Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutlass bearing and prop installation

I sincerely doubt that your shaft is BRASS, it might be Monel, it may be Bronze, it may be Stainless Steel, but I doubt that it would be Brass. Brass is an alloy of Copper and Zinc, and would not seem strong enough to serve as a prop shaft on a full-size (as opposed to scale model) boat. I would expect it to be too soft. The zinc would (I expect) leach out of the Brass leaving just copper (and quite porous copper at that!) with any stray electrolytic currents. Bronze is an alloy of Copper and Tin. My memory of older boats recalls hearing of shafts made from Monel, and Stainless, and perhaps some Bronze. Perhaps Joe DeMers could chime in here? Rod Johnson, "SUNBIRD" 1979 O'DAY DS II #10201 former co-owner of "NODROG" 1970 CAL 21 #285 On Tue, 3 Apr 2012 11:20:17 -0700 "Mark Alan Stahnke \(MAS Consulting\)" <ma… [at] cox.net> writes: You can confirm the alloy differences in the ASTM American Society of Testing Materials Non Ferrous Metals book. But as I recall generally speaking, bronzes will have significantly more copper base metal or cathode material and the brass will have less copper and much more zinc and lead and other trace components which contribute to its anodic or sacrificial qualities. Example: When designing a multiple component pressure vessel such as a bronze valve, the internal working mechanism would be designed to fail prior to the body. The anodic and cathode value in the stem is inherently less noble than that of the body. A valve that will not close is usually safer than a body separation. With that said, I would think the shaft should be more noble alloy than the propeller. Mark Cal 2-29 From: Bob Ellison To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 4:53 AM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation I guess I still don't know what to do, it's now back on dry, but that can easily be changed. Does anyone's thoughts change if it is a bronze prop on a brass shaft? Thanks Bob From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mike farrell Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 6:10 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation Hi Joe, Would Lanicote be a better choice? How would a lube improve the conductivity of a bare SS shaft and a bare bronze prop? My Best, Mike Farrell From: Allen Edwards <al… [at] gmail.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, April 2, 2012 7:51 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation It would be nice if they were not electrically connected to each other so a dielectric grease like Super Lube might be a good choice. If you could keep them completely electrically insulated, you would not need a zinc. But you can't. But putting a conductive grease between them is certainly just a way to increase electrolysis. Allen On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 7:17 PM, Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> wrote: Hi Mike - I checked with the booklet "prop and shaft installation guide" published by prop and shaft makers. I stand corrected. They say it is permissible to use a thin layer of waterproof grease on the shaft taper. It does not say this grease is mandatory. I suggest that anything containing graphite [ electrically conductive ] or anti seize compounds [ contain metal particles that may also be conductive, and / or may act as grit ] should not be used. Joe DeMers On 4/2/2012 7:52 PM, mike farrell wrote: For 50 years I have used Never Sieze or another lube on SS shafts and props. I will continue to do so. To install a bronze prop with no lube is irresponsible. You are wrong Joe! Stationary Engineer with 50 years experience. My Best, Mike Farrell From: Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, April 2, 2012 6:53 AM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation ALWAYS install a prop dry. Any lubricant, burrs, or grit on the shaft taper will defeat the purpose of the shaft / prop fit. The taper of the shaft and bore of the prop must make at least 75% even contact, or you risk the prop rattling on the shaft taper, and / or the shaft and prop not rotating concentrically. Remember, the correct fit of the prop on the shaft is primary, the shaft key is there as a backup only. DO NOT rely on the shaft key as the primary means of securing the prop to the shaft, as eventually, the key will wear, and the prop will be hammering itself off the shaft. Joe DeMers - owner Sound Marine Diesel LLC SoundMarineDiesel.com phone & fax (860) 666-2184 On 4/1/2012 11:10 PM, Bob Ellison wrote: I replaced the cutless bearing this afternoon. I made a tool similar to the "strut pro" tool. I posted some photos in a folder called 1980 Cal 2-27 Après Ski. The actual bearing replacement went very smoothly, and the tool worked excellent. I watched a couple people fight with their bearings a few years ago. There are no set screws on this strut, so it is a tight fit. The bearing replacement took an hour and 10 minutes and that was with me taking a couple breaks to