton Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress.... But then I repeat myself. ~Mark Twain *Last: Hey Dammit! Have you visited the reenactor.Net FORvMS? If not, WHY NOT? Gett your butt over to: <http://www.reenactor.net/forums/index.php> right now! -=<www.sturmkatze.com>=-

I'm not rich-bashing, I'm bashing the fact that the AC has turned into something it wasn't. I don't like traditions being changed. Whatever. Wayne Gillikin wrote: > > > So, IMHO, the only thing that matters is a diversity of opinions. I > get nervous when the pendulum seems to swing too far in any > direction. While we were rich-bashing I thought I would add some > balance (and believe me, not because I can relate). It’s the > dialectic that matters. The tension keeps the planet spinning on its > axis. You might want to know that my sails (here’s the content) > really, really old, like so many other's. Nope, no near term plan for > new ones. Just going to muddle through as best I can. Its all good, > clean fun. BTW - I'm light as a zephyr and not a cut above anything. > > > Wayne > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *From:* Allen Edwards <al… [at] PaloAltoPhoto.com> > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Sent:* Tue, November 17, 2009 11:58:47 AM > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites > > > > You are exhibiting binary thinking. If someone doesn't like this > particular excess, they must be a Walmart shopping, Ford truck > driving, commie loving Nazi. Everyone on this list (most anyway) own > a yacht and are therefore by definition a cut above the masses so > lighten up. > > > Notice how I put in a line about yachting to keep it on topic? > > Imho, all viewpoints about this yachting excess of the America Cup > (anyone think it isn't an excess?) are valid and we should all respect > others opinions. Excesses are fun to watch but they do have a cost. > There is a negative cost to society but they are also the spice of > life. Better to enjoy them and hope some of the technology will find > its way on to our boats and make our yachts more pleasurable for us. > > Formula 1 racing is a good example. I have been to several Formula 1 > races and they are a blast to watch. A formula 1 car goes 200 MPH > which is a lot closer to the speed of an airplane than to the speed of > a car. So, what do they have to do with my car? Around here there > are these concrete barriers along the freeway to keep drivers out of > the oncoming traffic. They are kind of ramped at the bottom and if > you hit one you actually end up driving on it. You see a lot of skid > marks on them and hardly ever any paint. They were developed in > formula 1 driving. They actually had to turn them around so that they > would hurt the cars in formula 1 because the drivers were hitting them > on purpose to get around the corner faster thus decreasing their value > of protecting the spectators. So, there is a value to all of us that > comes from these excesses. > > Enough. > > Allen > > On Tue, Nov 17, 2009 at 7:46 AM, Wayne Gillikin <waynegillikin@ > yahoo.com <mailto:wa… [at] yahoo.com>> wrote: > > > > Please allow me to add my voice to the chorus decrying those few > among us who have actually done something of tremendous and rare > commercial value. How dare they expect to feel good about their > success. How dare they leverage that success into activities > intended only to rub our noses in our own mediocrity. Anyway, why > would anyone want to watch something like Formula 1 racing when > life is really all about backing your Ford into a parking space at > Wal-Mart? Damn those “insecure”, “egotistical” well-doers. This > would never be allowed to happen in North Korea! > > > Hugs and Kisses Comrades! > > Wayne Gillikin > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *From:* Chris Campbell <clcampbell@charteri nternet.com > <mailto:cl… [at] charterinternet.com>> > *To:* Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > *Sent:* Tue, November 17, 2009 10:05:35 AM > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] More Oracle web sites > > > > Marsh Wise wrote: > >> >> >> I was reading about that and it really doesn't interest me. What >> is America's Cup now? A race, held elsewhere in boats that no one >> can relate to. And are they really boats or seabound aircraft? >> > > I agree that the race is uninteresting and remote from real > sailing, and further, I'm offended by this notion that all public > undertakings and all public spaces must be plastered with names > and logos for sponsors. > > But I do like to see what kinds of new approaches can be tried. > It's quite a feat if they can keep that big wing vertical, > especially when the wind pipes up. It's one thing to keep a wing > affixed to a plane. Those are rigid and their relationship to the > aircraft doesn't change. But this boat has to have a rotating > wing, doesn't it? That makes for an additional set of challenges. > > As I watched the video, I kept wondering what an accidental jibe > would be like in a good breeze. But then it occurred to me that > this boat is more like an iceboat. It's sailing on apparent wind > and pretty much close hauled all the time, probably. > > So I may gripe about the America's Cup turning into a big "look at > me" event for insecure rich people, and a place for corporations > to conduct advertising, but that won't stop me from being > interested in new approaches to making a boat go in the wind. > That's the fun part. > > Chris Campbell > > > > > > > -- *´¨) ¸.·´¸.·*´¨) ¸.·*¨) (¸.·´ (¸.·'*Marsh ----------------------------- Marsh Wise Webmaster: -reenactor.Net: <http://www.reenactor.net/> Read my Blog (bore yourself): <http://www.reenactor.net/rnet_admin/marsh/marshblog.html> -1./Infanterie-Regiment 23 <http://www.ir23.org> -Foresthill.US: <http://www.foresthill.us/> -The Dogs Place <http://www.the-dogs-place.com/> -Progress Village Community Website: <http://www.progress-village.com> Assistant Webmaster: -VAQ-33 Squadron site: <http://www.reenactor.net/vaq-33/> Netscape Aim/AOL screen name: Sturmkatze Yahoo Messenger screen name: sturmkatze Alteris renumera duplum de quoquo tibi numeraverunt "A fondness for power is implanted in most men, and it is natural to abuse it when acquired." -- Alexander Hamilton Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress.... But then I repeat myself. ~Mark Twain *Last: Hey Dammit! Have you visited the reenactor.Net FORvMS? If not, WHY NOT? Gett your butt over to: <http://www.reenactor.net/forums/index.php> right now! -=<www.sturmkatze.com>=-

