Some Topics of Interest from Boat US

Thought there might be some interest from the List on some of these articles. We seem to be real big on lightning, and hitting things, and stuff like that. By, the way I did sail on Lake Ponchartrain (just outside of New Orleans) several times in CAL 25 Nationals competitions. Ponchartrain is apparently pronounced like it is spelled. http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2011/April/ Cheers Charlie

Its a good article and kinda confirms what I was wondering about. The bonding circuit and the conductance circuit need to be separated from each other. On my boat, (3-29) at present, there is no conductance circuit to lead the electrical strike to a disipitator into the water. The factory has bonded all the through hulls with heavy gauge wire to the stanchions and pull/push pits. These are all glassed into the hull as well. So this kinda answers my questions if those wires should be cut or not. For now I will just disconnect them, till I can build a proper lightening dissipation circuit. (I'm using the term circuit rather loosely for lack of a better term) /ch On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 1:02 PM, Husar, Charlie [USA] <hu… [at] bah.com> wrote: > Thought there might be some interest from the List on some of these articles. We seem to be real big on lightning, and hitting things, and stuff like that. By, the way I did sail on Lake Ponchartrain (just outside of New Orleans) several times in CAL 25 Nationals competitions. Ponchartrain is apparently pronounced like it is spelled. > > http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2011/April/ > > Cheers > Charlie \

Said "Pon'-cha-train" down here. Will be there on the north shore tomorrow for a crawfish boil..somebody has a beautiful Cal 33 listed on the area Craigslist http://neworleans.craigslist.org/boa/2313126489.html No pics on this listing but there were some last week. Beau Callipygian From: "Husar, Charlie [USA]" <hu… [at] bah.com> To: "Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, April 8, 2011 12:02:24 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Some Topics of Interest from Boat US Thought there might be some interest from the List on some of these articles. We seem to be real big on lightning, and hitting things, and stuff like that. By, the way I did sail on Lake Ponchartrain (just outside of New Orleans) several times in CAL 25 Nationals competitions. Ponchartrain is apparently pronounced like it is spelled. http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2011/April/ Cheers Charlie

I have an extensive writeup on this topic on L-36.com under articles. On Apr 8, 2011 11:12 AM, "chris123" <ch… [at] gmail.com> wrote: > Its a good article and kinda confirms what I was wondering about. The > bonding circuit and the conductance circuit need to be separated from > each other. On my boat, (3-29) at present, there is no conductance > circuit to lead the electrical strike to a disipitator into the water. > The factory has bonded all the through hulls with heavy gauge wire to > the stanchions and pull/push pits. These are all glassed into the hull > as well. So this kinda answers my questions if those wires should be > cut or not. For now I will just disconnect them, till I can build a > proper lightening dissipation circuit. (I'm using the term circuit > rather loosely for lack of a better term) > > /ch > > > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 1:02 PM, Husar, Charlie [USA] > <hu… [at] bah.com> wrote: >> Thought there might be some interest from the List on some of these articles. We seem to be real big on lightning, and hitting things, and stuff like that. By, the way I did sail on Lake Ponchartrain (just outside of New Orleans) several times in CAL 25 Nationals competitions. Ponchartrain is apparently pronounced like it is spelled. >> >> http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2011/April/ >> >> Cheers >> Charlie > \

Thanks, Beau. Next time I will at least spell it right: "Pontchartrain" Do you use the Causeway bridge very often? Have you seen any/many CAL 25s there? Until the late 90s, they had an active CAL 25 one design fleet in/around Southern Yacht Club. I think Tom Vandiver got his 25 from a woman who sailed it on Pontchartrain. I like the name of your boat. I believe it means "nice butt" or something very close to that. Cheers Charlie From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of The SV Emergency Exit Crew Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 4:09 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Some Topics of Interest from Boat US Said "Pon'-cha-train" down here. Will be there on the north shore tomorrow for a crawfish boil..somebody has a beautiful Cal 33 listed on the area Craigslist http://neworleans.craigslist.org/boa/2313126489.html No pics on this listing but there were some last week. Beau Callipygian From: "Husar, Charlie [USA]" <hu… [at] bah.com> To: "Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, April 8, 2011 12:02:24 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Some Topics of Interest from Boat US Thought there might be some interest from the List on some of these articles. We seem to be real big on lightning, and hitting things, and stuff like that. By, the way I did sail on Lake Ponchartrain (just outside of New Orleans) several times in CAL 25 Nationals competitions. Ponchartrain is apparently pronounced like it is spelled. http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2011/April/ Cheers Charlie

