diesel vs. electric motor

Does anyone have any experience converting a Universal 5432 diesel engine to electric? We have to have a major over-haul done OR maybe convert to electric. Many thanks. Phileta Cal 35 MK III

Greetings, I have converted my Cal 2-34 Footloose from Westerbeke W-30 to Electric Yacht i130ib, following on what Bob Wise did with "So It Goes", his Cal 34. Here's a before and after shot of Footloose. Kirk On 8/30/2010 10:36 AM, phibobear wrote: > > Does anyone have any experience converting a Universal 5432 diesel engine to > electric? We have to have a major over-haul done OR maybe convert to electric. > Many thanks. > > Phileta > Cal 35 MK III > > -- Kirk Grier kg… [at] kirkgrier.com

Wow! Lovely. How much did it cost? How does it do in heavy winds and current? Have you gone cruising with it? Any issues? Do you have solar or genset or both? Etc., etc., etc.! Thanks so much! Phileta On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 12:58 PM, Kirk Grier <kg… [at] kirkgrier.com> wrote: > > [Attachment(s) <#12ac4269b12df19a_TopText> from Kirk Grier included > below] > > Greetings, > > I have converted my Cal 2-34 Footloose from Westerbeke W-30 to Electric > Yacht i130ib, following on what Bob Wise did with "So It Goes", his Cal 34. > Here's a before and after shot of Footloose. > > Kirk > > On 8/30/2010 10:36 AM, phibobear wrote: > > > > Does anyone have any experience converting a Universal 5432 diesel engine > to electric? We have to have a major over-haul done OR maybe convert to > electric. > Many thanks. > > Phileta > Cal 35 MK III > > > -- > Kirk Gr… [at] kirkgrier.com > > >

Phileta, I've been meaning to put together info on the build, but just haven't gotten to it yet. Your note is a motivator but I'll include some info and links you might find interesting. To set the stage, it's pretty easy to jump into a philosophical discussion on Internal Combustion vs Electric, with one side thinking the others are heretics. But for me it's about how one uses a boat 98% of the time, not one vs. the other. Footloose is in Ventura, CA. Few of the sailboats around me even leave the slip. Those that do are day sailing, or going 20 miles to the Channel Islands to over night / weekend. That's what Footloose does - and she's a sailboat first and foremost. For this use, the electric motor is no different than the diesel, except w/o the fuel, smell, noise, vibration, maintenance and "will it start when I need it" hassles. Yet an electric motor today is probably a poor choice if you intend extended passage making under power - but some still do it :) I spent $8200 so far. I could have shaved $2600 off by using Sam's Club golf cart batts, forgone the prop and watering system, and even the generator as I borrow one now. I don't need it for the day sails and single overnighter. But my goal was to use the boat no different than I had been, with the fewest limitations. I did all the work myself. Worst job by far was cleaning up the toxic waste in the bilge. The 12V tap is to have another "emer" source for house loads in addition to the 12V house bank. Gotta keep the beer cold (and VacuFlush head flushing as senior management says "no buckets, bucko" :) - Electric Yacht 130ib kit was $4000 - 280Ah battery bank ( 8 x 6v batteries in series) - $1600 - Perfect Pitch Propeller $440 - Battery Watering System $150 - 48V/25A QuickCharge Charger $470 - Cabling and tool and misc - $500 - Vicor 48V to 12V power tap - $50 used (ebay) - Honda 2000 generator - $1000 The following figures are with the current prop, the PP is not yet installed and should provide a +/- 20% improvement in power draw. She will power at 3+ knots in light conditions pulling @40 amps. At that draw I have about 5-6 hours of range on the battery bank. The gen driving the charger will replace 20-25 amps, extending time or allowing for greater draw. @100 amps gets 5+ knots but will draw the bank down quickly. Your battery technology choice has a bearing on how quickly you can pull power for how long. One thing that is nice is on those low-wind days where you are moving less than 2 knots under sail with the sails slatting, and guests turning green, is dialing in 15 amps of epower - settles the boat and makes noticeable difference in boat speed. All without a sound. Yep not a 100% sailboat anymore, but much more enjoyable for many. The body is buried on electric power in how to replenish your battery bank i.e. how to power that electric motor long-term. Under sail the system will regen, but the replaced power is trivial in my use. There are hybrid systems coming to market which do the diesel genset - electric motor thing ala a locomotive or cruise ship, but these are big bucks and often have high voltage challenges. Solar and Wind can help but they generally do not provide enough power for real-time draw. That leads to some links on what others are doing: Boat Bits Blog - - This Bob Wise and "So It Goes", cruising the Caribbean in a Cal 34 with Electric Yacht epower. http://boatbits.blogspot.com/ Bianka Log Blog - http://biankablog.blogspot.com/ - Nonsuch 30 w/ AMSO Thoosa epower. http://biankablog.blogspot.com/search/label/converting%20to%20electric%20propulsion Yahoo Electric Boats Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/electricboats/ Electric Yacht http://www.electricyacht.com/ Hope this helps! - Kirk On 8/30/2010 11:11 AM, Phileta Riley wrote: > > Wow! Lovely. How much did it cost? How does it do in heavy winds and > current? Have you gone cruising with it? Any issues? Do you have solar or > genset or both? Etc., etc., etc.! > > Thanks so much! > Phileta > > On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 12:58 PM, Kirk Grier <kg… [at] kirkgrier.com > <mailto:kg… [at] kirkgrier.com>> wrote: > > [Attachment(s) <#12ac4269b12df19a_TopText> from Kirk Grier included below] > > Greetings, > > I have converted my Cal 2-34 Footloose from Westerbeke W-30 to Electric > Yacht i130ib, following on what Bob Wise did with "So It Goes", his Cal > 34. Here's a before and after shot of Footloose. > > Kirk > > On 8/30/2010 10:36 AM, phibobear wrote: > >> Does anyone have any experience converting a Universal 5432 diesel >> engine to electric? We have to have a major over-haul done OR maybe >> convert to electric. >> Many thanks. >> >> Phileta >> Cal 35 MK III >> > > -- > Kirk Grier > kg… [at] kirkgrier.com <mailto:kg… [at] kirkgrier.com> > > > -- Kirk Grier kg… [at] kirkgrier.com