-if both Larry and Ernest show up, they have to race single handed in Lasers (the current rule is a Max size) This is the best Americas Cup idea I have heard in a long time! This would be great TV entertainment for non-sailors as well. Who wouldn¹t pull up a chair to watch two billionaires go head to head with a chance of a good capsize or two. Terry Spencer

Michael Kennedy wrote: > C class catamarans have been using hard sails for years, I believe. > This is just bigger. At least he is giving some people work. Aside > from that I can't work up an interest. The America's Cup is long past > the point I would walk across the street to see it. On the other hand, > I went to Australia to watch the 1987 races. > > > I agree about the racing part. But what does interest me is the technology that lets them hold up that big vertical wing. The video instructed us that it's the largest wing ever, larger than the ones on the big commercial airliners. And unlike those, it has to rotate, so it has an axle, basically. It's an interesting engineering challenge to adapt an airfoil in that way. I've got a collection of old radios from the '20s onward and part of the fascination is observing both the circuits and the physical construction, seeing how they found different approaches to the same goal (making speech and music audible from RF energy). It will be interesting to see if that wing is capable of functioning in what I regard as a real marine environment--one with winds that vary in strength and direction and that create waves. Or, will it just be another boat that breaks in half. Chris Campbell

A couple of points, one is that I read it broke already. The lower control section, whatever that is. I also heard that it could go 30kt in 10kt of wind. The video didn't say that but I was wondering why the power boats seemed to have a hard time keeping up with what looked like no wind on the water. Second, building a wing that size seems simple. Consider that a jet wing is horizontal and going through the air at 500 kt. The trick is to make it light and stay up. I hope they are successful. I would love to see the America Cup up here in San Francisco. I have sailed right along side some of the AC boats up here and it really is nice to see them. I could not stay with them long though. Allen On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 6:35 AM, Chris Campbell < cl… [at] charterinternet.com> wrote: > Michael Kennedy wrote: > > C class catamarans have been using hard sails for years, I believe. > > This is just bigger. At least he is giving some people work. Aside > > from that I can't work up an interest. The America's Cup is long past > > the point I would walk across the street to see it. On the other hand, > > I went to Australia to watch the 1987 races. > > > > > > > I agree about the racing part. But what does interest me is the > technology that lets them hold up that big vertical wing. The video > instructed us that it's the largest wing ever, larger than the ones on > the big commercial airliners. And unlike those, it has to rotate, so it > has an axle, basically. It's an interesting engineering challenge to > adapt an airfoil in that way. I've got a collection of old radios from > the '20s onward and part of the fascination is observing both the > circuits and the physical construction, seeing how they found different > approaches to the same goal (making speech and music audible from RF > energy). > > It will be interesting to see if that wing is capable of functioning in > what I regard as a real marine environment--one with winds that vary in > strength and direction and that create waves. Or, will it just be > another boat that breaks in half. > > Chris Campbell > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >