Re: [Cal_Boats] Re: Lazy Jacks

Dan - If you could send pics that'd be great. Since yours goes under the boom and is retractable I assume you have end boom sheeting and no boom vang or am I missing something? Our boat had lazy jacks but we bought the boat in Maine with the mast down and had it trucked to the Chesapeake. I still have the lines but am certain they were not retractable. Thanks - Paul In a message dated 10/15/2010 11:47:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, da… [at] hotmail.com writes: Paul, I have installed a system on my Cal 43 (WindSwept) of my own design. To be honest, I simply saw how all the others were done, and put my own spin on it. Complete system for under $100, retractable, and unlike a lot of systems, mine will double as a topping lift in a pinch, as I looped under the boom on all legs. I'm sure there are drawbacks to this I've not encountered yet, but as you point out, handling these big sails can be a bear. We went from an hour and a half of swearing (and only getting a marginal flake) with two people, to ten minutes by my self, resulting in a sail that appeared to be put up quite professionally. I'd be happy to send pictures, and chat with you about what I was thinking as I laid it all out. You will have to take a little time to learn how to splice eyes if you want a nice looking installation, but it's not nearly as difficult as some of my friends made it out to be. Dan --- In _C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) , pwestla@... wrote: > > Although I hate to do it I am going to install some form of a lazy jack > system on our Cal 39 this winter. My goal is to make the boat as easy to > double hand as possible with kids on board. Right now we have no roller > furler, no self tailing winches and no lazy jacks. I got the auto pilot working > which is a big help but sail handling needs to be simplified. Roller > furler is on order. If I have any money left I hope to find used self tailers > to replace my Barient 28's or get winchmates for them. > > So, not ever having dealt with lazy jacks except on charter boats in the > BVI's does anyone have any do's or don'ts or advice? We like to race so we > want them retractable and if there is a way to make them easily removable > that'd be the best. The potential issue with the retraction is that we have > 3 halyard/lines exiting each side of the mast and will also be re-rigging > the spin car to have a 2:1 purchase so the stbd side of the mast will have > one more line to deal with. > > Thanks in advance - > > Paul West > Adventure Kwest > '80 Cal 39 >

Looks like we're supposed to have some good weather here in the north west, so I'll take down the rain fly, and take a series of pictures with the sail up, coming down, etc. try to capture the workings of the system. If I'm especially clever, and can enlist the help of a camera person, maybe I'll figure out how to post a video. Look for a post sometime in the next couple days. Dan --- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, pwestla@... wrote: > > Dan - > > If you could send pics that'd be great. Since yours goes under the boom > and is retractable I assume you have end boom sheeting and no boom vang or > am I missing something? > > Our boat had lazy jacks but we bought the boat in Maine with the mast down > and had it trucked to the Chesapeake. I still have the lines but am > certain they were not retractable. > > Thanks - > > Paul > > > In a message dated 10/15/2010 11:47:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > danmccut@... writes: > > > > > Paul, > I have installed a system on my Cal 43 (WindSwept) of my own design. To be > honest, I simply saw how all the others were done, and put my own spin on > it. Complete system for under $100, retractable, and unlike a lot of > systems, mine will double as a topping lift in a pinch, as I looped under the > boom on all legs. I'm sure there are drawbacks to this I've not encountered > yet, but as you point out, handling these big sails can be a bear. We went > from an hour and a half of swearing (and only getting a marginal flake) with > two people, to ten minutes by my self, resulting in a sail that appeared to > be put up quite professionally. I'd be happy to send pictures, and chat > with you about what I was thinking as I laid it all out. You will have to > take a little time to learn how to splice eyes if you want a nice looking > installation, but it's not nearly as difficult as some of my friends made it > out to be. > > Dan > > --- In _C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) , > pwestla@ wrote: > > > > Although I hate to do it I am going to install some form of a lazy jack > > system on our Cal 39 this winter. My goal is to make the boat as easy to > > double hand as possible with kids on board. Right now we have no roller > > furler, no self tailing winches and no lazy jacks. I got the auto pilot > working > > which is a big help but sail handling needs to be simplified. Roller > > furler is on order. If I have any money left I hope to find used self > tailers > > to replace my Barient 28's or get winchmates for them. > > > > So, not ever having dealt with lazy jacks except on charter boats in the > > BVI's does anyone have any do's or don'ts or advice? We like to race so > we > > want them retractable and if there is a way to make them easily > removable > > that'd be the best. The potential issue with the retraction is that we > have > > 3 halyard/lines exiting each side of the mast and will also be > re-rigging > > the spin car to have a 2:1 purchase so the stbd side of the mast will > have > > one more line to deal with. > > > > Thanks in advance - > > > > Paul West > > Adventure Kwest > > '80 Cal 39 > > >