has anyone done research on the explosive nature of lead acid batteries particularly when losing a cell. the battery gases hydrogen gas which is very volitile, in an enclosed battery storage this might be a problem consider or are considering changing the Ramblin Rose to a hybred gene From: Kirk Grier <kg… [at] kirkgrier.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, August 30, 2010 1:58:16 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] diesel vs. electric motor [2 Attachments] [Attachment(s) from Kirk Grier included below] Greetings, I have converted my Cal 2-34 Footloose from Westerbeke W-30 to Electric Yacht i130ib, following on what Bob Wise did with "So It Goes", his Cal 34. Here's a before and after shot of Footloose. Kirk On 8/30/2010 10:36 AM, phibobear wrote: >Does anyone have any experience converting a Universal 5432 diesel >engine to electric? We have to have a major over-haul done OR >maybe convert to electric. >Many thanks. > >Phileta >Cal 35 MK III > > -- Kirk Grier kg… [at] kirkgrier.com

i think if one buys a surplus motor the cost can really come down there are tones of cheap motors out in the world gene From: Kirk Grier <kg… [at] kirkgrier.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Mon, August 30, 2010 4:43:58 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] diesel vs. electric motor Phileta, I've been meaning to put together info on the build, but just haven't gotten to it yet. Your note is a motivator but I'll include some info and links you might find interesting. To set the stage, it's pretty easy to jump into a philosophical discussion on Internal Combustion vs Electric, with one side thinking the others are heretics. But for me it's about how one uses a boat 98% of the time, not one vs. the other. Footloose is in Ventura, CA. Few of the sailboats around me even leave the slip. Those that do are day sailing, or going 20 miles to the Channel Islands to over night / weekend. That's what Footloose does - and she's a sailboat first and foremost. For this use, the electric motor is no different than the diesel, except w/o the fuel, smell, noise, vibration, maintenance and "will it start when I need it" hassles. Yet an electric motor today is probably a poor choice if you intend extended passage making under power - but some still do it :) I spent $8200 so far. I could have shaved $2600 off by using Sam's Club golf cart batts, forgone the prop and watering system, and even the generator as I borrow one now. I don't need it for the day sails and single overnighter. But my goal was to use the boat no different than I had been, with the fewest limitations. I did all the work myself. Worst job by far was cleaning up the toxic waste in the bilge. The 12V tap is to have another "emer" source for house loads in addition to the 12V house bank. Gotta keep the beer cold (and VacuFlush head flushing as senior management says "no buckets, bucko" :) - Electric Yacht 130ib kit was $4000 - 280Ah battery bank ( 8 x 6v batteries in series) - $1600 - Perfect Pitch Propeller $440 - Battery Watering System $150 - 48V/25A QuickCharge Charger $470 - Cabling and tool and misc - $500 - Vicor 48V to 12V power tap - $50 used (ebay) - Honda 2000 generator - $1000 The following figures are with the current prop, the PP is not yet installed and should provide a +/- 20% improvement in power draw. She will power at 3+ knots in light conditions pulling @40 amps. At that draw I have about 5-6 hours of range on