Owning and selling a boat

Hi, all, I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of used boats. Now there is. So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate efficiently in whatever conditions we face. When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we generally admire. For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." Chris Campbell > >

Well said, sir . . . well said! Paul West Adventure Kwest Cal 39 From: ccampbell cc… [at] lsnm.org [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: Cal_Boats <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tue, Apr 5, 2016 11:11 am Subject: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat Hi, all, I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of used boats. Now there is. So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate efficiently in whatever conditions we face. When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we generally admire. For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." Chris Campbell > >

Nicely put Chris. Perhaps happiness is being content with what we have. And we are truly rich when we can be out sailing for an afternoon. And I am never happier than when driving a boat to windward, in the zone, making the boat go efficiently. When it is time to sell, we are naturally going to view our boats as having way more value than what others are likely to offer. This is a well known principle of behavioral economics. It is accentuated by the time we all put into taking care of and improving our sailing machines. Boats become more than an inanimate object to us. How many times have I seen someone write on this list that they want to see their boat go to “a good home”. We are all nuts. But it is a great way to be nuts…… Thanks for your post. Terry Spencer Capriccio Cal 2-29 Tacoma > On Apr 5, 2016, at 8:41 AM, pw… [at] aol.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > Well said, sir . . . well said! > > > Paul West > Adventure Kwest > Cal 39 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: ccampbell cc… [at] lsnm.org <mailto:cc… [at] lsnm.org> [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> > To: Cal_Boats <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> > Sent: Tue, Apr 5, 2016 11:11 am > Subject: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat > > > Hi, all, > > I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the > comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I > posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. > > We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners > to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the > problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. > Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known > vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). > There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, > when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. > Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of > used boats. Now there is. > > So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing > is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've > acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an > opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. > It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is > not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee > weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, > like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding > collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart > rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the > warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends > aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate > efficiently in whatever conditions we face. > > When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has > traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a > tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, > applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we > generally admire. > > For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. > We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the > hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing > a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, > with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in > short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could > let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral > deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other > boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer > 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of > mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way > that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, > but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My > little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, > and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that > already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. > > None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell > either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse > me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great > privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to > afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much > to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my > extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to > have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good > things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around > now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." > > Chris Campbell > > > > > > >

Hello all, Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as moral support. I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been challenging me lately. I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with Joe Demers from Sound Marine Diesel; LLC <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> SoundMarineDiesel.com (860) 666-2184 AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, CA. Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help diagnose? I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because it’s old. (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) “Well, it’s got No compression” “how do you know?” I asked. “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it quit. Should or can we measure it?” Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase cost and certainly not be a return. () I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what isn’t necessary Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can re-power for you” Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh engine. : ) Thanks. .tom.. From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat Hi, all, I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of used boats. Now there is. So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate efficiently in whatever conditions we face. When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we generally admire. For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." Chris Campbell > > --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Hi tom, This is my first time posting here, but i thought I might chime in with a recent experience. I've been helping my girlfriend out getting here cal 34 engine up to snuff, it was purchased with a non functioning engine (atomic 4)and we were working on it in the boat for quite some time with limited success. Long story short, we ended up pulling it out of the boat, and putting a rebuilt one in as the valves had become so badly welded that it wasn't worth the effort to rebuilt. I wish i had done it earlier. If you are having trouble getting people to come to you, it might be worthwhile to pull it out and take it somewhere. It was shockingly easy to get the atomic 4 in and out with just the main halyard and the mast winch, and I think the a4 with a v drive is well over 100 pounds heavier than your little yanmar. We still haven't gotten the reinstalled engine up and running yet, reworking some of the electrical and really trying to make sure the shaft is perfectly aligned. This was both of our first major mechanical project on a boat Some things I wish I had done before pulling the engine. 