Sounds great Dan we all look forward to the photos. In the meantime I am still curious to know if you have end boom sheeting or a boom vang? I ask because it would seem impossible (off the top of my head) to have a retractable system that loops under the boom if you have mid boom sheeting and/or a boom vang. Thanks Paul In a message dated 10/15/2010 12:45:30 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, da… [at] hotmail.com writes: Looks like we're supposed to have some good weather here in the north west, so I'll take down the rain fly, and take a series of pictures with the sail up, coming down, etc. try to capture the workings of the system. If I'm especially clever, and can enlist the help of a camera person, maybe I'll figure out how to post a video. Look for a post sometime in the next couple days. Dan --- In _C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) , pwestla@... wrote: > > Dan - > > If you could send pics that'd be great. Since yours goes under the boom > and is retractable I assume you have end boom sheeting and no boom vang or > am I missing something? > > Our boat had lazy jacks but we bought the boat in Maine with the mast down > and had it trucked to the Chesapeake. I still have the lines but am > certain they were not retractable. > > Thanks - > > Paul > > > In a message dated 10/15/2010 11:47:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > danmccut@... writes: > > > > > Paul, > I have installed a system on my Cal 43 (WindSwept) of my own design. To be > honest, I simply saw how all the others were done, and put my own spin on > it. Complete system for under $100, retractable, and unlike a lot of > systems, mine will double as a topping lift in a pinch, as I looped under the > boom on all legs. I'm sure there are drawbacks to this I've not encountered > yet, but as you point out, handling these big sails can be a bear. We went > from an hour and a half of swearing (and only getting a marginal flake) with > two people, to ten minutes by my self, resulting in a sail that appeared to > be put up quite professionally. I'd be happy to send pictures, and chat > with you about what I was thinking as I laid it all out. You will have to > take a little time to learn how to splice eyes if you want a nice looking > installation, but it's not nearly as difficult as some of my friends made it > out to be. > > Dan > > --- In __… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:_C… [at] yahoogroups.com) _ (mailto:_C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) ) , > pwestla@ wrote: > > > > Although I hate to do it I am going to install some form of a lazy jack > > system on our Cal 39 this winter. My goal is to make the boat as easy to > > double hand as possible with kids on board. Right now we have no roller > > furler, no self tailing winches and no lazy jacks. I got the auto pilot > working > > which is a big help but sail handling needs to be simplified. Roller > > furler is on order. If I have any money left I hope to find used self > tailers > > to replace my Barient 28's or get winchmates for them. > > > > So, not ever having dealt with lazy jacks except on charter boats in the > > BVI's does anyone have any do's or don'ts or advice? We like to race so > we > > want them retractable and if there is a way to make them easily > removable > > that'd be the best. The potential issue with the retraction is that we > have > > 3 halyard/lines exiting each side of the mast and will also be > re-rigging > > the spin car to have a 2:1 purchase so the stbd side of the mast will > have > > one more line to deal with. > > > > Thanks in advance - > > > > Paul West > > Adventure Kwest > > '80 Cal 39 > > >

Many thanks....its really appreciated. /ch

Paul, It's difficult for me to put into words. The photos should, I hope, make it clearer. I'll give it a try though. I have mid boom sheeting and no vang. Imagine the boom laying on the ground. I form two loops, say about 15 feet in diameter (don't wory about actual dimentions, 15 feet is inacurate, just forming a visual.) Stretch out the loops on the ground so that they form elipses so that the sides are seperated by an equal distance that is evenly divisable into the length of the boom, and lay the boom right in the middle of them. You now have the basis of a 4 leg lazy jack system with each leg looping under the boom, and continuing into the same leg on the other side of the boom. So the first two legs are actually a continuous loop starting at the front left, down under the boom, up to a bridal ring, down to number 2 leg on the right, under the boom, up to a bridal ring, and finially back down to the front left. Duplicate for the next two legs. Of course there is hardware involved, I use plastic fairleads on each side of the boom just above were the leg loops under the boom. I hope this helps. I'm not that good at describing this in words. Picture will be worth at least two thousand words on this one. Try to get some out later today. It's really not as complicated as it sounds. The hard part is doing the math to the legs all line