Cal 29 Rudder

Guys, I went to the boatyard today, my new rudder had arrived. Well, it looks beautiful. It just doesn't look like the original. Not even close. When I ordered it I just asked for a Cal 29 rudder, and thought that I would get the original. I called Foss today and Don is on vacation, so I talked to a staffer who said that Don usually talks with customers about giving them an improved design for their boat. I don't recall that conversation, but I don't recall a lot of things these days. I think it will fit into the boat, but it is a really different shape. If I go to the yard tomorrow I will take some pix and try to upload them. One of our club members ordered a rudder for an Erickson 35 from Foss and got a different one, and he loves it. It cost him a little rating, but it has improved the boat more. Regards, David Dobbs Cal29 411

My CAL 25 Foss rudder came through identical to original. Thanks for heads up on changes. I found that the rudder shaft was not not completely smoothed. I had to do some sanding to get a fit into the rudder cap. Cheers Charlie From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of david dobbs Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2008 1:01 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder Guys, I went to the boatyard today, my new rudder had arrived. Well, it looks beautiful. It just doesn't look like the original. Not even close. When I ordered it I just asked for a Cal 29 rudder, and thought that I would get the original. I called Foss today and Don is on vacation, so I talked to a staffer who said that Don usually talks with customers about giving them an improved design for their boat. I don't recall that conversation, but I don't recall a lot of things these days. I think it will fit into the boat, but it is a really different shape. If I go to the yard tomorrow I will take some pix and try to upload them. One of our club members ordered a rudder for an Erickson 35 from Foss and got a different one, and he loves it. It cost him a little rating, but it has improved the boat more. Regards, David Dobbs Cal29 411

Photos, David. Please and thank you so much.... From: david dobbs <tm… [at] yahoo.com> Reply-To: <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:01:25 -0700 (PDT) To: <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder Guys, I went to the boatyard today, my new rudder had arrived. Well, it looks beautiful. It just doesn't look like the original. Not even close. When I ordered it I just asked for a Cal 29 rudder, and thought that I would get the original. I called Foss today and Don is on vacation, so I talked to a staffer who said that Don usually talks with customers about giving them an improved design for their boat. I don't recall that conversation, but I don't recall a lot of things these days. I think it will fit into the boat, but it is a really different shape. If I go to the yard tomorrow I will take some pix and try to upload them. One of our club members ordered a rudder for an Erickson 35 from Foss and got a different one, and he loves it. It cost him a little rating, but it has improved the boat more. Regards, David Dobbs Cal29 411

Pix is of my Foss replacement rudder. I don't race, so I don't know what change it would for a PHRF rating. I just know I like it.David Dobbs CAL29 411

David could you forward the particulars on this rudder? I'm in interested in a contact at foss

