Plumbing

Wow guys, how expensive is 2 feet of hose? Just do what Allen said, cut off after the barb on both ends, and then carefully slice a line parallel to the fittings on the remaining one or two inches. Detach at least one of those fittings from the bulkhead or wall behind the toilet. You will need wiggleroom anyway to reattach the new hose, then reattach the fitting you removed. Olive oil helps with refitting the hose. I put the hose end in hot water to soak for a few minutes. That white hose is really a pain, it is not very accurately sized to fit the fittings, since we use hose clamps anyway...they could give us some extra room. All that muscle-straining to attach and reattach the old stuff is hard on us older folks to say nothing of the time it takes. Helen

This will be fun; $10.00 Car @ 0.50/mile x 20 miles $ 4.00 Parking $20.00 2' Hose @10.00/lf $12.00 4 new clamps @ 3.00 $46.00 but wait there's more! While at the chandlery saw and also purchased $150.00 Foul weather top (2009) on sale $ 12.00 New pliers $ 8.00 bilge cleaner $ 50.00 LED Flashlight $220.00 $ 46.00 (above) $266.00 $ 21.00 (tax) $287.00 but wait there's more (Charlie) $1,200 Emergency room visit for 3rd degree burn to finger from hot clamp. $1,487 to do the job... but there could be more??? IF THE BOAT SINKS when the line is pulled apart; below the waterline... dEmO From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Helen Horn Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 3:40 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing Wow guys, how expensive is 2 feet of hose? Just do what Allen said, cut off after the barb on both ends, and then carefully slice a line parallel to the fittings on the remaining one or two inches. Detach at least one of those fittings from the bulkhead or wall behind the toilet. You will need wiggleroom anyway to reattach the new hose, then reattach the fitting you removed. Olive oil helps with refitting the hose. I put the hose end in hot water to soak for a few minutes. That white hose is really a pain, it is not very accurately sized to fit the fittings, since we use hose clamps anyway...they could give us some extra room. All that muscle-straining to attach and reattach the old stuff is hard on us older folks to say nothing of the time it takes. Helen

oh yeah, turn the through hull valve to off. then walk don't drive and bring a little reusable (eco thought) shopping bag and only $25 to your nearest WM store (free parking so far). much safer and better use of time than fighting with old icky hose. P.S. if you have good old hose clamps you can re-use them too. No matches or flames. fiberglass will burn to the waterline! Then use your anti-terrorist sheetrock knife to carefully make those cuts, keep your fingers out of the way. But I like your shopping list Timm. HH From: "ti… [at] ch2m.com" <ti… [at] ch2m.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 3:59:02 PM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs) This will be fun; $10.00 Car @ 0.50/mile x 20 miles $ 4.00 Parking $20.00 2’ Hose @10.00/lf $12.00 4 new clamps @ 3.00 $46.00 but wait there’s more! While at the chandlery saw and also purchased $150.00 Foul weather top (2009) on sale $ 12.00 New pliers $ 8.00 bilge cleaner $ 50.00 LED Flashlight $220.00 $ 46.00 (above) $266.00 $ 21.00 (tax) $287.00 but wait there’s more (Charlie) $1,200 Emergency room visit for 3rd degree burn to finger from hot clamp. $1,487 to do the job… but there could be more??? IF THE BOAT SINKS when the line is pulled apart; below the waterline... dEmO From:Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:Cal_ Boats@yahoogroup s.com] On Behalf Of Helen Horn Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 3:40 PM To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing Wow guys, how expensive is 2 feet of hose? Just do what Allen said, cut off after the barb on both ends, and then carefully slice a line parallel to the fittings on the remaining one or two inches. Detach at least one of those fittings from the bulkhead or wall behind the toilet. You will need wiggleroom anyway to reattach the new hose, then reattach the fitting you removed. Olive oil helps with refitting the hose. I put the hose end in hot water to soak for a few minutes. That white hose is really a pain, it is not very accurately sized to fit the fittings, since we use hose clamps anyway...they could give us some extra room. All that muscle-straining to attach and reattach the old stuff is hard on us older folks to say nothing of the time it takes. Helen