Back at home now so I can expand some. This page has links to half dozen articles on lightning http://l-36.com/lightning.php <http://l-36.com/lightning.php>This article talks about bonding http://l-36.com/bonding2.php <http://l-36.com/bonding2.php>You absolutely don't want the lightning to travel to the through hulls as the boat in the referenced article had. That is, unless you want the lightning to remove them because you really don't like the boat and can swim really well. If you read my article on bonding, you will see I am not a fan of bonding. Only do it if you have to. Lightning protection being one but not to a through hull. Safety from electrocution being another. Preventing electrolysis is not a reason as bonding only increases electrolysis. By the way, after I wrote the article I did some measurements on the issue of disconnecting boat ground from shore ground (use an isolator or transformer). Do this measurement yourself. Connect a digital voltmerter in mA to a wire connected to a zinc and put it over the side in the water. Connect the other probe to boat ground. Then unplug your boat from shore power. If you are isolated, the current reading will not change. I used a $5 voltmeter from Harbor Freight Tools. Allen On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 2:18 PM, Allen Edwards <al… [at] gmail.com>wrote: > I have an extensive writeup on this topic on L-36.com under articles. > On Apr 8, 2011 11:12 AM, "chris123" <ch… [at] gmail.com> wrote: > > Its a good article and kinda confirms what I was wondering about. The > > bonding circuit and the conductance circuit need to be separated from > > each other. On my boat, (3-29) at present, there is no conductance > > circuit to lead the electrical strike to a disipitator into the water. > > The factory has bonded all the through hulls with heavy gauge wire to > > the stanchions and pull/push pits. These are all glassed into the hull > > as well. So this kinda answers my questions if those wires should be > > cut or not. For now I will just disconnect them, till I can build a > > proper lightening dissipation circuit. (I'm using the term circuit > > rather loosely for lack of a better term) > > > > /ch > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 1:02 PM, Husar, Charlie [USA] > > <hu… [at] bah.com> wrote: > >> Thought there might be some interest from the List on some of these > articles. We seem to be real big on lightning, and hitting things, and > stuff like that. By, the way I did sail on Lake Ponchartrain (just outside > of New Orleans) several times in CAL 25 Nationals competitions. > Ponchartrain is apparently pronounced like it is spelled. > >> > >> http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2011/April/ > >> > >> Cheers > >> Charlie > > \ >

Well, Charlie, if you spell it right any at all you'll do better than I usually do, that silent "t" also gets lost on me.. I use the causeway every few months, usually I go across the eastern end at Slidell...most of the time I do any sailboats I see are pretty far from the bridge. Not sure about the Cal25's at SYC, I do see where they had a couple of national championships in the mid 80's 1984 1508 Lipo Bob Kirstine LA Southern Yacht Club, New Orleans 1985 270 Scampi Al Gooch Jack Gooch LA Southern Yacht Club, New Orleans I think their 2 biggest fleets these days are J/22 and Flying Scots. And, yep, that's the name, thanks ! Blame my redhead for that one. I wanted a name that started with "Cal" and she came up with that one.. From: "Husar, Charlie [USA]" <hu… [at] bah.com> To: "Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, April 8, 2011 4:38:00 PM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Some Topics of Interest from Boat US Thanks, Beau. Next time I will at least spell it right: "Pontchartrain" Do you use the Causeway bridge very often? Have you seen any/many CAL 25s there? Until the late 90s, they had an active CAL 25 one design fleet in/around Southern Yacht Club. I think Tom Vandiver got his 25 from a woman who sailed it on Pontchartrain. I like the name of your boat. I believe it means "nice butt" or something very close to that. Cheers Charlie From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of The SV Emergency Exit Crew Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 4:09 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Some Topics of Interest from Boat US Said "Pon'-cha-train" down here. Will be there on the north shore tomorrow for a crawfish boil..somebody has a beautiful Cal 33 listed on the area Craigslist http://neworleans.craigslist.org/boa/2313126489.html No pics on this listing but there were some last week. Beau Callipygian From: "Husar, Charlie [USA]" <hu… [at] bah.com> To: "Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Fri, April 8, 2011 12:02:24 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Some Topics of Interest from Boat US Thought there might be some interest from the List on some of these articles. We seem to be real big on lightning, and hitting things, and stuff like that. By, the way I did sail on Lake Ponchartrain (just outside of New Orleans) several times in CAL 25 Nationals competitions. Ponchartrain is apparently pronounced like it is spelled. http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2011/April/ Cheers Charlie