1) PICTURES - of everything zoomed in and zoomed out photos of every wire and bolt you remove 2) Labels - before you take the photos make sure you label each wire and that you can read the label in the photo 3) pay attention to the mounts as you remove them. How are they bolted in etc... Probably more of a last resort situation, but it seems to be working well for us -tim On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 9:51 AM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > Hello all, > > Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as > moral support. > > I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, > knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. > > I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been > challenging me lately. > > I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with *Joe Demers from Sound > Marine Diesel; LLC* > > > > SoundMarineDiesel.com <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> (860) 666-2184 > > > > AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, > CA. > > Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! > > > > I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other > things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. > > Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is > familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help > diagnose? > > I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except > charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because > it’s old. > > (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he > argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) > > “Well, it’s got No compression” > > “how do you know?” I asked. > > “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. > > I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, > that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it > quit. Should or can we measure it?” > > > > Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. > > > > But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase > cost and certainly not be a return. () > > I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a > $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what > isn’t necessary > > > > Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the > fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” > > I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. > > I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can > re-power for you” > > > > Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. > > I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh > engine. > > : ) > > > > Thanks. > > .tom.. > > > > > > *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Subject:* [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat > > > > > > Hi, all, > > I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the > comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I > posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. > > We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners > to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the > problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. > Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known > vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). > There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, > when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. > Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of > used boats. Now there is. > > So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing > is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've > acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an > opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. > It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is > not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee > weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, > like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding > collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart > rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the > warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends > aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate > efficiently in whatever conditions we face. > > When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has > traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a > tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, > applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we > generally admire. > > For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. > We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the > hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing > a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, > with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in > short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could > let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral > deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other > boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer > 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of > mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way > that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, > but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My > little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, > and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that > already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. > > None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell > either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse > me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great > privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to > afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much > to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my > extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to > have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good > things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around > now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." > > Chris Campbell > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > [image: Avast logo] > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > >

On 4/22/2016 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] wrote: > > > Hello all, > > Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as > well as moral support. > > I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last > October, knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. > > I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been > challenging me lately. > Another option is repowering with an outboard. You can pay as much or as little as you want to pay for that. I just looked--your 2-25 has a displacement listed as 4,500 lbs. My other boat, a 26' Seafarer Polaris, is 4,750 lbs. She's powered by an 8 h.p. 2-stroke outboard in a well. The little engine pushes her along nicely in protected waters. I've never had to power in high winds or seas. The outboard is used for getting to or from the marina, about 2 mi. between the slip and sailing waters (I can usually sail one way and power the other). If you use the engine for that kind of limited propulsion, not for cruising distances, then the outboard is fully satisfactory. In addition, it's easy to service and change. Chris Campbell > >

Thanks Tim..and David. Some useful, empirical information there! R-R is on my short list, indeed, but as I said, as it’s new to me, I want to make sure I’ve done everything before I do that. ..tom From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, April 22, 2016 10:41 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; TomDressler Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat Hi tom, This is my first time posting here, but i thought I might chime in with a recent experience. I've been helping my girlfriend out getting here cal 34 engine up to snuff, it was purchased with a non functioning engine (atomic 4)and we were working on it in the boat for quite some time with limited success. Long story short, we ended up pulling it out of the boat, and putting a rebuilt one in as the valves had become so badly welded that it wasn't worth the effort to rebuilt. I wish i had done it earlier. If you are having trouble getting people to come to you, it might be worthwhile to pull it out and take it somewhere. It was shockingly easy to get the atomic 4 in and out with just the main halyard and the mast winch, and I think the a4 with a v drive is well over 100 pounds heavier than your little yanmar. We still haven't gotten the reinstalled engine up and running yet, reworking some of the electrical and really trying to make sure the shaft is perfectly aligned. This was both of our first major mechanical project on a boat Some things I wish I had done before pulling the engine. 