Helen, I got to thinking about that also. Just replace the sanitation hose, but you will still need to heat it in order to get it flexible enough to go on the fittings. I installed a new holding tank on my 29, made to my specs by Ronco, to fit under the v berth. I also installed 2 vents for the tank, as advised by Peggy, the head expert. It's worked out great. Just pump out frequently. Regards, David Dobbs, Cal29 411 --- On Mon, 7/12/10, Helen Horn <he… [at] sbcglobal.net> wrote: From: Helen Horn <he… [at] sbcglobal.net> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs) To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, July 12, 2010, 6:14 PM oh yeah, turn the through hull valve to off. then walk don't drive and bring a little reusable (eco thought) shopping bag and only $25 to your nearest WM store (free parking so far). much safer and better use of time than fighting with old icky hose. P.S. if you have good old hose clamps you can re-use them too. No matches or flames. fiberglass will burn to the waterline! Then use your anti-terrorist sheetrock knife to carefully make those cuts, keep your fingers out of the way. But I like your shopping list Timm. HH From: "timmothy.lessley@ ch2m.com" <timmothy.lessley@ ch2m.com> To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 3:59:02 PM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs) This will be fun; $10.00 Car @ 0.50/mile x 20 miles $ 4.00 Parking $20.00 2’ Hose @10.00/lf $12.00 4 new clamps @ 3.00 $46.00 but wait there’s more! While at the chandlery saw and also purchased $150.00 Foul weather top (2009) on sale $ 12.00 New pliers $ 8.00 bilge cleaner $ 50.00 LED Flashlight $220.00 $ 46.00 (above) $266.00 $ 21.00 (tax) $287.00 but wait there’s more (Charlie) $1,200 Emergency room visit for 3rd degree burn to finger from hot clamp. $1,487 to do the job… but there could be more??? IF THE BOAT SINKS when the line is pulled apart; below the waterline... dEmO From: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:Cal_ Boats@yahoogroup s.com] On Behalf Of Helen Horn Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 3:40 PM To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing Wow guys, how expensive is 2 feet of hose? Just do what Allen said, cut off after the barb on both ends, and then carefully slice a line parallel to the fittings on the remaining one or two inches. Detach at least one of those fittings from the bulkhead or wall behind the toilet. You will need wiggleroom anyway to reattach the new hose, then reattach the fitting you removed. Olive oil helps with refitting the hose. I put the hose end in hot water to soak for a few minutes. That white hose is really a pain, it is not very accurately sized to fit the fittings, since we use hose clamps anyway...they could give us some extra room. All that muscle-straining to attach and reattach the old stuff is hard on us older folks to say nothing of the time it takes. Helen