James,I just called Foss, the one in Cal., told them I needed a new rudder, mine was full of water, etc. They gave me a price, don't remember what it was, seemed acceptable so I sent a check. I assumed they would send an original, since they had the molds. What I got was very different. I called them, and they said, "Try it, you'll like it." I did and I do. Don't know what PHRF would say, I don't race. A while back a bunch of Cal list guys pooled their resources and had a bunch of rudders made to a design by Carl Schumaker, an elliptical model, but I don't remember which Cal it was, maybe the 40? Help me out here guys.David Dobbs, CAL 29 411 On Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:40 PM, "ja… [at] mac.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: David could you forward the particulars on this rudder? I'm in interested in a contact at foss -- {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} {margin-bottom:10px;} .yiv8776801693ad {padding:0 0;} .yiv8776801693ad p {margin:0;} .yiv8776801693ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} {font-family:Arial;} {margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} .yiv8776801693ad {margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 0;} {font-family:Verdana;font-size:11px;padding:10px 0;} {background-color:#e0ecee;float:left;font-family:Verdana;font-size:10px;padding:10px;} span {font-weight:700;} span:first-child {text-transform:uppercase;} span a {color:#5085b6;text-decoration:none;} span span {color:#ff7900;} span .yiv8776801693underline {text-decoration:underline;} .yiv8776801693attach {clear:both;display:table;font-family:Arial;font-size:12px;padding:10px 0;width:400px;} .yiv8776801693attach div a {text-decoration:none;} .yiv8776801693attach img {border:none;padding-right:5px;} .yiv8776801693attach label {display:block;margin-bottom:5px;} .yiv8776801693attach label a {text-decoration:none;} blockquote {margin:0 0 0 4px;} .yiv8776801693bold {font-family:Arial;font-size:13px;font-weight:700;} .yiv8776801693bold a {text-decoration:none;} dd.yiv8776801693last p a {font-family:Verdana;font-weight:700;} dd.yiv8776801693last p span {margin-right:10px;font-family:Verdana;font-weight:700;} dd.yiv8776801693last p span.yiv8776801693yshortcuts {margin-right:0;} div.yiv8776801693attach-table div div a {text-decoration:none;} div.yiv8776801693attach-table {width:400px;} div.yiv8776801693file-title a, div.yiv8776801693file-title a:active, div.yiv8776801693file-title a:hover, div.yiv8776801693file-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;} div.yiv8776801693photo-title a, div.yiv8776801693photo-title a:active, div.yiv8776801693photo-title a:hover, div.yiv8776801693photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;} div p a span.yiv8776801693yshortcuts {font-family:Verdana;font-size:10px;font-weight:normal;} .yiv8776801693green {color:#628c2a;} .yiv8776801693MsoNormal {margin:0 0 0 0;} o {font-size:0;} div {float:left;width:72px;} div div {border:1px solid #666666;height:62px;overflow:hidden;width:62px;} div label {color:#666666;font-size:10px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;white-space:nowrap;width:64px;} {font-size:77%;} {font-size:77%;} .yiv8776801693replbq {margin:4px;} div a:first-child {margin-right:2px;padding-right:5px;} {font-size:13px;font-family:Arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} table {font-size:inherit;font:100%;} select, input, textarea {font:99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} pre, code {font:115% monospace;} * {line-height:1.22em;} {padding-bottom:10px;} p a {font-family:Verdana;} p span {color:#1E66AE;font-weight:700;} {color:#ff7900;font-weight:700;} {margin-bottom:20px;padding:0px;} li a {font-size:130%;text-decoration:none;} li {font-size:77%;list-style-type:square;padding:6px 0;} ul {margin:0;padding:0 0 0 8px;} {font-family:Georgia;} p {margin:0 0 1em 0;} tt {font-size:120%;} ul li:last-child {border-right:none !important;}

Just looking at the rudder, my guess would be that the boat tracks better with the new rudder vs old. In my opinion, the stock Cal 29 rudder is a touch on the small side. I tend to feel it most when broad reaching in a decent sea. East Coast Cal 29 Sailor. On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 9:05 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] < Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > James, > I just called Foss, the one in Cal., told them I needed a new rudder, mine > was full of water, etc. They gave me a price, don't remember what it was, > seemed acceptable so I sent a check. I assumed they would send an > original, since they had the molds. What I got was very different. I > called them, and they said, "Try it, you'll like it." I did and I do. > Don't know what PHRF would say, I don't race. A while back a bunch of Cal > list guys pooled their resources and had a bunch of rudders made to a > design by Carl Schumaker, an elliptical model, but I don't remember which > Cal it was, maybe the 40? Help me out here guys. > David Dobbs, CAL 29 411 > > > > > > On Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:40 PM, "ja… [at] mac.com [Cal_Boats]" < > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > > David could you forward the particulars on this rudder? I'm in > interested in a contact at foss > > > >