In a previous career I worked as a broadcast engineer and we spent of lot of the summers down here dodging lightning at the tower sites. Have seen rigid 4" copper pipe outer coax with a hollow 1" copper center conductor melt like a candle after a direct hit..In late summer you can almost count on that kind of afternoon thunderstorm here. Not sure it would translate to boats at all, but we finally researched ways to prevent it somewhat and came up with dissipators We had the tallest tower in a cluster of several in a 6 miles area, and were always getting hurt..wound up looking at a product similar to the candelabra protectors on this page http://www.lbagroup.com/international/tower-lightning-protection.php Actually the company came out and installed them on a trial basis. Our problems ceased and the next guy over got hit the next few times - he installed the system, and the next tallest guy got the hits...salesman told us he only ever had to sell one set in a town, and the rest sold themselves, lol.. I would never have believed they would work, but they did..again I have no knowledge that this applies to sailboats masts, but it sure worked on the towers.. From: Allen Edwards <al… [at] PaloAltoPhoto.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Fri, April 8, 2011 7:41:37 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Some Topics of Interest from Boat US Back at home now so I can expand some. This page has links to half dozen articles on lightning http://l-36.com/lightning.php This article talks about bonding http://l-36.com/bonding2.php You absolutely don't want the lightning to travel to the through hulls as the boat in the referenced article had. That is, unless you want the lightning to remove them because you really don't like the boat and can swim really well. If you read my article on bonding, you will see I am not a fan of bonding. Only do it if you have to. Lightning protection being one but not to a through hull. Safety from electrocution being another. Preventing electrolysis is not a reason as bonding only increases electrolysis. By the way, after I wrote the article I did some measurements on the issue of disconnecting boat ground from shore ground (use an isolator or transformer). Do this measurement yourself. Connect a digital voltmerter in mA to a wire connected to a zinc and put it over the side in the water. Connect the other probe to boat ground. Then unplug your boat from shore power. If you are isolated, the current reading will not change. I used a $5 voltmeter from Harbor Freight Tools. Allen On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 2:18 PM, Allen Edwards <al… [at] gmail.com> wrote: I have an extensive writeup on this topic on L-36.com under articles. >On Apr 8, 2011 11:12 AM, "chris123" <ch… [at] gmail.com> wrote: >> Its a good article and kinda confirms what I was wondering about. The >> bonding circuit and the conductance circuit need to be separated from >> each other. On my boat, (3-29) at present, there is no conductance >> circuit to lead the electrical strike to a disipitator into the water. >> The factory has bonded all the through hulls with heavy gauge wire to >> the stanchions and pull/push pits. These are all glassed into the hull >> as well. So this kinda answers my questions if those wires should be >> cut or not. For now I will just disconnect them, till I can build a >> proper lightening dissipation circuit. (I'm using the term circuit >> rather loosely for lack of a better term) >> >> /ch >> >> >> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 1:02 PM, Husar, Charlie [USA] >> <hu… [at] bah.com> wrote: >>> Thought there might be some interest from the List on some of these articles. >>> We seem to be real big on lightning, and hitting things, and stuff like that. >>> By, the way I did sail on Lake Ponchartrain (just outside of New Orleans) >>>several times in CAL 25 Nationals competitions. Ponchartrain is apparently >>>pronounced like it is spelled. >>> >>> http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2011/April/ >>> >>> Cheers >>> Charlie >> \ >