I just added one also, that's why it's close to my thoughts. Mine was a special 6 gallon made to fit wrapped around under the Compact version of whatever brand of toilet (Raritan)?. But it can be pulled out by unscrewing the infeed from head and the 1/2 inch vent fitting and then you screw the chain-kept caps, walk up and dump by means of a black cap fitting. Or you can pumpout at stations if you cut in a deckfill/waste fitting. I have the y valve but wrestled the white hose so much, it was going to be either tank or at sea, it is currently only to tank. I capped the old thruhull waste valve till I get organized or change my mind.. My cal 36 has a nice setup..head to holding tank, then a yvalve from the tank that options to station pumpout or to gusher/whale type pump to at sea throughhull with check valve between that. The 29 has its water tank under vberth. there actually was a tank for sale at a Caltopia at Encinal YC a few years back that was shaped to fit in the bulkhead locker behind the head curved to fit the hull. I thought about it too long and it sold quickly. I didn't want to cut anything to install it. The one I have now has two padeyes on the bulkhead behind and webbing straps with shackles to release for emptying. It made it through the 4th July weekend on a cruiseout to Treasure Island with 4adults on board. It always makes it through several weeks of beercan races. It's good you are using the best hose as after a while most hoses permeate with odor and you don't want that in the v berth, so the good ones last longer. Helen From: david dobbs <tm… [at] yahoo.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 5:58:34 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs(Helen) Helen, I got to thinking about that also. Just replace the sanitation hose, but you will still need to heat it in order to get it flexible enough to go on the fittings. I installed a new holding tank on my 29, made to my specs by Ronco, to fit under the v berth. I also installed 2 vents for the tank, as advised by Peggy, the head expert. It's worked out great. Just pump out frequently. Regards, David Dobbs, Cal29 411 --- On Mon, 7/12/10, Helen Horn <helenhorn@sbcglobal .net> wrote: >From: Helen Horn <helenhorn@sbcglobal .net> >Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs) >To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com >Date: Monday, July 12, 2010, 6:14 PM > > > >oh yeah, turn the through hull valve to off. then walk don't drive and bring a >little reusable (eco thought) shopping bag and only $25 to your nearest WM store >(free parking so far). much safer and better use of time than fighting with old >icky hose. P.S. if you have good old hose clamps you can re-use them too. No >matches or flames. fiberglass will burn to the waterline! Then use your >anti-terrorist sheetrock knife to carefully make those cuts, keep your fingers >out of the way. But I like your shopping list Timm. HH > > > > > > From: "timmothy.lessley@ ch2m.com" <timmothy.lessley@ ch2m.com> >To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com >Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 3:59:02 PM >Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs) > > >This will be fun; > >$10.00 Car @ 0.50/mile x 20 miles >$ 4.00 Parking >$20.00 2’ Hose @10.00/lf >$12.00 4 new clamps @ 3.00 >$46.00 but wait there’s more! > >While at the chandlery saw and also purchased > >$150.00 Foul weather top (2009) on sale >$ 12.00 New pliers >$ 8.00 bilge cleaner >$ 50.00 LED Flashlight >$220.00 >$ 46.00 (above) >$266.00 >$ 21.00 (tax) >$287.00 but wait there’s more (Charlie) > >$1,200 Emergency room visit for 3rd degree burn to finger from hot clamp. >$1,487 to do the job… but there could be more??? > >IF THE BOAT SINKS when the line is pulled apart; below the waterline... > >dEmO > > >From:Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com [mailto:Cal_ Boats@yahoogroup s.com] On Behalf >Of Helen Horn >Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 3:40 PM >To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com >Subject: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing > > >Wow guys, how expensive is 2 feet of hose? Just do what Allen said, cut off >after the barb on both ends, and then carefully slice a line parallel to the >fittings on the remaining one or two inches. Detach at least one of those >fittings from the bulkhead or wall behind the toilet. You will need wiggleroom >anyway to reattach the new hose, then reattach the fitting you removed. Olive >oil helps with refitting the hose. I put the hose end in hot water to soak for >a few minutes. That white hose is really a pain, it is not very accurately sized >to fit the fittings, since we use hose clamps anyway...they could give us some >extra room. All that muscle-straining to attach and reattach the old stuff is >hard on us older folks to say nothing of the time it takes. Helen >

I was lucky as BayBreeze, Cal3-29, came with Wilkie's mod and two vents across the top of the tank. Les was right. They make a big difference. Its nice to have the tank there as it keeps everything in one location and its accessible if needed. If you ever do this mod then have the input to the top with a down pipe inside the tank so it fills from the bottom thereby eliminating the vent loop. A baffle inside (vertical) with a hole at the bottom could also be installed to prevent stuff from sloshing around once it gets past the elevation of the hole. This would eliminate the venting loop completely and associated extra hose to get messed up. Cant do it on mine as its a sealed unit, but I think you know what I mean. I dont have a threeway installed and for now its a non issue. If I were to do it, I would make use of as little pipe as possible. Possibly installing a 3/way in the feed pipe, one to the tank, and one to the pump out and complete shutoff. Reduces hose runs, and no need for a vent loop, and no chance of backflow but not sure if the valve can take the pressure of the pump out? would have to check on that. The above is a simple concept for a tank that does not discharge overboard. -- /ch

Thanks, may do permanent type later, baffle is great idea. Not sure if I understand pumpout effect on the open valve as it would need a vent on tank (our 36 has the vent to the tank up to the deck near the waste fitting) so it didn't suck the tank flat, though it would then try to evacuate the head? By the way, what does a 3-29 have that a 29 (1) doesn't? Wheel? ours (Noah's Kid) is a 74. Helen From: chris123 <ch… [at] gmail.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 6:58:41 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs(Helen) I was lucky as BayBreeze, Cal3-29, came with Wilkie's mod and two vents across the top of the tank. Les was right. They make a big difference. Its nice to have the tank there as it keeps everything in one location and its accessible if needed. If you ever do this mod then have the input to the top with a down pipe inside the tank so it fills from the bottom thereby eliminating the vent loop. A baffle inside (vertical) with a hole at the bottom could also be installed to prevent stuff from sloshing around once it gets past the elevation of the hole. This would eliminate the venting loop completely and associated extra hose to get messed up. Cant do it on mine as its a sealed unit, but I think you know what I mean. I dont have a threeway installed and for now its a non issue. If I were to do it, I would make use of as little pipe as possible. Possibly installing a 3/way in the feed pipe, one to the tank, and one to the pump out and complete shutoff. Reduces hose runs, and no need for a vent loop, and no chance of backflow but not sure if the valve can take the pressure of the pump out? would have to check on that. The above is a simple concept for a tank that does not discharge overboard. -- /ch