It's actually smaller than the stock rudder, but does track well. I'm just a cruiser, but I do get into impromptu races from time to time, and usually do okay. The 29 is a fast boat if sailed well.David Dobbs CAL29 411 On Sunday, May 17, 2015 9:01 PM, "'sailor7312 .' sa… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Just looking at the rudder, my guess would be that the boat tracks better with the new rudder vs old. In my opinion, the stock Cal 29 rudder is a touch on the small side. I tend to feel it most when broad reaching in a decent sea. East Coast Cal 29 Sailor. On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 9:05 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: James,I just called Foss, the one in Cal., told them I needed a new rudder, mine was full of water, etc. They gave me a price, don't remember what it was, seemed acceptable so I sent a check. I assumed they would send an original, since they had the molds. What I got was very different. I called them, and they said, "Try it, you'll like it." I did and I do. Don't know what PHRF would say, I don't race. A while back a bunch of Cal list guys pooled their resources and had a bunch of rudders made to a design by Carl Schumaker, an elliptical model, but I don't remember which Cal it was, maybe the 40? Help me out here guys.David Dobbs, CAL 29 411 On Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:40 PM, "ja… [at] mac.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: David could you forward the particulars on this rudder? I'm in interested in a contact at foss

hi, yes, they made the 40 rudders, very long rudders, we ordered a model like that, for our 36, and put it on our 36, after modifying the forward top edge, to pivot under the different angle of the hull behind the grass cutter fin. the one you have on 411 is definitely an elliptical, and is a great improvement. remember to use a special bushing between the rudder and hull. you have a recess to fit the top end into, be sure to clean that up and do any glass repairs and even bottom paint to that recess. but be sure to test fit it all before you drill those holes to set the tiller head. I had to call foss to ask what to do as i thought it was designed specific. could i ship it back or what? they said i could do it myself and i used my sawzall to trim it to shape on that edge, and reglassed the trimmed part. we are very happy with the rudder, costly with shipping to the yard where we hauled and a delay in getting back into the water during glassing, curing and painting of rudder. But also be careful about drilling the bolthole for the tiller head, as ours was not square to the world. to make it exact, we had to lay it down on the tailgate, which slightly tilted the angle and got the offset angle. good time to check the shaft tube, and also the holes where the bolt goes through for roundness.I have seen and sailed on a 29 with that rudder, way cool, compared to the original on our previous 29... Helen On Sunday, May 17, 2015 6:06 PM, "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: James,I just called Foss, the one in Cal., told them I needed a new rudder, mine was full of water, etc. They gave me a price, don't remember what it was, seemed acceptable so I sent a check. I assumed they would send an original, since they had the molds. What I got was very different. I called them, and they said, "Try it, you'll like it." I did and I do. Don't know what PHRF would say, I don't race. A while back a bunch of Cal list guys pooled their resources and had a bunch of rudders made to a design by Carl Schumaker, an elliptical model, but I don't remember which Cal it was, maybe the 40? Help me out here guys.David Dobbs, CAL 29 411 On Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:40 PM, "ja… [at] mac.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: David could you forward the particulars on this rudder? I'm in interested in a contact at foss

Hmmmm... I wonder how it would fit & work on my 2-27. From: "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: CalList <ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:21 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] [Attachment(s) from david dobbs included below] Pix is of my Foss replacement rudder. I don't race, so I don't know what change it would for a PHRF rating. I just know I like it.David Dobbs CAL29 411

Interesting. If I ever get the time and money where I can have my boat on the hard for a year or two, doing some rudder work is on my agenda. Would love to put a set of nice rudder bearings in. When I got my boat, the fiberglass on my rudder was split and pealing off. I basically re-sheathed it . It has held up well. I would just like the super smooth feeling rudder bearing could give me. The 29 is pretty quick. I use an old Melges 24 chute for my downwind sailing. She moves right along w that. Jim East Coast cal 29 sailor. On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 10:16 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > It's actually smaller than the stock rudder, but does track well. I'm just > a cruiser, but I do get into impromptu races from time to time, and usually > do okay. The 29 is a fast boat if sailed well. > David Dobbs CAL29 411 > > > > > On Sunday, May 17, 2015 9:01 PM, "'sailor7312 .' sa… [at] gmail.com > [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > > Just looking at the rudder, my guess would be that the boat tracks > better with the new rudder vs old. > In my opinion, the stock Cal 29 rudder is a touch on the small side. > I tend to feel it most when broad reaching in a decent sea. > > East Coast Cal 29 Sailor. > > On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 9:05 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com > [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > James, > I just called Foss, the one in Cal., told them I needed a new rudder, mine > was full of water, etc. They gave me a price, don't remember what it was, > seemed acceptable so I sent a check. I assumed they would send an > original, since they had the molds. What I got was very different. I > called them, and they said, "Try it, you'll like it." I did and I do. > Don't know what PHRF would say, I don't race. A while back a bunch of Cal > list guys pooled their resources and had a bunch of rudders made to a > design by Carl Schumaker, an elliptical model, but I don't remember which > Cal it was, maybe the 40? Help me out here guys. > David Dobbs, CAL 29 411 > > > > > > On Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:40 PM, "ja… [at] mac.com [Cal_Boats]" < > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > > David could you forward the particulars on this rudder? I'm in > interested in a contact at foss > > > > > > >