stand up, one being about 15 minutes talking to the other crazy couple working on their boat. It was about 40 degrees and raining in central New York today, but the yard wants me in this week. If I had a second person so that we could tighten each side at the same time it would have been really quick. It is for a 1" shaft with a 1.25" OD bearing. The slot is just enough to fit over the shaft, the hole at the end was made with a 1" hole saw with a hand drill so it is slightly larger than 1" diameter. The hole at the other end was done the same way with a 3/8" hole saw. The black plastic piece was just to hold it in place knowing I would be working by myself. The part that pushes the bearing out was a piece of 1" electrical conduit cut in half and lined with Velcro to shim it and make sure it stayed off the shaft. A 1" dia. washer pushed the bearing back in. The only thing I needed to do was slip the new bearing on the end of the shaft to align the hole when I put the tool on. The L4 x 4 x 3/8 is overkill but the price was right. A small fraction of the cost of the commercial tool, and it was fun to make. Getting to that point was a different story. I fought the prop more than I thought I would and broke a harbor freight gear puller yesterday in the process. It is going back on with some anti-seize. Bob Ellison -- Joe DeMers - owner Sound Marine Diesel LLC SoundMarineDiesel.com phone & fax (860) 666-2184 -- Joe DeMers - owner Sound Marine Diesel LLC SoundMarineDiesel.com phone & fax (860) 666-2184 __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7021 (20120402) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7021 (20120402) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com 57 Year Old Looks 27 Local Woman Reveals Wrinkle Secret That Has Doctors Angry. http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/4f7b5767d2b3e3347719st06duc

Magic, our 1979 Cal 2-27 had a 1" bronze propeller shaft. I replaced it with a SS shaft when we repowered her in early 2004. At that time there was nothing wrong with the shaft, except it was not long enough for the new engine/transmission configuration. From: Rodney G. Johnson <rj… [at] juno.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 3, 2012 4:01 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutlass bearing and prop installation I sincerely doubt that your shaft is BRASS, it might be Monel, it may be Bronze, it may be Stainless Steel, but I doubt that it would be Brass. Brass is an alloy of Copper and Zinc, and would not seem strong enough to serve as a prop shaft on a full-size (as opposed to scale model) boat. I would expect it to be too soft. The zinc would (I expect) leach out of the Brass leaving just copper (and quite porous copper at that!) with any stray electrolytic currents. Bronze is an alloy of Copper and Tin. My memory of older boats recalls hearing of shafts made from Monel, and Stainless, and perhaps some Bronze. Perhaps Joe DeMers could chime in here? Rod Johnson, "SUNBIRD" 1979 O'DAY DS II #10201 former co-owner of "NODROG" 1970 CAL 21 #285 On Tue, 3 Apr 2012 11:20:17 -0700 "Mark Alan Stahnke \(MAS Consulting\)" <ma… [at] cox.net> writes: >You can confirm the alloy differences in the ASTM American Society of Testing Materials Non Ferrous Metals book. But as I recall generally speaking, bronzes will have significantly more copper base metal or cathode material and the brass will have less copper and much more zinc and lead and other trace components which contribute to its anodic or sacrificial qualities. Example: When designing a multiple component pressure vessel such as a bronze valve, the internal working mechanism would be designed to fail prior to the body. The anodic and cathode value in the stem is inherently less noble than that of the body. A valve that will not close is usually safer than a body separation. > >With that said, I would think the shaft should be more noble alloy than the propeller. > >Mark >Cal 2-29 > >----- Original Message ----- >>From: Bob Ellison >>To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >>Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 4:53 AM >>Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation >> >> >>I guess I still don't know what to do, it's now back on dry, but that can easily be changed. Does anyone's thoughts change if it is a bronze prop on a brass shaft? >>Thanks >>Bob >> >> >>________________________________ >> From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mike farrell >>Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 6:10 AM >>To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >>Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation >> >> >> Hi Joe, >> Would Lanicote be a better choice? How would a lube improve the conductivity of a bare SS shaft and a bare bronze prop? >> My Best, Mike Farrell >> >> >>From: Allen Edwards <al… [at] gmail.com> >>To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >>Sent: Monday, April 2, 2012 7:51 PM >>Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation >> >> >> >> >>It would be nice