1) PICTURES - of everything zoomed in and zoomed out photos of every wire and bolt you remove 2) Labels - before you take the photos make sure you label each wire and that you can read the label in the photo 3) pay attention to the mounts as you remove them. How are they bolted in etc... Probably more of a last resort situation, but it seems to be working well for us -tim On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 9:51 AM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hello all, Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as moral support. I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been challenging me lately. I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with Joe Demers from Sound Marine Diesel; LLC <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> SoundMarineDiesel.com (860) 666-2184 <tel:%28860%29%20666-2184> AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, CA. Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help diagnose? I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because it’s old. (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) “Well, it’s got No compression” “how do you know?” I asked. “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it quit. Should or can we measure it?” Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase cost and certainly not be a return. () I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what isn’t necessary Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can re-power for you” Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh engine. : ) Thanks. .tom.. From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat Hi, all, I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of used boats. Now there is. So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate efficiently in whatever conditions we face. When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we generally admire. For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." Chris Campbell > > _____ <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> Avast logo This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Yes, I have considered an outboard. That was recently discussed at length here. Again though, before I repower, I’m trying to do a diagnosis. I would be very unhappy if it was “just a loose wire”…or something simple that I overlooked. : ) ..tom From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, April 22, 2016 10:58 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; TomDressler Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat On 4/22/2016 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] wrote: Hello all, Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as moral support. I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been challenging me lately. Another option is repowering with an outboard. You can pay as much or as little as you want to pay for that. I just looked--your 2-25 has a displacement listed as 4,500 lbs. My other boat, a 26' Seafarer Polaris, is 4,750 lbs. She's powered by an 8 h.p. 2-stroke outboard in a well. The little engine pushes her along nicely in protected waters. I've never had to power in high winds or seas. The outboard is used for getting to or from the marina, about 2 mi. between the slip and sailing waters (I can usually sail one way and power the other). If you use the engine for that kind of limited propulsion, not for cruising distances, then the outboard is fully satisfactory. In addition, it's easy to service and change. Chris Campbell --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Hi CalPals I had to chime in here as a Cal owner since 1970, our Cal 46 since 1982 and as a trained, experienced diesel engine rebuilder since I first retired in 1988. We sailed away from Long Beach, CA May 1, 1988, cruised around for 14 years, finally swallowing the anchor 2002 here on Bayou Chico FL. Out of boredom, I re-started my boat repair business at first specializing in Atomic 4's, then Perkins 4.108's and an occasional Yanmar, Kubota or gasser., We just completed rebuild of a Yanmar 1GM10, single cylinder 10HP. We replaced all bearings, the piston rings, cam, and other needed parts. I rebuilt, calibrated tested the fuel injector.It has tested out and runs well. The entire cost to the customer was slightly over $3,000. My young business partner, only 71 years old and I, age 77 are not cheap. Our standard is if we would put it our boat and cross an ocean, we will sell it to you. Unfortunately, as in many businesses there are charlatans and dishonest folks. There are also many honest, reliable people like Joe De Mers. I am sorry to hear about your issues. The first thing we would have done is check the compression with a proper gauge and then proceed. Some things to consider:1-An adequate sized new outboard is going to cost over $3,0002-Most new outboards are 4 stroke and too heavy to hang on the transom off your boat.3-Hanging off the back of your boat starting, shifting and adjusting speed is just plain dangerous4-IMHO, the only means of powering your sailboat that is more expensive than an outboard is two blue eyed, buxom, blondes with paddles Only Navy, Coast Guard, public safety and a few others are required to have boats. You have a boat for pleasure.Remember BOAT is an acronym, Break Out Another Thousand $$ We would offer to repair your engine, but we are 2,500 miles away and booked up until August Tom Vandiver, Cal 46 SATORI From: "'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, April 22, 2016 11:51 AM Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat Hello all,Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as moral support.I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how.I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been challenging me lately.I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with Joe Demers from Sound Marine Diesel; LLC SoundMarineDiesel.com (860) 666-2184 AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, CA.Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse.Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help diagnose?I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because it’s old.(one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does)“Well, it’s got No compression”“how do you know?” I asked.“you can tell by the sound”, he replied.I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it quit. Should or can we measure it?” Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase cost and certainly not be a return. ()I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what isn’t necessary Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank”I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply.I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can re-power for you” Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support.I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh engine.: ) Thanks..tom.. From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat Hi, all, I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of used boats. Now there is. So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate efficiently in whatever conditions we face. When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we generally admire. For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." Chris Campbell > > | | This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com |