There is an interesting point in this thread that may be missed by those not involved in racing. Many improvements in boat design can impact racing rules in a negative way, but impact general sailing in a positive manner. As a true believer in One Design Racing, I respect and have personally enforced the rules that keep boats the same for racing purposes. That being said, many boats can be greatly improved in their performance by the incorporation of modern technology. You, as the owner of a sailboat, have to make the choice as to which matters most to you. Do I want to race in tightly constrained PHRF and/or One Design racing categories or do I want to get the most out of my boat. I have been caught up in both and I want to share my belief in both. PHRF racing brings racing and the enjoyment of sailing to many, many boat owners and crews. One Design sailing is only applicable to racing and is racing at it’s purest form — where skippers truly compete on a level playing field and their skill is paramount. But, when enjoying a great boat like any Cal ever built, simply go for the best technology when replacing parts unless you are hoping to stay within racing rules. Modern rudder designs are much better suited to performance cruising and should be the choice of anyone needing a new rudder with the exception of strict “one design” or “phrf” racers. Don Dutton 1986 Cal 33-2, “Quantum Evolution” > On May 18, 2015, at 7:54 AM, 'sailor7312 .' sa… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > Interesting. If I ever get the time and money where I can have my boat on the hard for a year or two, doing some rudder work is on my agenda. Would love to put a set of nice rudder bearings in. When I got my boat, the fiberglass on my rudder was split and pealing off. I basically re-sheathed it . It has held up well. I would just like the super smooth feeling rudder bearing could give me. > > The 29 is pretty quick. I use an old Melges 24 chute for my downwind sailing. > She moves right along w that. > > > Jim > East Coast cal 29 sailor. > > > > On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 10:16 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com <mailto:tm… [at] yahoo.com> [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > > It's actually smaller than the stock rudder, but does track well. I'm just a cruiser, but I do get into impromptu races from time to time, and usually do okay. The 29 is a fast boat if sailed well. > David Dobbs CAL29 411 > > > > > On Sunday, May 17, 2015 9:01 PM, "'sailor7312 .' sa… [at] gmail.com <mailto:sa… [at] gmail.com> [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > > > Just looking at the rudder, my guess would be that the boat tracks better with the new rudder vs old. > In my opinion, the stock Cal 29 rudder is a touch on the small side. > I tend to feel it most when broad reaching in a decent sea. > > East Coast Cal 29 Sailor. > > On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 9:05 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com <mailto:tm… [at] yahoo.com> [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > James, > I just called Foss, the one in Cal., told them I needed a new rudder, mine was full of water, etc. They gave me a price, don't remember what it was, seemed acceptable so I sent a check. I assumed they would send an original, since they had the molds. What I got was very different. I called them, and they said, "Try it, you'll like it." I did and I do. Don't know what PHRF would say, I don't race. A while back a bunch of Cal list guys pooled their resources and had a bunch of rudders made to a design by Carl Schumaker, an elliptical model, but I don't remember which Cal it was, maybe the 40? Help me out here guys. > David Dobbs, CAL 29 411 > > > > > > On Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:40 PM, "ja… [at] mac.com <mailto:ja… [at] mac.com> [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > > > David could you forward the particulars on this rudder? I'm in interested in a contact at foss > > > > > > > > >