the battery bank. The gen driving the charger will replace 20-25 amps, extending time or allowing for greater draw. @100 amps gets 5+ knots but will draw the bank down quickly. Your battery technology choice has a bearing on how quickly you can pull power for how long. One thing that is nice is on those low-wind days where you are moving less than 2 knots under sail with the sails slatting, and guests turning green, is dialing in 15 amps of epower - settles the boat and makes noticeable difference in boat speed. All without a sound. Yep not a 100% sailboat anymore, but much more enjoyable for many. The body is buried on electric power in how to replenish your battery bank i.e. how to power that electric motor long-term. Under sail the system will regen, but the replaced power is trivial in my use. There are hybrid systems coming to market which do the diesel genset - electric motor thing ala a locomotive or cruise ship, but these are big bucks and often have high voltage challenges. Solar and Wind can help but they generally do not provide enough power for real-time draw. That leads to some links on what others are doing: Boat Bits Blog - - This Bob Wise and "So It Goes", cruising the Caribbean in a Cal 34 with Electric Yacht epower. http://boatbits.blogspot.com/ Bianka Log Blog - http://biankablog.blogspot.com/ - Nonsuch 30 w/ AMSO Thoosa epower. http://biankablog.blogspot.com/search/label/converting%20to%20electric%20propulsion Yahoo Electric Boats Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/electricboats/ Electric Yacht http://www.electricyacht.com/ Hope this helps! - Kirk On 8/30/2010 11:11 AM, Phileta Riley wrote: >Wow! Lovely. How much did it cost? How does it do in heavy >winds and current? Have you gone cruising with it? Any issues? >Do you have solar or genset or both? Etc., etc., etc.! > >Thanks so much! >Phileta > > >On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 12:58 PM, Kirk Grier <kg… [at] kirkgrier.com> >wrote: > > >>[Attachment(s) from Kirk Grier included below] >>Greetings, >> >>I have converted my Cal 2-34 Footloose from Westerbeke >>W-30 to Electric Yacht i130ib, following on what Bob >>Wise did with "So It Goes", his Cal 34. Here's a >>before and after shot of Footloose. >> >> >>Kirk >> >>On 8/30/2010 10:36 AM, phibobear wrote: >> >>>Does anyone have any experience converting a >>>Universal 5432 diesel engine to electric? We have >>>to have a major over-haul done OR maybe convert to >>>electric. >>>Many thanks. >>> >>>Phileta >>>Cal 35 MK III >>> >>> > >-- >Kirk Grier >kg… [at] kirkgrier.com > -- Kirk Grier kg… [at] kirkgrier.com

Phileta, I have a 5432 and have good luck with it with about 4k hours. What is wrong with yours? Dave 80 Cal 35 Mk I, Runnin Late Coyote Pt, SF Bay From:

Hi, Dave, Our engine blows blue-grey smoke over 1700rpms and really billows over 2000rpm. The compressions are: 420-380-400-420, BUT wet compression for #2 was 480 and #4 was 560. Do you know what the normal compressions are?? I'm afraid we're looking at a complete overhaul. Do you know a good resource for rebuild kits/parts? The engine hours are only 3000. Thanks, Phileta On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 9:26 AM, biggs dave <im… [at] yahoo.com> wrote: > > > Phileta, > > I have a 5432 and have good luck with it with about 4k hours. What is > wrong with yours? > > Dave > 80 Cal 35 Mk I, Runnin Late > Coyote Pt, SF Bay > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* > > > > > > > >