dEmO, You are really efficient. I rarely get by with only one trip to the marine and / or hardware store. Your list made me laugh, only because it is so true. So heating the hose worked fine and per advice, although armed with a heat gun, I used my wife's hair dryer. The hose came off with a moderate amount of cursing and grunting. The only problem now is that I forgot to bring home the hair dryer. The real cost of this job may be yet to be paid at home. Thanks for the laugh, Terry On Jul 12, 2010, at 3:59 PM, <ti… [at] ch2m.com> wrote: > > This will be fun; > > > > $10.00 Car @ 0.50/mile x 20 miles > > $ 4.00 Parking > > $20.00 2’ Hose @10.00/lf > > $12.00 4 new clamps @ 3.00 > > $46.00 but wait there’s more! > > > > While at the chandlery saw and also purchased > > > > $150.00 Foul weather top (2009) on sale > > $ 12.00 New pliers > > $ 8.00 bilge cleaner > > $ 50.00 LED Flashlight > > $220.00 > > $ 46.00 (above) > > $266.00 > > $ 21.00 (tax) > > $287.00 but wait there’s more (Charlie) > > > > $1,200 Emergency room visit for 3rd degree burn to finger from hot clamp. > > $1,487 to do the job… but there could be more??? > > > > IF THE BOAT SINKS when the line is pulled apart; below the waterline... > > > > dEmO > > > > > > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Helen Horn > Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 3:40 PM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > Subject: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing > > > > > > Wow guys, how expensive is 2 feet of hose? Just do what Allen said, cut off after the barb on both ends, and then carefully slice a line parallel to the fittings on the remaining one or two inches. Detach at least one of those fittings from the bulkhead or wall behind the toilet. You will need wiggleroom anyway to reattach the new hose, then reattach the fitting you removed. Olive oil helps with refitting the hose. I put the hose end in hot water to soak for a few minutes. That white hose is really a pain, it is not very accurately sized to fit the fittings, since we use hose clamps anyway...they could give us some extra room. All that muscle-straining to attach and reattach the old stuff is hard on us older folks to say nothing of the time it takes. Helen > > > >

Yours is similar to the system I am thinking about going to. A tank behind the head, weight in the middle of the boat, and everything goes through the tank either to a pump out or by gravity feed overboard when out far enough that it is legal and / or ethical to do so. I was looking at the system Wilkie had on his website for his Cal 29. Lots shorter hose runs, and except for the gravity feed hose, no standing sewage in any hose. The debate I am having in my mind is between this system where there is some standing black water in the overboard hose or this system from Sealand which would require a pump. The advantage here is due to the standpipes in the tank, there is no sewage sitting in any hose to permeate the walls. Simplicity vs having another pump on board. Still thinking about it... Terry Spencer Cal 2-29 Capriccio Tacoma On Jul 12, 2010, at 6:35 PM, Helen Horn wrote: > My cal 36 has a nice setup..head to holding tank, then a yvalve from the tank that options to station pumpout or to gusher/whale type pump to at sea throughhull with check valve between that.

Attached are some pictures of a 3-29 galley and it is not at all the same....the 29 or 2-29 has the galley down the starboard side. Mark Cal 2-29 for cruszzzzzzzzzzzing and race on an award winning 29 ----- Original Message ----- From: Helen Horn To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 7:41 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs(Helen) Thanks, may do permanent type later, baffle is great idea. Not sure if I understand pumpout effect on the open valve as it would need a vent on tank (our 36 has the vent to the tank up to the deck near the waste fitting) so it didn't suck the tank flat, though it would then try to evacuate the head? By the way, what does a 3-29 have that a 29 (1) doesn't? Wheel? ours (Noah's Kid) is a 74. Helen ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: chris123 <ch… [at] gmail.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 6:58:41 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs(Helen) I was lucky as BayBreeze, Cal3-29, came with Wilkie's mod and two vents across the top of the tank. Les was right. They make a big difference. Its nice to have the tank there as it keeps everything in one location and its accessible if needed. If you ever do this mod then have the input to the top with a down pipe inside the tank so it fills from the bottom thereby eliminating the vent loop. A baffle inside (vertical) with a hole at the bottom could also be installed to prevent stuff from sloshing around once it gets past the elevation of the hole. This would eliminate the venting loop completely and associated extra hose to get messed up. Cant do it on mine as its a sealed unit, but I think you know what I mean. I dont have a threeway installed and for now its a non issue. If I were to do it, I would make use of as little pipe as possible. Possibly installing a 3/way in the feed pipe, one to the tank, and one to the pump out and complete shutoff. Reduces hose runs, and no need for a vent loop, and no chance of backflow but not sure if the valve can take the pressure of the pump out? would have to check on that. The above is a simple concept for a tank that does not discharge overboard. -- /ch __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5273 (20100712) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5273 (20100712) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com