Don,I agree. Level racing has been gaining adherents in recent years. We have various one-design fleets in Chicago, and it's always fun to work the finish of a race, the boat that finishes first wins. We have a big T-10 fleet, and a couple of Beneteau sections as well. Sorry Charlie, no Cal 25 fleet here. Most race PHRF, and it seems to work fairly well. Chicago Corinthian YC has a big Lightning fleet, along with Rhodes 19s. Chicago YC has Shields and Sonars, Columbia YC has a couple which I can't remember at the moment. My club used to have Stars, but that goes way back to the 1950's. If you go really way back we had Q boats. We're a small club, been here since 1896.David Dobbs CAL 29 411 On Monday, May 18, 2015 4:13 PM, "Donald C Dutton dn… [at] comcast.net [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: There is an interesting point in this thread that may be missed by those not involved in racing. Many improvements in boat design can impact racing rules in a negative way, but impact general sailing in a positive manner. As a true believer in One Design Racing, I respect and have personally enforced the rules that keep boats the same for racing purposes. That being said, many boats can be greatly improved in their performance by the incorporation of modern technology. You, as the owner of a sailboat, have to make the choice as to which matters most to you. Do I want to race in tightly constrained PHRF and/or One Design racing categories or do I want to get the most out of my boat. I have been caught up in both and I want to share my belief in both. PHRF racing brings racing and the enjoyment of sailing to many, many boat owners and crews. One Design sailing is only applicable to racing and is racing at it’s purest form — where skippers truly compete on a level playing field and their skill is paramount. But, when enjoying a great boat like any Cal ever built, simply go for the best technology when replacing parts unless you are hoping to stay within racing rules. Modern rudder designs are much better suited to performance cruising and should be the choice of anyone needing a new rudder with the exception of strict “one design” or “phrf” racers. Don Dutton1986 Cal 33-2, “Quantum Evolution” On May 18, 2015, at 7:54 AM, 'sailor7312 .' sa… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Interesting. If I ever get the time and money where I can have my boat on the hard for a year or two, doing some rudder work is on my agenda. Would love to put a set of nice rudder bearings in. When I got my boat, the fiberglass on my rudder was split and pealing off. I basically re-sheathed it . It has held up well. I would just like the super smooth feeling rudder bearing could give me. The 29 is pretty quick. I use an old Melges 24 chute for my downwind sailing. She moves right along w that. Jim East Coast cal 29 sailor. On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 10:16 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: It's actually smaller than the stock rudder, but does track well. I'm just a cruiser, but I do get into impromptu races from time to time, and usually do okay. The 29 is a fast boat if sailed well.David Dobbs CAL29 411 On Sunday, May 17, 2015 9:01 PM, "'sailor7312 .' sa… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Just looking at the rudder, my guess would be that the boat tracks better with the new rudder vs old. In my opinion, the stock Cal 29 rudder is a touch on the small side. I tend to feel it most when broad reaching in a decent sea. East Coast Cal 29 Sailor. On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 9:05 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: James,I just called Foss, the one in Cal., told them I needed a new rudder, mine was full of water, etc. They gave me a price, don't remember what it was, seemed acceptable so I sent a check. I assumed they would send an original, since they had the molds. What I got was very different. I called them, and they said, "Try it, you'll like it." I did and I do. Don't know what PHRF would say, I don't race. A while back a bunch of Cal list guys pooled their resources and had a bunch of rudders made to a design by Carl Schumaker, an elliptical model, but I don't remember which Cal it was, maybe the 40? Help me out here guys.David Dobbs, CAL 29 411 On Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:40 PM, "ja… [at] mac.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: David could you forward the particulars on this rudder? I'm in interested in a contact at foss