In reading the web page I would not think it would work on a boat. The theory of the protection is to bring the ground charge up to the sky charge thus removing the voltage difference and preventing the strike. That works because ground isn't that good a conductor so you can change the local charge level. You would never be able to change the local charge of the water, particularly in salt water. But it is a very interesting theory and really cool that it works. It was nice to see the map and the nice dark purple color where I am. Florida, not so much, which does explain the great interest in the subject down there. California ranks 50 on the list of 50 states as I recall in lightning strikes. Allen On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 6:34 PM, The SV Emergency Exit Crew < sv… [at] yahoo.com> wrote: > > > In a previous career I worked as a broadcast engineer and we spent of lot > of the summers down here dodging lightning at the tower sites. Have seen > rigid 4" copper pipe outer coax with a hollow 1" copper center conductor > melt like a candle after a direct hit..In late summer you can almost count > on that kind of afternoon thunderstorm here. Not sure it would translate to > boats at all, but we finally researched ways to prevent it somewhat and came > up with dissipators > > We had the tallest tower in a cluster of several in a 6 miles area, and > were always getting hurt..wound up looking at a product similar to the > candelabra protectors on this page > http://www.lbagroup.com/international/tower-lightning-protection.php > Actually the company came out and installed them on a trial basis. Our > problems ceased and the next guy over got hit the next few times - he > installed the system, and the next tallest guy got the hits...salesman told > us he only ever had to sell one set in a town, and the rest sold themselves, > lol.. > > I would never have believed they would work, but they did..again I have no > knowledge that this applies to sailboats masts, but it sure worked on the > towers.. > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Allen Edwards <al… [at] PaloAltoPhoto.com> > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Sent:* Fri, April 8, 2011 7:41:37 PM > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] Some Topics of Interest from Boat US > > > > Back at home now so I can expand some. This page has links to half dozen > articles on lightning > http://l-36.com/lightning.php > > <http://l-36.com/lightning.php>This article talks about bonding > http://l-36.com/bonding2.php > > <http://l-36.com/bonding2.php>You absolutely don't want the lightning to > travel to the through hulls as the boat in the referenced article had. That > is, unless you want the lightning to remove them because you really don't > like the boat and can swim really well. > > If you read my article on bonding, you will see I am not a fan of bonding. > Only do it if you have to. Lightning protection being one but not to a > through hull. Safety from electrocution being another. Preventing > electrolysis is not a reason as bonding only increases electrolysis. > > By the way, after I wrote the article I did some measurements on the issue > of disconnecting boat ground from shore ground (use an isolator or > transformer). Do this measurement yourself. Connect a digital voltmerter > in mA to a wire connected to a zinc and put it over the side in the water. > Connect the other probe to boat ground. Then unplug your boat from shore > power. If you are isolated, the current reading will not change. I used a > $5 voltmeter from Harbor Freight Tools. > > Allen > > > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 2:18 PM, Allen Edwards <al… [at] gmail.com>wrote: > >> I have an extensive writeup on this topic on L-36.com <http://l-36.com/>under articles. >> On Apr 8, 2011 11:12 AM, "chris123" <ch… [at] gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > Its a good article and kinda confirms what I was wondering about. The >> > bonding circuit and the conductance circuit need to be separated from >> > each other. On my boat, (3-29) at present, there is no conductance >> > circuit to lead the electrical strike to a disipitator into the water. >> > The factory has bonded all the through hulls with heavy gauge wire to >> > the stanchions and pull/push pits. These are all glassed into the hull >> > as well. So this kinda answers my questions if those wires should be >> > cut or not. For now I will just disconnect them, till I can build a >> > proper lightening dissipation circuit. (I'm using the term circuit >> > rather loosely for lack of a better term) >> > >> > /ch >> > >> > >> > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 1:02 PM, Husar, Charlie [USA] >> > <hu… [at] bah.com> wrote: >> >> Thought there might be some interest from the List on some of these >> articles. We seem to be real big on lightning, and hitting things, and >> stuff like that. By, the way I did sail on Lake Ponchartrain (just outside >> of New Orleans) several times in CAL 25 Nationals competitions. >> Ponchartrain is apparently pronounced like it is spelled. >> >> >> >> http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2011/April/ >> >> >> >> Cheers >> >> Charlie >> > \ >> > > >

Don Cassey's book provides that example as well. Sounds good to me. Tks Allen. /ch On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 8:41 PM, Allen Edwards < al… [at] paloaltophoto.com> wrote: > By the way, after I wrote the article I did some measurements on the issue > of disconnecting boat ground from shore ground (use an isolator or > transformer). Do this measurement yourself. Connect a digital voltmerter > in mA to a wire connected to a zinc and put it over the side in the water. > Connect the other probe to boat ground. Then unplug your boat from shore > power. If you are isolated, the current reading will not change. I used a > $5 voltmeter from Harbor Freight Tools. > >