up in the retracted position. I missed a little bit, but still very servicable. Dan --- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, pwestla@... wrote: > > Sounds great Dan we all look forward to the photos. > > In the meantime I am still curious to know if you have end boom sheeting > or a boom vang? I ask because it would seem impossible (off the top of my > head) to have a retractable system that loops under the boom if you have > mid boom sheeting and/or a boom vang. > > Thanks > > Paul > > > In a message dated 10/15/2010 12:45:30 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > danmccut@... writes: > > > > > > Looks like we're supposed to have some good weather here in the north > west, so I'll take down the rain fly, and take a series of pictures with the > sail up, coming down, etc. try to capture the workings of the system. If I'm > especially clever, and can enlist the help of a camera person, maybe I'll > figure out how to post a video. Look for a post sometime in the next couple > days. > > Dan > > --- In _C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) , > pwestla@ wrote: > > > > Dan - > > > > If you could send pics that'd be great. Since yours goes under the boom > > and is retractable I assume you have end boom sheeting and no boom vang > or > > am I missing something? > > > > Our boat had lazy jacks but we bought the boat in Maine with the mast > down > > and had it trucked to the Chesapeake. I still have the lines but am > > certain they were not retractable. > > > > Thanks - > > > > Paul > > > > > > In a message dated 10/15/2010 11:47:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > > danmccut@ writes: > > > > > > > > > > Paul, > > I have installed a system on my Cal 43 (WindSwept) of my own design. To > be > > honest, I simply saw how all the others were done, and put my own spin > on > > it. Complete system for under $100, retractable, and unlike a lot of > > systems, mine will double as a topping lift in a pinch, as I looped > under the > > boom on all legs. I'm sure there are drawbacks to this I've not > encountered > > yet, but as you point out, handling these big sails can be a bear. We > went > > from an hour and a half of swearing (and only getting a marginal flake) > with > > two people, to ten minutes by my self, resulting in a sail that appeared > to > > be put up quite professionally. I'd be happy to send pictures, and chat > > with you about what I was thinking as I laid it all out. You will have > to > > take a little time to learn how to splice eyes if you want a nice > looking > > installation, but it's not nearly as difficult as some of my friends > made it > > out to be. > > > > Dan > > > > --- In __… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:_C… [at] yahoogroups.com) > _ (mailto:_C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) ) > , > > pwestla@ wrote: > > > > > > Although I hate to do it I am going to install some form of a lazy > jack > > > system on our Cal 39 this winter. My goal is to make the boat as easy > to > > > double hand as possible with kids on board. Right now we have no > roller > > > furler, no self tailing winches and no lazy jacks. I got the auto > pilot > > working > > > which is a big help but sail handling needs to be simplified. Roller > > > furler is on order. If I have any money left I hope to find used self > > tailers > > > to replace my Barient 28's or get winchmates for them. > > > > > > So, not ever having dealt with lazy jacks except on charter boats in > the > > > BVI's does anyone have any do's or don'ts or advice? We like to race > so > > we > > > want them retractable and if there is a way to make them easily > > removable > > > that'd be the best. The potential issue with the retraction is that we > > have > > > 3 halyard/lines exiting each side of the mast and will also be > > re-rigging > > > the spin car to have a 2:1 purchase so the stbd side of the mast will > > have > > > one more line to deal with. > > > > > > Thanks in advance - > > > > > > Paul West > > > Adventure Kwest > > > '80 Cal 39 > > > > > >

Dan - Believe it or not I think I got it and it sounds like you may want to get a patent on it . . . just not before you share it with us ;-) Thanks - Paul In a message dated 10/15/2010 1:13:53 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, da… [at] hotmail.com writes: Paul, It's difficult for me to put into words. The photos should, I hope, make it clearer. I'll give it a try though. I have mid boom sheeting and no vang. Imagine the boom laying on the ground. I form two loops, say about 15 feet in diameter (don't wory about actual dimentions, 15 feet is inacurate, just forming a visual.) Stretch out the loops on the ground so that they form elipses so that the sides are seperated by an equal distance that is evenly divisable into the length of the boom, and lay the boom right in the middle of them. You now have the basis of a 4 leg lazy jack system with each leg looping under the boom, and continuing into the same leg on the other side of the boom. So the first two legs are actually a continuous loop starting at the front left, down under the boom, up to a bridal ring, down to number 2 leg on the right, under the boom, up to a bridal ring, and finially back down to the front left. Duplicate for the next two legs. Of course there is hardware involved, I use plastic fairleads on each side of the boom just