Theoretically, phrf would adjust your rating to match the improvement. I think the key is to establish a racing history before making a change so if the penalty is too great. You have some stats to back you up. Phrf is very imprecise. That said, at times it can add a variability that can put more people in the winners circle over time then one design. Jim East coast cal 29 sailor > On May 18, 2015, at 5:13 PM, Donald C Dutton dn… [at] comcast.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > There is an interesting point in this thread that may be missed by those not involved in racing. Many improvements in boat design can impact racing rules in a negative way, but impact general sailing in a positive manner. As a true believer in One Design Racing, I respect and have personally enforced the rules that keep boats the same for racing purposes. > > > That being said, many boats can be greatly improved in their performance by the incorporation of modern technology. You, as the owner of a sailboat, have to make the choice as to which matters most to you. Do I want to race in tightly constrained PHRF and/or One Design racing categories or do I want to get the most out of my boat. I have been caught up in both and I want to share my belief in both. > > PHRF racing brings racing and the enjoyment of sailing to many, many boat owners and crews. One Design sailing is only applicable to racing and is racing at it’s purest form — where skippers truly compete on a level playing field and their skill is paramount. > > But, when enjoying a great boat like any Cal ever built, simply go for the best technology when replacing parts unless you are hoping to stay within racing rules. Modern rudder designs are much better suited to performance cruising and should be the choice of anyone needing a new rudder with the exception of strict “one design” or “phrf” racers. > > Don Dutton > 1986 Cal 33-2, “Quantum Evolution” > >> On May 18, 2015, at 7:54 AM, 'sailor7312 .' sa… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >> >> >> Interesting. If I ever get the time and money where I can have my boat on the hard for a year or two, doing some rudder work is on my agenda. Would love to put a set of nice rudder bearings in. When I got my boat, the fiberglass on my rudder was split and pealing off. I basically re-sheathed it . It has held up well. I would just like the super smooth feeling rudder bearing could give me. >> >> The 29 is pretty quick. I use an old Melges 24 chute for my downwind sailing. >> She moves right along w that. >> >> >> Jim >> East Coast cal 29 sailor. >> >> >> >>> On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 10:16 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> It's actually smaller than the stock rudder, but does track well. I'm just a cruiser, but I do get into impromptu races from time to time, and usually do okay. The 29 is a fast boat if sailed well. >>> David Dobbs CAL29 411 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sunday, May 17, 2015 9:01 PM, "'sailor7312 .' sa… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Just looking at the rudder, my guess would be that the boat tracks better with the new rudder vs old. >>> In my opinion, the stock Cal 29 rudder is a touch on the small side. >>> I tend to feel it most when broad reaching in a decent sea. >>> >>> East Coast Cal 29 Sailor. >>> >>> On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 9:05 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >>> >>> James, >>> I just called Foss, the one in Cal., told them I needed a new rudder, mine was full of water, etc. They gave me a price, don't remember what it was, seemed acceptable so I sent a check. I assumed they would send an original, since they had the molds. What I got was very different. I called them, and they said, "Try it, you'll like it." I did and I do. Don't know what PHRF would say, I don't race. A while back a bunch of Cal list guys pooled their resources and had a bunch of rudders made to a design by Carl Schumaker, an elliptical model, but I don't remember which Cal it was, maybe the 40? Help me out here guys. >>> David Dobbs, CAL 29 411 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:40 PM, "ja… [at] mac.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> David could you forward the particulars on this rudder? I'm in interested in a contact at foss > >

David.... just out of curiosity, how much did it cost? From: "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: CalList <ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:21 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] [Attachment(s) from david dobbs included below] Pix is of my Foss replacement rudder. I don't race, so I don't know what change it would for a PHRF rating. I just know I like it.David Dobbs CAL29 411

Don't remember, I purposely don't keep track of what I spend, and that was some years ago.David On Thursday, May 21, 2015 8:25 AM, "Michael D md… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: David.... just out of curiosity, how much did it cost? From: "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: CalList <ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:21 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] [Attachment(s) from david dobbs included below] Pix is of my Foss replacement rudder. I don't race, so I don't know what change it would for a PHRF rating. I just know I like it.David Dobbs CAL29 411