if they were not electrically connected to each other so a dielectric grease like Super Lube might be a good choice. If you could keep them completely electrically insulated, you would not need a zinc. But you can't. But putting a conductive grease between them is certainly just a way to increase electrolysis. >> >> >>Allen >> >> >>On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 7:17 PM, Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> wrote: >> >> >>> >>>Hi Mike - >>>I checked with the booklet "prop and shaft installation guide" published by prop and shaft makers. I stand corrected. >>> >>>They say it is permissible to use a thin layer of waterproof grease on the shaft taper. It does not say this grease is mandatory. >>> >>>I suggest that anything containing graphite [ electrically conductive ] or anti seize compounds [ contain metal particles that may also be conductive, and / or may act as grit ] should not be used. >>> >>>Joe DeMers >>> >>>On 4/2/2012 7:52 PM, mike farrell wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> For 50 years I have used Never Sieze or another lube on SS shafts and props. I will continue to do so. To install a bronze prop with no lube is irresponsible. You are wrong Joe! Stationary Engineer with 50 years experience. >>>> My Best, Mike Farrell >>>>From: Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> >>>>To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >>>>Sent: Monday, April 2, 2012 6:53 AM >>>>Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>ALWAYS install a prop dry. Any lubricant, burrs, or grit on the shaft taper will defeat the purpose of the shaft / prop fit. >>>> >>>>The taper of the shaft and bore of the prop must make at least 75% even contact, or you risk the prop rattling on the shaft taper, and / or the shaft and prop not rotating concentrically. >>>> >>>>Remember, the correct fit of the prop on the shaft is primary, the shaft key is there as a backup only. DO NOT rely on the shaft key as the primary means of securing the prop to the shaft, as eventually, the key will wear, and the prop will be hammering itself off the shaft. >>>> >>>>Joe DeMers - owner >>>>Sound Marine Diesel LLC SoundMarineDiesel.com >>>>phone & fax (860) 666-2184 >>>>On 4/1/2012 11:10 PM, Bob Ellison wrote: >>>>I replaced the cutless bearing this afternoon. I made a tool similar to the "strut pro" tool. I posted some photos in a folder called 1980 Cal 2-27 Après Ski. The actual bearing replacement went very smoothly, and the tool worked excellent. I watched a couple people fight with their bearings a few years ago. There are no set screws on this strut, so it is a tight fit. The bearing replacement took an hour and 10 minutes and that was with me taking a couple breaks to stand up, one being about 15 minutes talking to the other crazy couple working on their boat. It was about 40 degrees and raining in central New York today, but the yard wants me in this week. If I had a second person so that we could tighten each side at the same time it would have been really quick. It is for a 1" shaft with a 1.25" OD bearing. The slot is just enough to fit over the shaft, the hole at the end was made with a 1" hole saw with a hand drill so it is slightly larger than 1" diameter. The hole at the other end was done the same way with a 3/8" hole saw. The black plastic piece was just to hold it in place knowing I would be working by myself. The part that pushes the bearing out was a piece of 1" electrical conduit cut in half and lined with Velcro to shim it and make sure it stayed off the shaft. A 1" dia. washer pushed the bearing back in. The only thing I needed to do was slip the new bearing on the end of the shaft to align the hole when I put the tool on. The L4 x 4 x 3/8 is overkill but the price was right. A small fraction of the cost of the commercial tool, and it was fun to make. >>>>> >>>>>Getting to that point was a different story. I fought the prop more than I thought I would and broke a harbor freight gear puller yesterday in the process. It is going back on with some anti-seize. >>>>> >>>>>Bob Ellison >>>> >>>>-- >>>> >>>>Joe DeMers - owner >>>>Sound Marine Diesel LLC SoundMarineDiesel.com >>>>phone & fax (860) 666-2184 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>-- >>> >>>Joe DeMers - owner >>>Sound Marine Diesel LLCSoundMarineDiesel.com >>>phone & fax (860) 666-2184 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7021 (20120402) __________ >> >>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >>http://www.eset.com >> > >__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7021 (20120402) __________ > >The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >http://www.eset.com > > 57 Year Old Looks 27 Local Woman Reveals Wrinkle Secret That Has Doctors Angry. TheSmartStyleLiving.com