above were the leg loops under the boom. I hope this helps. I'm not that good at describing this in words. Picture will be worth at least two thousand words on this one. Try to get some out later today. It's really not as complicated as it sounds. The hard part is doing the math to the legs all line up in the retracted position. I missed a little bit, but still very servicable. Dan --- In _C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) , pwestla@... wrote: > > Sounds great Dan we all look forward to the photos. > > In the meantime I am still curious to know if you have end boom sheeting > or a boom vang? I ask because it would seem impossible (off the top of my > head) to have a retractable system that loops under the boom if you have > mid boom sheeting and/or a boom vang. > > Thanks > > Paul > > > In a message dated 10/15/2010 12:45:30 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > danmccut@... writes: > > > > > > Looks like we're supposed to have some good weather here in the north > west, so I'll take down the rain fly, and take a series of pictures with the > sail up, coming down, etc. try to capture the workings of the system. If I'm > especially clever, and can enlist the help of a camera person, maybe I'll > figure out how to post a video. Look for a post sometime in the next couple > days. > > Dan > > --- In __… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:_C… [at] yahoogroups.com) _ (mailto:_C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) ) , > pwestla@ wrote: > > > > Dan - > > > > If you could send pics that'd be great. Since yours goes under the boom > > and is retractable I assume you have end boom sheeting and no boom vang > or > > am I missing something? > > > > Our boat had lazy jacks but we bought the boat in Maine with the mast > down > > and had it trucked to the Chesapeake. I still have the lines but am > > certain they were not retractable. > > > > Thanks - > > > > Paul > > > > > > In a message dated 10/15/2010 11:47:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > > danmccut@ writes: > > > > > > > > > > Paul, > > I have installed a system on my Cal 43 (WindSwept) of my own design. To > be > > honest, I simply saw how all the others were done, and put my own spin > on > > it. Complete system for under $100, retractable, and unlike a lot of > > systems, mine will double as a topping lift in a pinch, as I looped > under the > > boom on all legs. I'm sure there are drawbacks to this I've not > encountered > > yet, but as you point out, handling these big sails can be a bear. We > went > > from an hour and a half of swearing (and only getting a marginal flake) > with > > two people, to ten minutes by my self, resulting in a sail that appeared > to > > be put up quite professionally. I'd be happy to send pictures, and chat > > with you about what I was thinking as I laid it all out. You will have > to > > take a little time to learn how to splice eyes if you want a nice > looking > > installation, but it's not nearly as difficult as some of my friends > made it > > out to be. > > > > Dan > > > > --- In __… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:__… [at] yahoogroups.com) _ (mailto:__… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:_C… [at] yahoogroups.com) ) > _ (mailto:__… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:_C… [at] yahoogroups.com) _ (mailto:_C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) ) ) > , > > pwestla@ wrote: > > > > > > Although I hate to do it I am going to install some form of a lazy > jack > > > system on our Cal 39 this winter. My goal is to make the boat as easy > to > > > double hand as possible with kids on board. Right now we have no > roller > > > furler, no self tailing winches and no lazy jacks. I got the auto > pilot > > working > > > which is a big help but sail handling needs to be simplified. Roller > > > furler is on order. If I have any money left I hope to find used self > > tailers > > > to replace my Barient 28's or get winchmates for them. > > > > > > So, not ever having dealt with lazy jacks except on charter boats in > the > > > BVI's does anyone have any do's or don'ts or advice? We like to race > so > > we > > > want them retractable and if there is a way to make them easily > > removable > > > that'd be the best. The potential issue with the retraction is that we > > have > > > 3 halyard/lines exiting each side of the mast and will also be > > re-rigging > > > the spin car to have a 2:1 purchase so the stbd side of the mast will > > have > > > one more line to deal with. > > > > > > Thanks in advance - > > > > > > Paul West > > > Adventure Kwest > > > '80 Cal 39 > > > > > >