Just for point of reference, the cal 36/40 cost was ballpark $2K. Have you considered repairing the one you have for now? There are various ways to drill into skin and dry out, then refill holes and barrier coat and bottom paint.we needed to replace Caliente s because there was major crevice corrosion on the shaft. Right where it exits tube. It looked like someone had run a grinder disc almost flush with the hull. When we dropped it we saw light through the groove and when we set it flat there was water and live seaweed pouring out. The shaft is 1/4 SS. I'm sure that added a good part of the bill. We've kept the old one and may have a sleeve installed, to keep as spare. Helen Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android From:"david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Date:Thu, May 21, 2015 at 1:10 PM Subject:Re: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] (David) Don't remember, I purposely don't keep track of what I spend, and that was some years ago. David On Thursday, May 21, 2015 8:25 AM, "Michael D md… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: David.... just out of curiosity, how much did it cost? From: "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: CalList <ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:21 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] [Attachment(s) from david dobbs included below] Pix is of my Foss replacement rudder. I don't race, so I don't know what change it would for a PHRF rating. I just know I like it. David Dobbs CAL29 411

Hear! Hear! on the tracking $$. Don’t wanna know. Last time I got a CAL 25 rudder about 5 years ago, I paid Foss about $900 for a CAL 25 model which included shipping to East Coast. Guess you would scale your boat from there. Maybe $1500? In the early-mid 90s as per cApT dEmO (Timm lessley), the CAL 40s had an elliptical rudder custom designed, and spread that cost across the number bought. They got it down to $1500 apiece w/o shipping. Inflated to today, CAL 40s would be $2400, so $1500 for a CAL 29 rudder looks like a good guess. Take Care Charlie Annapolis From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2015 4:10 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] (David) Don't remember, I purposely don't keep track of what I spend, and that was some years ago. David On Thursday, May 21, 2015 8:25 AM, "Michael D md… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: David.... just out of curiosity, how much did it cost? _____ From: "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: CalList <ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:21 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] [ <https://us-mg6.mail.yahoo.com/neo/launch?.rand=df1um0349380c#TopText> Attachment(s) from david dobbs included below] Pix is of my Foss replacement rudder. I don't race, so I don't know what change it would for a PHRF rating. I just know I like it. David Dobbs CAL29 411

Charlie,I think that's in the ballpark. I had the yard guys do the work; their labor rates are reasonable, and they cheat themselves mostly. Their dad and uncle founded the yard in 1941, their dad enlisted, Navy, became a Seabee in the Pacific. Third generation now working there. Took me a few years to get some respect from them as an owner who actually knows something about boats. You know you've achieved that when they are no longer polite when you do something dumb, and they ask what the Hell are you doing?David Dobbs, CAL29 411 On Thursday, May 21, 2015 3:42 PM, "'Charlie Husar' hu… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hear! Hear! on the tracking $$. Don’t wanna know. Last time I got a CAL 25 rudder about 5 years ago, I paid Foss about $900 for a CAL 25 model which included shipping to East Coast. Guess you would scale your boat from there. Maybe $1500? In the early-mid 90s as per cApT dEmO (Timm lessley), the CAL 40s had an elliptical rudder custom designed, and spread that cost across the number bought. They got it down to $1500 apiece w/o shipping. Inflated to today, CAL 40s would be $2400, so $1500 for a CAL 29 rudder looks like a good guess. Take CareCharlieAnnapolis From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2015 4:10 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] (David) Don't remember, I purposely don't keep track of what I spend, and that was some years ago.David On Thursday, May 21, 2015 8:25 AM, "Michael D md… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: David.... just out of curiosity, how much did it cost? From: "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: CalList <ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:21 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] [Attachment(s) from david dobbs included below] Pix is of my Foss replacement rudder. I don't race, so I don't know what change it would for a PHRF rating. I just know I like it.David Dobbs CAL29 411