I am of the belief that old engines can be made to run just about forever if well maintained. As a hobby I restore old Caterpillar dozers. I currently own one 1949 and one 1955 D2 model machines. At one time I had four fully functional D2's, but thinned out the herd the past couple of years. They are old four cylinder slow turn diesels with two cylinder gas pony motor starters. These old machines start and run great after all these years. In repairing anything it is divide and conquer. Methodically go through all the systems, making sure things are correct. I am not totally familiar with your engine, so will just speak in general terms or about my Yanmar. We have a Yanmar 3GM30F in our 1986 Cal 33-2. The original engine and it runs fantastic. But I went through some heartache getting it to that point. But mine was all fuel issues. Final problem as a small crack in the fuel separator bowl allowing air to get into the fuel system. The engine would just quit at the worst possible times. In repairing this problem I also replaced all my rubber fuel line to and from the tank (in case it was collapsing internally), put a check valve at the fuel tank and bought a new fuel separator and fuel pump). I can cruise for hours no issues. But definitely I found a small crack in the separator bowl that was letting in air. I just wanted to kind of shotgun the fuel system since it was all original and showing its age. If your engine has not been torn apart, then hopefully all the timing is correct. So then you are dealing with air and fuel. The engine fires from heat of compression, so no spark to worry with. Eliminate things. Install a fuel line from the fuel pump directly into a container of diesel. Rule out the fuel separator and tank. I think you said you bypassed the fuel system. Bleed everything. On my engine there is a bleed on the final fuel filter and a bleed just before the injectors. I usually bleed at each injector as well until fuel is coming out the line leading to the injector. When bleeding have the compression lever flipped so no compression. Be aware not to let water get into your cylinder, so have the salt water inlet closed. Once you have fuel spitting out each injector line and you feel that all the air is out, tighten those lines and flip the compression back on and see if you can get it to pop. Does it pop at all? These old diesels will run just about forever. I had an old Caterpillar D7 (1957 model year) that I bought from a farmer. The machine had sit in a field for about 10 years, never started. He said "It was running when I parked it!". I wanted it to clear some land, then resell. The pony engine had a stuck piston and also ended up having a stuck valve. I freed that stuff up and the darn pony fired up. Then I found two stuck injector pumps on the diesel. The old Cat has a mechanical cam mechanism that works all the injector pumps and two of the pump plungers were stuck up. Once I got those free and cleaned the fuel system, changed the fluids, this old machine sitting in a field for ten years rumbled to life. It was amazing. I talked to an old Caterpillar mechanic once who said that even when the old engine had lost most of its compression and was belching oil, if you could spin it long enough for the cylinders to get hot it would start and run. And having a pony engine you can spin the engine as long as needed to get them to fire. So, to condemn your old Yanmar I would think it would need to have lots wrong with it. Broken rings, bad piston or some major problem, but even then that stuff can be fixed. On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > Hello all, > > Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as > moral support. > > I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, > knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. > > I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been > challenging me lately. > > I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with *Joe Demers from Sound > Marine Diesel; LLC* > > > > SoundMarineDiesel.com <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> (860) 666-2184 > > > > AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, > CA. > > Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! > > > > I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other > things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. > > Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is > familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help > diagnose? > > I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except > charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because > it’s old. > > (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he > argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) > > “Well, it’s got No compression” > > “how do you know?” I asked. > > “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. > > I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, > that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it > quit. Should or can we measure it?” > > > > Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. > > > > But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase > cost and certainly not be a return. () > > I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a > $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what > isn’t necessary > > > > Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the > fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” > > I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. > > I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can > re-power for you” > > > > Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. > > I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh > engine. > > : ) > > > > Thanks. > > .tom.. > > > > > > *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Subject:* [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat > > > > > > Hi, all, > > I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the > comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I > posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. > > We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners > to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the > problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. > Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known > vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). > There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, > when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. > Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of > used boats. Now there is. > > So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing > is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've > acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an > opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. > It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is > not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee > weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, > like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding > collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart > rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the > warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends > aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate > efficiently in whatever conditions we face. > > When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has > traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a > tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, > applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we > generally admire. > > For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. > We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the > hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing > a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, > with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in > short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could > let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral > deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other > boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer > 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of > mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way > that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, > but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My > little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, > and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that > already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. > > None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell > either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse > me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great > privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to > afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much > to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my > extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to > have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good > things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around > now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." > > Chris Campbell > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > [image: Avast logo] > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > >

Hello Newman! : ) Thanks all, especially Joe Demers. Here’s what I have done recently. I removed the intake side to look at that piece..is it flowing? The air ‘filter’ is a bit gunked up but it does flow and I can feel the intake on my hand. And to see the valve and watch it actuate to see if it’s actually moving…and so satisfy my mechanical curiosity. A follow up conversation with Joe D suggests almost categorically that it isn’t seating because on the compression stroke, I see a spray coming back into the intake side. Since you asked: Yanmar YSM8. Single cyl, 8 bhp, no –pre-ignitor. Fuel tank - Racor filter – Lift pump – engine filter – injector pump – Injector and a return line. 4 bleed points: Racor, engine filter, injector pump, injector. Yes, I did bleed the racor, the engine filter, the injector pump and the injector. It all squirts fuel. In doing so, the bleed port on the engine filter stripped so I replaced that entire assembly. I also bypassed it all and drew from a small quart bottle of fresh diesel straight into the injector pump. I am considering pulling the head and sending it out for a re-work. My day job keeps me off the dock all day and recently, it’s been crazy windy here in Monterey so I have not gone down to see her in the last few days. And I’m moving also so my time is stretched thin. I agree that it *SHOULD* go and I see areas that can be improved/repaired. I’m not giving up on the engine yet, much to the chagrin of the local ‘mechanics that want to re-power. Actually, my next step is to set the engine timing..position the flywheel to TDC and pull the head. Unless ‘you’ think otherwise. Thanks. ..tom From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 8:37 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; TomDressler Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat I am of the belief that old engines can be made to run just about forever if well maintained. As a hobby I restore old Caterpillar dozers. I currently own one 1949 and one 1955 D2 model machines. At one time I had four fully functional D2's, but thinned out the herd the past couple of years. They are old four cylinder slow turn diesels with two cylinder gas pony motor starters. These old machines start and run great after all these years. In repairing anything it is divide and conquer. Methodically go through all the systems, making sure things are correct. I am not totally familiar with your engine, so will just speak in general terms or about my Yanmar. We have a Yanmar 3GM30F in our 1986 Cal 33-2. The original engine and it runs fantastic. But I went through some heartache getting it to that point. But mine was all fuel issues. Final problem as a small crack in the fuel separator bowl allowing air to get into the fuel system. The engine would just quit at the worst possible times. In repairing this problem I also replaced all my rubber fuel line to and from the tank (in case it was collapsing internally), put a check valve at the fuel tank and bought a new fuel separator and fuel pump). I can cruise for hours no issues. But definitely I found a small crack in the separator bowl that was letting in air. I just wanted to kind of shotgun the fuel system since it was all original and showing its age. If your engine has not been torn apart, then hopefully all the timing is correct. So then you are dealing with air and fuel. The engine fires from heat of compression, so no spark to worry with. Eliminate things. Install a fuel line from the fuel pump directly into a container of diesel. Rule out the fuel separator and tank. I think you said you bypassed the fuel system. Bleed everything. On my engine there is a bleed on the final fuel filter and a bleed just before the injectors. I usually bleed at each injector as well until fuel is coming out the line leading to the injector. When bleeding have the compression lever flipped so no compression. Be aware not to let water get into your cylinder, so have the salt water inlet closed. Once you have fuel spitting out each injector line and you feel that all the air is out, tighten those lines and flip the compression back on and see if you can get it to pop. Does it pop at all? These old diesels will run just about forever. I had an old Caterpillar D7 (1957 model year) that I bought from a farmer. The machine had sit in a field for about 10 years, never started. He said "It was running when I parked it!". I wanted it to clear some land, then resell. The pony engine had a stuck piston and also ended up having a stuck valve. I freed that stuff up and the darn pony fired up. Then I found two stuck injector pumps on the diesel. The old Cat has a mechanical cam mechanism that works all the injector pumps and two of the pump plungers were stuck up. Once I got those free and cleaned the fuel system, changed the fluids, this old machine sitting in a field for ten years rumbled to life. It was amazing. I talked to an old Caterpillar mechanic once who said that even when the old engine had lost most of its compression and was belching oil, if you could spin it long enough for the cylinders to get hot it would start and run. And having a pony engine you can spin the engine as long as needed to get them to fire. So, to condemn your old Yanmar I would think it would need to have lots wrong with it. Broken rings, bad piston or some major problem, but even then that stuff can be fixed. On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hello all, Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as moral support. I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been challenging me lately. I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with Joe Demers from Sound Marine Diesel; LLC <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> SoundMarineDiesel.com (860) 666-2184 <tel:%28860%29%20666-2184> AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, CA. Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help diagnose? I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because it’s old. (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) “Well, it’s got No compression” “how do you know?” I asked. “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it quit. Should or can we measure it?” Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase cost and certainly not be a return. () I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what isn’t necessary Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can re-power for you” Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh engine. : ) Thanks. .tom.. From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat Hi, all, I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of used boats. Now there is. So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate efficiently in whatever conditions we face. When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we generally admire. For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." Chris Campbell > > _____ <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

I'd pull the injector and take it to a diesel mechanic. Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Tue, Apr 26, 2016 at 12:27 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats]<Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hello Newman! : ) Thanks all, especially Joe Demers. Here’s what I have done recently. I removed the intake side to look at that piece..is it flowing? The air ‘filter’ is a bit gunked up but it does flow and I can feel the intake on my hand. And to see the valve and watch it actuate to see if it’s actually moving…and so satisfy my mechanical curiosity. A follow up conversation with Joe D suggests almost categorically that it isn’t seating because on the compression stroke, I see a spray coming back into the intake side. Since you asked: Yanmar YSM8. Single cyl, 8 bhp, no –pre-ignitor. Fuel tank - Racor filter – Lift pump – engine filter – injector pump – Injector and a return line. 4 bleed points: Racor, engine filter, injector pump, injector. Yes, I did bleed the racor, the engine filter, the injector pump and the injector. It all squirts fuel. In doing so, the bleed port on the engine filter stripped so I replaced that entire assembly. I also bypassed it all and drew from a small quart bottle of fresh diesel straight into the injector pump. I am considering pulling the head and sending it out for a re-work. My day job keeps me off the dock all day and recently, it’s been crazy windy here in Monterey so I have not gone down to see her in the last few days. And I’m moving also so my time is stretched thin. I agree that it *SHOULD* go and I see areas that can be improved/repaired. I’m not giving up on the engine yet, much to the chagrin of the local ‘mechanics that want to re-power. Actually, my next step is to set the engine timing..position the flywheel to TDC and