Danny - Yeah, right now since we have a new crispy, heavy dacron main, getting it flaked right can be a pain in the arse in higher winds with 3 people on it and one driving the boat. I'm hoping to simplify that to the point my wife and I can git r dun with minimal issues. I've heard nothing but good things about winchmates, even Practical Sailor recommends them. These are the real thing, not the rubber pieces some places sell. The winchmates are about $600 a piece or 1/4 the cost of a new winch the size of a Barient 28. That said, I will search all winter for self tailing winches before resorting to them. Thanks - Paul In a message dated 10/15/2010 5:52:36 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, db… [at] easystreet.net writes: Paul: Our 34 came with LazyJacks and they are one of the most valued pieces of equipment on board. They take out some of the dropping-the-sail-pucker-factor for us. It's nice to know we can drop the main in a pinch and know where it will fall. Mine is retractable and this prevents the sail from fouling the LazyJack during hoist. It's as simple as a couple bungies at the mast. I just want to add a boom brake and we'll be set. Lastly, I'm not as confident in the Winchmates as you. They are not a replacement for a self tailer as they don't arrest heavy drag as well. have you searched for good, used winches? Good luck, Danny --- In _C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) , pwestla@... wrote: > > Although I hate to do it I am going to install some form of a lazy jack > system on our Cal 39 this winter. My goal is to make the boat as easy to > double hand as possible with kids on board. Right now we have no roller > furler, no self tailing winches and no lazy jacks. I got the auto pilot working > which is a big help but sail handling needs to be simplified. Roller > furler is on order. If I have any money left I hope to find used self tailers > to replace my Barient 28's or get winchmates for them. > > So, not ever having dealt with lazy jacks except on charter boats in the > BVI's does anyone have any do's or don'ts or advice? We like to race so we > want them retractable and if there is a way to make them easily removable > that'd be the best. The potential issue with the retraction is that we have > 3 halyard/lines exiting each side of the mast and will also be re-rigging > the spin car to have a 2:1 purchase so the stbd side of the mast will have > one more line to deal with. > > Thanks in advance - > > Paul West > Adventure Kwest > '80 Cal 39 >

I did the same as Dan on our Cal Cr. 36 - loops under the boom, retracts onto plastic cleats just fwd of gooseneck, works reasonably well. Ours is a simple non-race boat, so we don't have all that much stuff on the mast (though it's all outside). Bill Symes S/V Sara E. From: daneasysailing <da… [at] hotmail.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, October 15, 2010 11:45:19 AM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Re: Lazy Jacks Looks like we're supposed to have some good weather here in the north west, so I'll take down the rain fly, and take a series of pictures with the sail up, coming down, etc. try to capture the workings of the system. If I'm especially clever, and can enlist the help of a camera person, maybe I'll figure out how to post a video. Look for a post sometime in the next couple days. Dan --- In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, pwestla@... wrote: > > Dan - > > If you could send pics that'd be great. Since yours goes under the boom > and is retractable I assume you have end boom sheeting and no boom vang or > am I missing something? > > Our boat had lazy jacks but we bought the boat in Maine with the mast down > and had it trucked to the Chesapeake. I still have the lines but am > certain they were not retractable. > > Thanks - > > Paul > > > In a message dated 10/15/2010 11:47:43 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > danmccut@... writes: > > > > > Paul, > I have installed a system on my Cal 43 (WindSwept) of my own design. To be > honest, I simply saw how all the others were done, and put my own spin on > it. Complete system for under $100, retractable, and unlike a lot of > systems, mine will double as a topping lift in a pinch, as I looped under the > boom on all legs. I'm sure there are drawbacks to this I've not encountered > yet, but as you point out, handling these big sails can be a bear. We went > from an hour and a half of swearing (and only getting a marginal flake) with > two people, to ten minutes by my self, resulting in a sail that appeared to > be put up quite professionally. I'd be happy to send pictures, and chat > with you about what I was thinking as I laid it all out. You will have to > take a little time to learn how to splice eyes if you want a nice looking > installation, but it's not nearly as difficult as some of my friends made it > out to be. > > Dan > > --- In _C… [at] yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com) , > pwestla@ wrote: > > > > Although I hate to do it I am going to install some form of a lazy jack > > system on our Cal 39 this winter. My goal is to make the boat as easy to > > double hand as possible with kids on board. Right now we have no roller > > furler, no self tailing winches and no lazy jacks. I got the auto pilot > working > > which is a big help but sail handling needs to be simplified. Roller > > furler is on order. If I have any money left I hope to find used self > tailers > > to replace my Barient 28's or get winchmates for them. > > > > So, not ever having dealt with lazy jacks except on charter boats in the > > BVI's does anyone have any do's or don'ts or advice? We like to race so > we > > want them retractable and if there is a way to make them easily > removable > > that'd be the best. The potential issue with the retraction is that we > have > > 3 halyard/lines exiting each side of the mast and will also be > re-rigging > > the spin car to have a 2:1 purchase so the stbd side of the mast will > have > > one more line to deal with. > > > > Thanks in advance - > > > > Paul West > > Adventure Kwest > > '80 Cal 39 > > >