Monel is copper and nickel but looks more like stainless than bronze. It is a very nice material but is electrically much like stainless. On Tue, Apr 3, 2012 at 1:01 PM, Rodney G. Johnson <rj… [at] juno.com>wrote: > ** > > > ** > I sincerely doubt that your shaft is BRASS, it might be Monel, it may be > Bronze, it may be Stainless Steel, but I doubt that it would be Brass. > > Brass is an alloy of Copper and Zinc, and would not seem strong enough to > serve as a prop shaft on a full-size (as opposed to scale model) boat. I > would expect it to be too soft. The zinc would (I expect) leach out of the > Brass leaving just copper (and quite porous copper at that!) with any stray > electrolytic currents. > > Bronze is an alloy of Copper and Tin. > > My memory of older boats recalls hearing of shafts made from Monel, and > Stainless, and perhaps some Bronze. Perhaps Joe DeMers could chime in here? > > Rod Johnson, "SUNBIRD" > 1979 O'DAY DS II #10201 > former co-owner of "NODROG" > 1970 CAL 21 #285 > > On Tue, 3 Apr 2012 11:20:17 -0700 "Mark Alan Stahnke \(MAS Consulting\)" < > ma… [at] cox.net> writes: > > > > You can confirm the alloy differences in the ASTM American Society of > Testing Materials Non Ferrous Metals book. But as I recall generally > speaking, bronzes will have significantly more copper base metal or cathode > material and the brass will have less copper and much more zinc and lead > and other trace components which contribute to its anodic or sacrificial > qualities. Example: When designing a multiple component pressure vessel > such as a bronze valve, the internal working mechanism would be designed to > fail prior to the body. The anodic and cathode value in the stem is > inherently less noble than that of the body. A valve that will not close is > usually safer than a body separation. > > With that said, I would think the shaft should be more noble alloy than > the propeller. > > Mark > Cal 2-29 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Bob Ellison <bo… [at] adelphia.net> > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 03, 2012 4:53 AM > *Subject:* RE: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation > > > > I guess I still don't know what to do, it's now back on dry, but that can > easily be changed. Does anyone's thoughts change if it is a bronze prop on > a brass shaft? > Thanks > Bob > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] *On > Behalf Of *mike farrell > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 03, 2012 6:10 AM > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation > > > > Hi Joe, > Would Lanicote be a better choice? How would a lube improve the > conductivity of a bare SS shaft and a bare bronze prop? > My Best, Mike Farrell > > *From:* Allen Edwards <al… [at] gmail.com> > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Sent:* Monday, April 2, 2012 7:51 PM > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation > > > > It would be nice if they were not electrically connected to each other so > a dielectric grease like Super Lube might be a good choice. If you could > keep them completely electrically insulated, you would not need a zinc. > But you can't. But putting a conductive grease between them is certainly > just a way to increase electrolysis. > > Allen > > On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 7:17 PM, Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> wrote: > > ** > > **Hi Mike - > I checked with the booklet "prop and shaft installation guide" published > by prop and shaft makers. I stand corrected. > > They say it is permissible to use a thin layer of waterproof grease on the > shaft taper. It does not say this grease is mandatory. > > I suggest that anything containing graphite [ electrically conductive ] or > anti seize compounds [ contain metal particles that may also be conductive, > and / or may act as grit ] should not be used. > > Joe DeMers > > On 4/2/2012 7:52 PM, mike farrell wrote: > > > > For 50 years I have used Never Sieze or another lube on SS shafts > and props. I will continue to do so. To install a bronze prop with no > lube is irresponsible. You are wrong Joe! Stationary Engineer with 50 > years experience. > My Best, Mike Farrell > *From:* Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> <je… [at] mindspring.com> > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Sent:* Monday, April 2, 2012 6:53 AM > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation > > > > ALWAYS install a prop dry. Any lubricant, burrs, or grit on the shaft > taper will defeat the purpose of the shaft / prop fit. > > The taper of the shaft and bore of the prop must make at least 75% even > contact, or you risk the prop rattling on the shaft taper, and / or the > shaft and prop not rotating concentrically. > > Remember, the correct fit of the prop on the shaft is primary, the shaft > key is there as a backup only. DO NOT rely on the shaft key as the primary > means of securing the prop to the shaft, as eventually, the key will wear, > and the prop will be hammering itself off the shaft. > *Joe DeMers - owner * > Sound Marine Diesel LLC > SoundMarineDiesel.com <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> > *phone & fax (860) 666-2184 * > > On 4/1/2012 11:10 PM, Bob Ellison wrote: > > I replaced the cutless bearing this