pull the head. Unless ‘you’ think otherwise. Thanks. ..tom From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 8:37 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; TomDressler Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat I am of the belief that old engines can be made to run just about forever if well maintained. As a hobby I restore old Caterpillar dozers. I currently own one 1949 and one 1955 D2 model machines. At one time I had four fully functional D2's, but thinned out the herd the past couple of years. They are old four cylinder slow turn diesels with two cylinder gas pony motor starters. These old machines start and run great after all these years. In repairing anything it is divide and conquer. Methodically go through all the systems, making sure things are correct. I am not totally familiar with your engine, so will just speak in general terms or about my Yanmar. We have a Yanmar 3GM30F in our 1986 Cal 33-2. The original engine and it runs fantastic. But I went through some heartache getting it to that point. But mine was all fuel issues. Final problem as a small crack in the fuel separator bowl allowing air to get into the fuel system. The engine would just quit at the worst possible times. In repairing this problem I also replaced all my rubber fuel line to and from the tank (in case it was collapsing internally), put a check valve at the fuel tank and bought a new fuel separator and fuel pump). I can cruise for hours no issues. But definitely I found a small crack in the separator bowl that was letting in air. I just wanted to kind of shotgun the fuel system since it was all original and showing its age. If your engine has not been torn apart, then hopefully all the timing is correct. So then you are dealing with air and fuel. The engine fires from heat of compression, so no spark to worry with. Eliminate things. Install a fuel line from the fuel pump directly into a container of diesel. Rule out the fuel separator and tank. I think you said you bypassed the fuel system. Bleed everything. On my engine there is a bleed on the final fuel filter and a bleed just before the injectors. I usually bleed at each injector as well until fuel is coming out the line leading to the injector. When bleeding have the compression lever flipped so no compression. Be aware not to let water get into your cylinder, so have the salt water inlet closed. Once you have fuel spitting out each injector line and you feel that all the air is out, tighten those lines and flip the compression back on and see if you can get it to pop. Does it pop at all? These old diesels will run just about forever. I had an old Caterpillar D7 (1957 model year) that I bought from a farmer. The machine had sit in a field for about 10 years, never started. He said "It was running when I parked it!". I wanted it to clear some land, then resell. The pony engine had a stuck piston and also ended up having a stuck valve. I freed that stuff up and the darn pony fired up. Then I found two stuck injector pumps on the diesel. The old Cat has a mechanical cam mechanism that works all the injector pumps and two of the pump plungers were stuck up. Once I got those free and cleaned the fuel system, changed the fluids, this old machine sitting in a field for ten years rumbled to life. It was amazing. I talked to an old Caterpillar mechanic once who said that even when the old engine had lost most of its compression and was belching oil, if you could spin it long enough for the cylinders to get hot it would start and run. And having a pony engine you can spin the engine as long as needed to get them to fire. So, to condemn your old Yanmar I would think it would need to have lots wrong with it. Broken rings, bad piston or some major problem, but even then that stuff can be fixed. On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hello all, Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as moral support. I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been challenging me lately. I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with Joe Demers from Sound Marine Diesel; LLC SoundMarineDiesel.com (860) 666-2184 AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, CA. Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help diagnose? I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because it’s old. (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) “Well, it’s got No compression” “how do you know?” I asked. “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it quit. Should or can we measure it?” Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase cost and certainly not be a return. () I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what isn’t necessary Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can re-power for you” Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh engine. : ) Thanks. .tom.. From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat Hi, all, I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of used boats. Now there is. So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate efficiently in whatever conditions we face. When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we generally admire. For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." Chris Campbell > > | | This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com | | | This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com |

Blow back on the intake could be valve bent or mis-adjusted and not closing. I would check the valve adjustment. Then if still blow back remove the head. Not knowing the failure mode hard to say. Engine just quit while running or fail to start after a normal shut down? Leslie Newman Puffin Cal 33-2 On Tuesday, April 26, 2016, Chris ch… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] < Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > I'd pull the injector and take it to a diesel mechanic. > > Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android > <https://overview.mail.yahoo.com/mobile/?.src=Android> > > > > Hello Newman! > > : ) > > > > Thanks all, especially Joe Demers. > > Here’s what I have done recently. > > I removed the intake side to look at that piece..is it flowing? The air > ‘filter’ is a bit gunked up but it does flow and I can feel the intake on > my hand. > > And to see the valve and watch it actuate to see if it’s actually > moving…and so satisfy my mechanical curiosity. > > A follow up conversation with Joe D suggests almost categorically that it > isn’t seating because on the compression stroke, I see a spray coming back > into the intake side. > > > > Since you asked: Yanmar YSM8. Single cyl, 8 bhp, no –pre-ignitor. > > Fuel tank - Racor filter – Lift pump – engine filter – injector pump – > Injector and a return line. > > 4 bleed points: Racor, engine filter, injector pump, injector. > > Yes, I did bleed the racor, the engine filter, the injector pump and the > injector. > > It all squirts fuel. > > In doing so, the bleed port on the engine filter stripped so I replaced > that entire assembly. > > > > I also bypassed it all and drew from a small quart bottle of fresh diesel > straight into the injector pump. > > I am considering pulling the head and sending it out for a re-work. > > My day job keeps me off the dock all day and recently, it’s been crazy > windy here in Monterey so I have not gone down to see her in the last few > days. > > And I’m moving also so my time is stretched thin. > > I agree that it **SHOULD** go and I see areas that can be > improved/repaired. I’m not giving up on the engine yet, much to the chagrin > of the local ‘mechanics that want to re-power. > > Actually, my next step is to set the engine timing..position the flywheel > to TDC and pull the head. > > Unless ‘you’ think otherwise. > > Thanks. > > > > ..tom > > > > > > > > *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');> [mailto: > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');>] > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 26, 2016 8:37 AM > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');>; TomDressler > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat > > > > > > I am of the belief that old engines can be made to run just about forever > if well maintained. > > As a hobby I restore old Caterpillar dozers. I currently own one 1949 and > one 1955 D2 model machines. At one time I had four fully functional D2's, > but thinned out the herd the past couple of years. They are old four > cylinder slow turn diesels with two cylinder gas pony motor starters. These > old machines start and run