Per Ronnie Simpson's blog, the Foss rudder for his 2-27 was $1050 a year (or two or three?) ago. This post shows a diagram from Foss which seems to imply they use the same foil for the "29" (2-29?), but with a shorter post. So it might even be a few bucks cheaper! Open Blue Horizon - February- MONGO re-fit | | | | | | | | | Open Blue Horizon - February- MONGO re-fitRonnie Simpson's sailing and cruising blog. Follow as Ronnie and his Cal 2-27 MONGO sail engineless and from California to Australia. | | | | View on www.openbluehorizon.com | Preview by Yahoo | | | | | From: "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: "Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2015 2:29 PM Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] (David) Charlie,I think that's in the ballpark. I had the yard guys do the work; their labor rates are reasonable, and they cheat themselves mostly. Their dad and uncle founded the yard in 1941, their dad enlisted, Navy, became a Seabee in the Pacific. Third generation now working there. Took me a few years to get some respect from them as an owner who actually knows something about boats. You know you've achieved that when they are no longer polite when you do something dumb, and they ask what the Hell are you doing?David Dobbs, CAL29 411 On Thursday, May 21, 2015 3:42 PM, "'Charlie Husar' hu… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hear! Hear! on the tracking $$. Don’t wanna know. Last time I got a CAL 25 rudder about 5 years ago, I paid Foss about $900 for a CAL 25 model which included shipping to East Coast. Guess you would scale your boat from there. Maybe $1500? In the early-mid 90s as per cApT dEmO (Timm lessley), the CAL 40s had an elliptical rudder custom designed, and spread that cost across the number bought. They got it down to $1500 apiece w/o shipping. Inflated to today, CAL 40s would be $2400, so $1500 for a CAL 29 rudder looks like a good guess. Take CareCharlieAnnapolis From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2015 4:10 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] (David) Don't remember, I purposely don't keep track of what I spend, and that was some years ago.David On Thursday, May 21, 2015 8:25 AM, "Michael D md… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: David.... just out of curiosity, how much did it cost? From: "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: CalList <ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:21 PM Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] [Attachment(s) from david dobbs included below] Pix is of my Foss replacement rudder. I don't race, so I don't know what change it would for a PHRF rating. I just know I like it.David Dobbs CAL29 411

I priced one about four or five years ago and believe it was around $1300. Met a guy around that time with one that he had for many years - he only paid $650 for it. Wilkie > On May 21, 2015, at 2:29 PM, david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > > Charlie, > I think that's in the ballpark. I had the yard guys do the work; their labor rates are reasonable, and they cheat themselves mostly. Their dad and uncle founded the yard in 1941, their dad enlisted, Navy, became a Seabee in the Pacific. Third generation now working there. Took me a few years to get some respect from them as an owner who actually knows something about boats. You know you've achieved that when they are no longer polite when you do something dumb, and they ask what the Hell are you doing? > David Dobbs, CAL29 411 > > > > > On Thursday, May 21, 2015 3:42 PM, "'Charlie Husar' hu… [at] gmail.com <mailto:hu… [at] gmail.com> [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > > Hear! Hear! on the tracking $$. Don’t wanna know. Last time I got a CAL 25 rudder about 5 years ago, I paid Foss about $900 for a CAL 25 model which included shipping to East Coast. Guess you would scale your boat from there. Maybe $1500? > > In the early-mid 90s as per cApT dEmO (Timm lessley), the CAL 40s had an elliptical rudder custom designed, and spread that cost across the number bought. They got it down to $1500 apiece w/o shipping. Inflated to today, CAL 40s would be $2400, so $1500 for a CAL 29 rudder looks like a good guess. > > Take Care > Charlie > Annapolis > > > From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>] > Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2015 4:10 PM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] (David) > > > > > Don't remember, I purposely don't keep track of what I spend, and that was some years ago. > David > > > > On Thursday, May 21, 2015 8:25 AM, "Michael D md… [at] yahoo.com <mailto:md… [at] yahoo.com> [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > > David.... just out of curiosity, how much did it cost? > > From: "david dobbs tm… [at] yahoo.com <mailto:tm… [at] yahoo.com> [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> > To: CalList <ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> > Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 5:21 PM > Subject: [Cal_Boats] Cal 29 Rudder [1 Attachment] > > > [Attachment(s) <https://us-mg6.mail.yahoo.com/neo/launch?.rand=df1um0349380c#TopText> from david dobbs included below] > Pix is of my Foss replacement rudder. I don't race, so I don't know what change it would for a PHRF rating. I just know I like it. > David Dobbs CAL29 411 > > > > > > > > > > > >

I forgot to send this,I finally took a pic of my elliptical rudder, purchased from Foss.David Dobbs