afternoon. I made a tool similar to > the "strut pro" tool. I posted some photos in a folder called 1980 Cal > 2-27 Après Ski. The actual bearing replacement went very smoothly, and the > tool worked excellent. I watched a couple people fight with their bearings > a few years ago. There are no set screws on this strut, so it is a tight > fit. The bearing replacement took an hour and 10 minutes and that was with > me taking a couple breaks to stand up, one being about 15 minutes talking > to the other crazy couple working on their boat. It was about 40 degrees > and raining in central New York today, but the yard wants me in this week. > If I had a second person so that we could tighten each side at the same > time it would have been really quick. It is for a 1" shaft with a 1.25" OD > bearing. The slot is just enough to fit over the shaft, the hole at the > end was made with a 1" hole saw with a hand drill so it is slightly larger > than 1" diameter. The hole at the other end was done the same way with a > 3/8" hole saw. The black plastic piece was just to hold it in place > knowing I would be working by myself. The part that pushes the bearing > out was a piece of 1" electrical conduit cut in half and lined with Velcro > to shim it and make sure it stayed off the shaft. A 1" dia. washer pushed > the bearing back in. The only thing I needed to do was slip the new > bearing on the end of the shaft to align the hole when I put the tool on. > The L4 x 4 x 3/8 is overkill but the price was right. A small fraction of > the cost of the commercial tool, and it was fun to make. > > Getting to that point was a different story. I fought the prop more than > I thought I would and broke a harbor freight gear puller yesterday in the > process. It is going back on with some anti-seize. > > Bob Ellison > > > -- > *Joe DeMers - owner * > Sound Marine Diesel LLC > SoundMarineDiesel.com <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> > *phone & fax (860) 666-2184 * > > > > > > > > -- > *Joe DeMers - owner* > Sound Marine Diesel LLC > SoundMarineDiesel.com <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> > *phone & fax (860) 666-2184* > > > > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 7021 (20120402) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 7021 (20120402) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > *57 Year Old Looks 27* > Local Woman Reveals Wrinkle Secret That Has Doctors Angry. > <http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3142/4f7b5767d2b3e3347719st06duc> > TheSmartStyleLiving.com<http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3142/4f7b5767d2b3e3347719st06duc> > > >

On 4/3/2012 4:59 PM, Allen Edwards wrote: > > Monel is copper and nickel but looks more like stainless than bronze. > It is a very nice material but is electrically much like stainless. > And about the same price as gold, as I recall. Chris Campbell

I found a used Martec folding prop and it appears to be the size for my cal 2-29. How do I inspect to verify it is in good working order? and correct size for the A30 Farymann..I believe it is a 12" prop not sure if there are different pitch options for the basic prop? Appreciate any feed back. Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: Chris Campbell To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:06 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutlass bearing and prop installation On 4/3/2012 4:59 PM, Allen Edwards wrote: Monel is copper and nickel but looks more like stainless than bronze. It is a very nice material but is electrically much like stainless. And about the same price as gold, as I recall. Chris Campbell __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7024 (20120403) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7024 (20120403) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com

kt… [at] sale.craigslist.org Wow, such a deal. Used once. Why don't anyone have such a sail for me? I know, keep lookin' Jerry

I just bought a new Martec prop so will have the old one to sell. Please keep me informed about what you find about the used prop market. Mine is probably a 14RH7 but I won't know for sure until next week. My new one is a 14RH10. Thanks Allen On Tue, Apr 3, 2012 at 3:04 PM, Mark Alan Stahnke (MAS Consulting) < ma… [at] cox.net> wrote: > ** > > > ** > I found a used Martec folding prop and it appears to be the size for my > cal 2-29. How do I inspect to verify it is in good working order? and > correct size for the A30 Farymann..I believe it is a 12" prop not sure if > there are different pitch options for the basic prop? > Appreciate any feed back. > Mark > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Chris Campbell <cc… [at] lsnm.org> > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:06 PM > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutlass bearing and prop installation > > > > On 4/3/2012 4:59 PM, Allen Edwards wrote: > > > > Monel is copper and nickel but looks more like stainless than bronze. It > is a very nice material but is electrically much like stainless. > > > And about the same price as gold, as I recall. > > Chris Campbell > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 7024 (20120403) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 7024 (20120403) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > >

Not sure if a used propeller purchase is worth it since for martec to rebuild is ala cart and could run the cost up significantly ...must say the low initial cost is tempting. Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: Allen Edwards To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Martec folding prop I just bought a new Martec prop so will have the old one to sell. Please keep me informed about what you find about the used prop market. Mine is probably a 14RH7 but I won't know for sure until next week. My new one is a 14RH10. Thanks Allen On Tue, Apr 3, 2012 at 3:04 PM, Mark Alan Stahnke (MAS Consulting) <ma… [at] cox.net> wrote: I found a used Martec folding prop and it appears to be the size for my cal 2-29. How do I inspect to verify it is in good working order? and correct size for the A30 Farymann..I believe it is a 12" prop not sure if there are different pitch options for the basic prop? Appreciate any feed back. Mark ----- Original Message ----- From: Chris Campbell To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:06 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutlass bearing and prop installation On 4/3/2012 4:59 PM, Allen Edwards wrote: Monel is copper and nickel but looks more like stainless than bronze. It is a very nice material but is electrically much like stainless. And about the same price as gold, as I recall. Chris Campbell __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7024 (20120403) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7024 (20120403) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7024 (20120403) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7024 (20120403) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com

ours was a pink colored shaft (Cal 29) who knows bronze, monel we went with stainless (used) off speedboat 'the prop shop' picked the best one and kept the taper end and cut down to fit...we 1st went with indeigo 3 blade then when with max prop still working great 6 seasons latter edward From: Rodney G. Johnson <rj… [at] juno.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, April 3, 2012 1:01 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutlass bearing and prop installation I sincerely doubt that your shaft is BRASS, it might be Monel, it may be Bronze, it may be Stainless Steel, but I doubt that it would be Brass. Brass is an alloy of Copper and Zinc, and would not seem strong enough to serve as a prop shaft on a full-size (as opposed to scale model) boat. I would expect it to be too soft. The zinc would (I expect) leach out of the Brass leaving just copper (and quite porous copper at that!) with any stray electrolytic currents. Bronze is an alloy of Copper and Tin. My memory of older boats recalls hearing of shafts made from Monel, and Stainless, and perhaps some Bronze. Perhaps Joe DeMers could chime in here? Rod Johnson, "SUNBIRD" 1979 O'DAY DS II #10201 former co-owner of "NODROG" 1970 CAL 21 #285 On Tue, 3 Apr 2012 11:20:17 -0700 "Mark Alan Stahnke \(MAS Consulting\)" <ma… [at] cox.net> writes: >You can confirm the alloy differences in the ASTM American Society of Testing Materials Non Ferrous Metals book. But as I recall generally speaking, bronzes will have significantly more copper base metal or cathode material and the brass will have less copper and much more zinc and lead and other trace components which contribute to its anodic or sacrificial qualities. Example: When designing a multiple component pressure vessel such as a bronze valve, the internal working mechanism would be designed to fail prior to the body. The anodic and cathode value in the stem is inherently less noble than that of the body. A valve that will not close is usually safer than a body separation. > >With that said, I would think the shaft should be more noble alloy than the propeller. > >Mark >Cal 2-29 > >----- Original Message ----- >>From: Bob Ellison >>To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >>Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 4:53 AM >>Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation >> >> >>I guess I still don't know what to do, it's now back on dry, but that can easily be changed. Does anyone's thoughts change if it is a bronze prop on a brass shaft? >>Thanks >>Bob >> >> >>________________________________ >> From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of mike farrell >>Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 6:10 AM >>To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >>Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation >> >> >> Hi Joe, >> Would Lanicote be a better choice? How would a lube improve the conductivity of a bare SS shaft and a bare bronze prop? >> My Best, Mike Farrell >> >> >>From: Allen Edwards <al… [at] gmail.com> >>To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >>Sent: Monday, April 2, 2012 7:51 PM >>Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation >> >> >> >> >>It would be nice if they were not electrically connected to each other so a dielectric grease like Super Lube might be a good choice. If you could keep them completely electrically insulated, you would not need a zinc. But you can't. But putting a conductive grease between them is certainly just a way to increase electrolysis. >> >> >>Allen >> >> >>On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 7:17 PM, Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> wrote: >> >> >>> >>>Hi Mike - >>>I checked with the booklet "prop and shaft installation guide" published by prop and shaft makers. I stand corrected. >>> >>>They say it is permissible to use a thin layer of waterproof grease on the shaft taper. It does not say this grease is mandatory. >>> >>>I suggest that anything containing graphite [ electrically conductive ] or anti seize compounds [ contain metal particles that may also be conductive, and / or may act as grit ] should not be used. >>> >>>Joe DeMers >>> >>>On 4/2/2012 7:52 PM, mike farrell wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> For 50 years I have used Never Sieze or another lube on SS shafts and props. I will continue to do so. To install a bronze prop with no lube is irresponsible. You are wrong Joe! Stationary Engineer with 50 years experience. >>>> My Best, Mike Farrell >>>>From: Joe DeMers <je… [at] mindspring.com> >>>>To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >>>>Sent: Monday, April 2, 2012 6:53 AM >>>>Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cutless bearing and prop installation >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>ALWAYS install a prop dry. Any lubricant, burrs, or grit on the shaft taper will defeat the purpose of the shaft / prop fit. >>>> >>>>The taper of the shaft and bore of the prop must make at least 75% even contact, or you risk the prop rattling on the shaft taper, and / or the shaft and prop not rotating concentrically. >>>> >>>>Remember, the correct fit of the prop on the shaft is primary, the shaft key is there as a backup only. DO NOT rely on the shaft key as the primary means of securing the prop to the shaft, as eventually, the key will wear, and the prop will be hammering itself off the shaft. >>>> >>>>Joe DeMers - owner >>>>Sound Marine Diesel LLC SoundMarineDiesel.com >>>>phone & fax (860) 666-2184 >>>>On 4/1/2012 11:10 PM, Bob Ellison wrote: >>>>I replaced the cutless bearing this afternoon. I made a tool similar to the "strut pro" tool. I posted some photos in a folder called 1980 Cal 2-27 Après Ski. The actual bearing replacement went very smoothly, and the tool worked excellent. I watched a couple people fight with their bearings a few years ago. There are no set screws on this strut, so it is a tight fit. The bearing replacement took an hour and 10 minutes and that was with me taking a couple breaks to stand up, one being about 15 minutes talking to the other crazy couple working on their boat. It was about 40 degrees and raining in central New York today, but the yard wants me in this week. If I had a second person so that we could tighten each side at the same time it would have been really quick. It is for a 1" shaft with a 1.25" OD bearing. The slot is just enough to fit over the shaft, the hole at the end was made with a 1" hole saw with a hand drill so it is slightly larger than 1" diameter. The hole at the other end was done the same way with a 3/8" hole saw. The black plastic piece was just to hold it in place knowing I would be working by myself. The part that pushes the bearing out was a piece of 1" electrical conduit cut in half and lined with Velcro to shim it and make sure it stayed off the shaft. A 1" dia. washer pushed the bearing back in. The only thing I needed to do was slip the new bearing on the end of the shaft to align the hole when I put the tool on. The L4 x 4 x 3/8 is overkill but the price was right. A small fraction of the cost of the commercial tool, and it was fun to make. >>>>> >>>>>Getting to that point was a different story. I fought the prop more than I thought I would and broke a harbor freight gear puller yesterday in the process. It is going back on with some anti-seize. >>>>> >>>>>Bob Ellison >>>> >>>>-- >>>> >>>>Joe DeMers - owner >>>>Sound Marine Diesel LLC SoundMarineDiesel.com >>>>phone & fax (860) 666-2184 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>-- >>> >>>Joe DeMers - owner >>>Sound Marine Diesel LLCSoundMarineDiesel.com >>>phone & fax (860) 666-2184 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7021 (20120402) __________ >> >>The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. >> >>http://www.eset.com >> > >__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 7021 (20120402) __________ > >The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > >http://www.eset.com > > 57 Year Old Looks 27 Local Woman Reveals Wrinkle Secret That Has Doctors Angry. TheSmartStyleLiving.com