Comments in line.....:) On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 10:41 PM, Helen Horn <he… [at] sbcglobal.net>wrote: > > > Thanks, may do permanent type later, baffle is great idea. Not sure if I > understand pumpout effect on the open valve as it would need a vent on tank > (our 36 has the vent to the tank up to the deck near the waste fitting) so > it didn't suck the tank flat, though it would then try to evacuate the > head? > Thats why i suggested a three way. My tank has two vent hoses one on each side of the tank so there is ventilation across the top. A three way on the hose from the head would, divert to the tank, divert to the pump out, or shut it all down. Possibly a two way with a second single would do the same. I never sail with any sea cocks open other then the water supply to the engine, so there is no need for a venting loop in this configuration. Supply water is from the holding tank, where I'm going to install a valve as well, so nothing can leak into the head or tank. Currently there is a check valve in line, but I'm not a fan. I like mechanical stuff I can turn on or off. I tend to think its safer. Just me preference..:) > By the way, what does a 3-29 have that a 29 (1) doesn't? Wheel? ours > (Noah's Kid) is a 74. Helen > > an optional German Shepherd....breading bitch...that loves to sail. Also known to go swimming at inappropriate times and not being dressed for the occasion. (ie: no PFD on) Yup wheel with spare tiller. Other then that, its basically a mod to the galley, so you loose the starboard quarter birth, and gangway is dead center on removable ladder. The main feature however is a drop leaf table that covers a storage area and folds out from the port bulkhead. This config gives you a real settee on the starboard side. Its make the salon very livable and spacious. Four people can sit comfortably and only touch toes if legs extended on two settees. I can accommodate more of course but that's pushing it for dinner down below. The only drawback is that everyone has to get up, move and the table restored if there is a washroom call or emergency. In summary they moved the galley to the rear quarter almost but not quite similar to the 27 which frees up a lot of space. I believe the hull to be the same but I could be wrong. Others would know better in terms of weights and dimensions between the 29, 2-29 and 3-29. Mine is a 78. They are nice little boats, that when prepared well can do a lot wrt to coastal cruising. The big issue is that they need some work to be single handed with a margin of comfort and safety. Autopilot, additional winches to work the sheets from the behind the wheel, some lines led back and a modern electrical system. Mine was redone so its not bad, but some changes are still needed. Trial and error stuff based on a different usage pattern. A good vhf dsc radio, integrated with a gps receiver and autopilot is a must including a wham and hand held VHF. Reception is poor at times so you need some extra power. Power however is a precious commodity so you have to use both as the need arises. I have a lighted depth gauge which is fine, no wind instruments (nice to have but not that necessary for cruising). The big upgrade for me with respect to electronics/electrical will be a good solar panel and Honda generator as I run one starting and two house batteries, standard lead/acid deep cycle. Someday a hard dodger, but first a decent sea hood, and additional drainage in the cockpit. The rest is maintenance...:) No pressure water, no hot water, foot pump is fine, but a propane heater/furnace is on the list. The Norwegian diesel drip heaters are very nice but would cost me more then the boat, once installed and configured. They are good boats, but not outfitted for coastal cruising. The ground tackle has been upgraded to three anchors. I wanted a bare bones boat so I could rebuild her, and am well pleased with BB. Finally I've really started to appreciate the simplicity of the A-4 and love the motor. More power then needed (one the prop) get changed out and what you send on gas, you save on maintenance. Plus you have the added benefit of being able to repair it yourself which is a bonus if you are stuck in the boonies with adequate spares and tools. Cant do that with a diesel unless you take lots of courses. I'd rather be on the water however...:) Best regards Helen. /ch