Dear Kirk, Thanks so much for your detailed account. I *think* we've decided that electric engines (their batteries) are best suited for short runs and light weather. As we're cruising (in Mexico now, planning on going to the South Pacific), we'll be sticking with the diesel- unless we change our mind! Thanks again. Phileta On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 3:43 PM, Kirk Grier <kg… [at] kirkgrier.com> wrote: > > > Phileta, > > I've been meaning to put together info on the build, but just haven't > gotten to it yet. Your note is a motivator but I'll include some info and > links you might find interesting. To set the stage, it's pretty easy to jump > into a philosophical discussion on Internal Combustion vs Electric, with one > side thinking the others are heretics. But for me it's about how one uses a > boat 98% of the time, not one vs. the other. > > Footloose is in Ventura, CA. Few of the sailboats around me even leave the > slip. Those that do are day sailing, or going 20 miles to the Channel > Islands to over night / weekend. That's what Footloose does - and she's a > sailboat first and foremost. For this use, the electric motor is no > different than the diesel, except w/o the fuel, smell, noise, vibration, > maintenance and "will it start when I need it" hassles. Yet an electric > motor today is probably a poor choice if you intend extended passage making > under power - but some still do it :) > > I spent $8200 so far. I could have shaved $2600 off by using Sam's Club > golf cart batts, forgone the prop and watering system, and even the > generator as I borrow one now. I don't need it for the day sails and single > overnighter. But my goal was to use the boat no different than I had been, > with the fewest limitations. I did all the work myself. Worst job by far > was cleaning up the toxic waste in the bilge. The 12V tap is to have another > "emer" source for house loads in addition to the 12V house bank. Gotta keep > the beer cold (and VacuFlush head flushing as senior management says "no > buckets, bucko" :) > > - Electric Yacht 130ib kit was $4000 > - 280Ah battery bank ( 8 x 6v batteries in series) - $1600 > - Perfect Pitch Propeller $440 > - Battery Watering System $150 > - 48V/25A QuickCharge Charger $470 > - Cabling and tool and misc - $500 > - Vicor 48V to 12V power tap - $50 used (ebay) > - Honda 2000 generator - $1000 > > The following figures are with the current prop, the PP is not yet > installed and should provide a +/- 20% improvement in power draw. She will > power at 3+ knots in light conditions pulling @40 amps. At that draw I have > about 5-6 hours of range on the battery bank. The gen driving the charger > will replace 20-25 amps, extending time or allowing for greater draw. @100 > amps gets 5+ knots but will draw the bank down quickly. Your battery > technology choice has a bearing on how quickly you can pull power for how > long. One thing that is nice is on those low-wind days where you are moving > less than 2 knots under sail with the sails slatting, and guests turning > green, is dialing in 15 amps of epower - settles the boat and makes > noticeable difference in boat speed. All without a sound. Yep not a 100% > sailboat anymore, but much more enjoyable for many. > > The body is buried on electric power in how to replenish your battery bank > i.e. how to power that electric motor long-term. Under sail the system will > regen, but the replaced power is trivial in my use. There are hybrid systems > coming to market which do the diesel genset - electric motor thing ala a > locomotive or cruise ship, but these are big bucks and often have high > voltage challenges. Solar and Wind can help but they generally do not > provide enough power for real-time draw. > > That leads to some links on what others are doing: > > Boat Bits Blog - - This Bob Wise and "So It Goes", cruising the Caribbean > in a Cal 34 with Electric Yacht epower. > http://boatbits.blogspot.com/ > > Bianka Log Blog - http://biankablog.blogspot.com/ - Nonsuch 30 w/ AMSO > Thoosa epower. > > http://biankablog.blogspot.com/search/label/converting%20to%20electric%20propulsion > > Yahoo Electric Boats Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/electricboats/ > > Electric Yacht > http://www.electricyacht.com/ > > Hope this helps! - Kirk > > > > > On 8/30/2010 11:11 AM, Phileta Riley wrote: > > > > Wow! Lovely. How much did it cost? How does it do in heavy winds and > current? Have you gone cruising with it? Any issues? Do you have solar or > genset or both? Etc., etc., etc.! > > Thanks so much! > Phileta > > On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 12:58 PM, Kirk Grier <kg… [at] kirkgrier.com> wrote: > >> >> [Attachment(s) <#12ac4be36d3521d3_12ac4269b12df19a_TopText> from Kirk >> Grier included below] >> >> Greetings, >> >> I have converted my Cal 2-34 Footloose from Westerbeke W-30 to Electric >> Yacht i130ib, following on what Bob Wise did with "So It Goes", his Cal 34. >> Here's a before and after shot of Footloose. >> >> Kirk >> >> On 8/30/2010 10:36 AM, phibobear wrote: >> >> >> >> Does anyone have any experience converting a Universal 5432 diesel engine >> to electric? We have to have a major over-haul done OR maybe convert to >> electric. >> Many thanks. >> >> Phileta >> Cal 35 MK III >> >> >> -- >> Kirk Gr… [at] kirkgrier.com >> >> > > -- > Kirk Gr… [at] kirkgrier.com > > >

Phileta, Sorry but I don't have any advice on parts or a mechanic. My mechanic left the bay area in 2004 and now there are no mechanics in my part of SF bay. I'm surprised that your engine is gone at 3k. That's really low. Is it possible that all it needs is a head rebuild as opposed to pulling the whole thing? You might try posting another thread and trying to get Joe DeMers advice. He's quite helpful Dave 80 Cal 35 Runnin Late SF Bay > > > > > > From: > > > > >