Very nice, table different giving you more space if desired, but you lose the quarter berth on the starboard side. Must give you a large lazarette.. what years were these offered? Helen From: Mark Alan Stahnke (MAS Consulting) <ma… [at] cox.net> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 8:27:12 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs(Helen) [4 Attachments] [Attachment(s) from Mark Alan Stahnke (MAS Consulting) included below]  Attached are some pictures of a 3-29 galley and it is not at all the same....the 29 or 2-29 has the galley down the starboard side. Mark Cal 2-29 for cruszzzzzzzzzzzing and race on an award winning 29 >From: Helen Horn >To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com >Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 7:41 PM >Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs(Helen) > > > Thanks, may do permanent type later, baffle is great idea. Not sure if I >understand pumpout effect on the open valve as it would need a vent on tank >(our 36 has the vent to the tank up to the deck near the waste fitting) so it >didn't suck the tank flat, though it would then try to evacuate the head? By >the way, what does a 3-29 have that a 29 (1) doesn't? Wheel? ours (Noah's Kid) >is a 74. Helen > > > > > > From: chris123 <chris.herrnberger@ gmail.com> >To: Cal_Boats@yahoogrou ps.com >Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 6:58:41 PM >Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs(Helen) > > >I was lucky as BayBreeze, Cal3-29, came with Wilkie's mod and two vents >across the top of the tank. Les was right. They make a big difference. > > >Its nice to have the tank there as it keeps everything in one location and >its accessible if needed. If you ever do this mod then have the input to the >top with a down pipe inside the tank so it fills from the bottom thereby >eliminating the vent loop. > > >A baffle inside (vertical) with a hole at the bottom could also be installed >to prevent stuff from sloshing around once it gets past the elevation of the >hole. This would eliminate the venting loop completely and associated extra >hose to get messed up. Cant do it on mine as its a sealed unit, but I think >you know what I mean. > >I dont have a threeway installed and for now its a non issue. If I were to do >it, I would make use of as little pipe as possible. Possibly installing a >3/way in the feed pipe, one to the tank, and one to the pump out and complete >shutoff. Reduces hose runs, and no need for a vent loop, and no chance of >backflow but not sure if the valve can take the pressure of the pump out? >would have to check on that. The above is a simple concept for a tank that >does not discharge overboard. > > >-- >/ch > > >__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature >database 5273 (20100712) __________ > >The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >http://www.eset. com > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5273 (20100712) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset. com

Nice pics. I see you also took out the micro nav table of the port bulkhead. Rather functionless. I'm wondering, I see the heater but where is the stack or is that removable.? /ch

Perhaps something to consider. Pumps fail, gravity doesn't..:) That's a brilliant design Wilkie put together. Enjoy /ch

I dunno, Chris. Gravity is under serious scrutiny in scientific circles. We are going all the way from theories of dark matter and energy that we cannot find, to perturbations in gravitational fields over distances. Perhaps theories related to black holes could be under consideration in our present mail thread. All is tenuous. Cheers Charlie From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of chris123 Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 11:58 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Plumbing ($$$ real world costs(Helen) Perhaps something to consider. Pumps fail, gravity doesn't..:) That's a brilliant design Wilkie put together. Enjoy /ch ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links

I thought it now my duty to offer a caution on gravity installations. Gravity will always be there, but on one occasion failed to overcome the "matter" that had settled and compacted itself into the bottom of my holding tank. Without having done any scientific testing, I can tell you that if you leave your holding tank full long enough there are semi-solids in the mix that apparently will clog the gravity drain leaving you without the option of discharging at sea. Then you have to use a dock-side pump out facility. This happened to me on an Island trip, after my crew (and probably I) had used the head numerous times during Races. I use Odor-Los as an alternative to perfumed tank treatments, and wonder if it was a factor. I no longer am careless about my tank maintenance and have had no further problems. I continue to resist adding valves or pumps. Wilkie On Jul 12, 2010, at 8:57 PM, chris123 wrote: > Perhaps something to consider. Pumps fail, gravity doesn't..:) That's > a brilliant design Wilkie put together. > > Enjoy > > /ch > >

OK Charlie, I concede to your wisdom.....I've learned never contest the opinions of Chesapeake sailors and watermen. They are darn big lads...:) /ch