great after all these years. > > > > In repairing anything it is divide and conquer. Methodically go through > all the systems, making sure things are correct. > > > > I am not totally familiar with your engine, so will just speak in general > terms or about my Yanmar. > > > > We have a Yanmar 3GM30F in our 1986 Cal 33-2. The original engine and it > runs fantastic. But I went through some heartache getting it to that point. > But mine was all fuel issues. Final problem as a small crack in the fuel > separator bowl allowing air to get into the fuel system. The engine would > just quit at the worst possible times. In repairing this problem I also > replaced all my rubber fuel line to and from the tank (in case it was > collapsing internally), put a check valve at the fuel tank and bought a new > fuel separator and fuel pump). I can cruise for hours no issues. But > definitely I found a small crack in the separator bowl that was letting in > air. I just wanted to kind of shotgun the fuel system since it was all > original and showing its age. > > > > If your engine has not been torn apart, then hopefully all the timing is > correct. So then you are dealing with air and fuel. The engine fires from > heat of compression, so no spark to worry with. > > > > Eliminate things. Install a fuel line from the fuel pump directly into a > container of diesel. Rule out the fuel separator and tank. I think you said > you bypassed the fuel system. > > > > Bleed everything. On my engine there is a bleed on the final fuel filter > and a bleed just before the injectors. I usually bleed at each injector as > well until fuel is coming out the line leading to the injector. When > bleeding have the compression lever flipped so no compression. Be aware not > to let water get into your cylinder, so have the salt water inlet closed. > Once you have fuel spitting out each injector line and you feel that all > the air is out, tighten those lines and flip the compression back on and > see if you can get it to pop. Does it pop at all? > > > > These old diesels will run just about forever. I had an old Caterpillar D7 > (1957 model year) that I bought from a farmer. The machine had sit in a > field for about 10 years, never started. He said "It was running when I > parked it!". I wanted it to clear some land, then resell. The pony engine > had a stuck piston and also ended up having a stuck valve. I freed that > stuff up and the darn pony fired up. Then I found two stuck injector pumps > on the diesel. The old Cat has a mechanical cam mechanism that works all > the injector pumps and two of the pump plungers were stuck up. Once I got > those free and cleaned the fuel system, changed the fluids, this old > machine sitting in a field for ten years rumbled to life. It was amazing. > > > > I talked to an old Caterpillar mechanic once who said that even when the > old engine had lost most of its compression and was belching oil, if you > could spin it long enough for the cylinders to get hot it would start and > run. And having a pony engine you can spin the engine as long as needed to > get them to fire. > > > > So, to condemn your old Yanmar I would think it would need to have lots > wrong with it. Broken rings, bad piston or some major problem, but even > then that stuff can be fixed. > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net > [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > > Hello all, > > Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as > moral support. > > I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, > knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. > > I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been > challenging me lately. > > I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with *Joe Demers from Sound > Marine Diesel; LLC* > > > > SoundMarineDiesel.com <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> (860) 666-2184 > > > > AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, > CA. > > Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! > > > > I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other > things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. > > Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is > familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help > diagnose? > > I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except > charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because > it’s old. > > (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he > argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) > > “Well, it’s got No compression” > > “how do you know?” I asked. > > “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. > > I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, > that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it > quit. Should or can we measure it?” > > > > Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. > > > > But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase > cost and certainly not be a return. () > > I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a > $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what > isn’t necessary > > > > Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the > fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” > > I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. > > I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can > re-power for you” > > > > Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. > > I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh > engine. > > : ) > > > > Thanks. > > .tom.. > > > > > > *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > *Subject:* [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat > > > > > > Hi, all, > > I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the > comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I > posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. > > We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners > to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the > problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. > Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known > vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). > There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, > when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. > Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of > used boats. Now there is. > > So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing > is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've > acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an > opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. > It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is > not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee > weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, > like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding > collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart > rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the > warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends > aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate > efficiently in whatever conditions we face. > > When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has > traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a > tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, > applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we > generally admire. > > For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. > We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the > hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing > a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, > with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in > short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could > let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral > deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other > boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer > 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of > mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way > that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, > but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My > little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, > and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that > already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. > > None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell > either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse > me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great > privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to > afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much > to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my > extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to > have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good > things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around > now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." > > Chris Campbell > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > *www.avast.com* > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > > ------------------------------ > [image: Avast logo] > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > >

I would first replace the injector rather than go through all that. Since I have to remove it anyway..yes? A mechanic will charge as much as a new injector. From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 12:53 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat I'd pull the injector and take it to a diesel mechanic. Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android <https://overview.mail.yahoo.com/mobile/?.src=Android> Hello Newman! : ) Thanks all, especially Joe Demers. Here’s what I have done recently. I removed the intake side to look at that piece..is it flowing? The air ‘filter’ is a bit gunked up but it does flow and I can feel the intake on my hand. And to see the valve and watch it actuate to see if it’s actually moving…and so satisfy my mechanical curiosity. A follow up conversation with Joe D suggests almost categorically that it isn’t seating because on the compression stroke, I see a spray coming back into the intake side. Since you asked: Yanmar YSM8. Single cyl, 8 bhp, no –pre-ignitor. Fuel tank - Racor filter – Lift pump – engine filter – injector pump – Injector and a return line. 4 bleed points: Racor, engine filter, injector pump, injector. Yes, I did bleed the racor, the engine filter, the injector pump and the injector. It all squirts fuel. In doing so, the bleed port on the engine filter stripped so I replaced that entire assembly. I also bypassed it all and drew from a small quart bottle of fresh diesel straight into the injector pump. I am considering pulling the head and sending it out for a re-work. My day job keeps me off the dock all day and recently, it’s been crazy windy here in Monterey so I have not gone down to see her in the last few days. And I’m moving also so my time is stretched thin. I agree that it *SHOULD* go and I see areas that can be improved/repaired. I’m not giving up on the engine yet, much to the chagrin of the local ‘mechanics that want to re-power. Actually, my next step is to set the engine timing..position the flywheel to TDC and pull the head. Unless ‘you’ think otherwise. Thanks. ..tom From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 8:37 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; TomDressler Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat I am of the belief that old engines can be made to run just about forever if well maintained. As a hobby I restore old Caterpillar dozers. I currently own one 1949 and one 1955 D2 model machines. At one time I had four fully functional D2's, but thinned out the herd the past couple of years. They are old four cylinder slow turn diesels with two cylinder gas pony motor starters. These old machines start and run great after all these years. In repairing anything it is divide and conquer. Methodically go through all the systems, making sure things are correct. I am not totally familiar with your engine, so will just speak in general terms or about my Yanmar. We have a Yanmar 3GM30F in our 1986 Cal 33-2. The original engine and it runs fantastic. But I went through some heartache getting it to that point. But mine was all fuel issues. Final problem as a small crack in the fuel separator bowl allowing air to get into the fuel system. The engine would just quit at the worst possible times. In repairing this problem I also replaced all my rubber fuel line to and from the tank (in case it was collapsing internally), put a check valve at the fuel tank and bought a new fuel separator and fuel pump). I can cruise for hours no issues. But definitely I found a small crack in the separator bowl that was letting in air. I just wanted to kind of shotgun the fuel system since it was all original and showing its age. If your engine has not been torn apart, then hopefully all the timing is correct. So then you are dealing with air and fuel. The engine fires from heat of compression, so no spark to worry with. Eliminate things. Install a fuel line from the fuel pump directly into a container of diesel. Rule out the fuel separator and tank. I think you said you bypassed the fuel system. Bleed everything. On my engine there is a bleed on the final fuel filter and a bleed just before the injectors. I usually bleed at each injector as well until fuel is coming out the line leading to the injector. When bleeding have the compression lever flipped so no compression. Be aware not to let water get into your cylinder, so have the salt water inlet closed. Once you have fuel spitting out each injector line and you feel that all the air is out, tighten those lines and flip the compression back on and see if you can get it to pop. Does it pop at all? These old diesels will run just about forever. I had an old Caterpillar D7 (1957 model year) that I bought from a farmer. The machine had sit in a field for about 10 years, never started. He said "It was running when I parked it!". I wanted it to clear some land, then resell. The pony engine had a stuck piston and also ended up having a stuck valve. I freed that stuff up and the darn pony fired up. Then I found two stuck injector pumps on the diesel. The old Cat has a mechanical cam mechanism that works all the injector pumps and two of the pump plungers were stuck up. Once I got those free and cleaned the fuel system, changed the fluids, this old machine sitting in a field for ten years rumbled to life. It was amazing. I talked to an old Caterpillar mechanic once who said that even when the old engine had lost most of its compression and was belching oil, if you could spin it long enough for the cylinders to get hot it would start and run. And having a pony engine you can spin the engine as long as needed to get them to fire. So, to condemn your old Yanmar I would think it would need to have lots wrong with it. Broken rings, bad piston or some major problem, but even then that stuff can be fixed. On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hello all, Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as moral support. I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been challenging me lately. I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with Joe Demers from Sound Marine Diesel; LLC <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> SoundMarineDiesel.com (860) 666-2184 AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, CA. Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help diagnose? I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because it’s old. (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) “Well, it’s got No compression” “how do you know?” I asked. “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it quit. Should or can we measure it?” Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase cost and certainly not be a return. () I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what isn’t necessary Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can re-power for you” Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh engine. : ) Thanks. .tom.. From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat Hi, all, I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of used boats. Now there is. So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate efficiently in whatever conditions we face. When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we generally admire. For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." Chris Campbell > > _____ <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> _____ <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> Avast logo This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

After your description then yes maybe a new injector. Injectors can also be tested. But probably just as cost effective to just replace it. On Tuesday, April 26, 2016, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] < Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > I would first replace the injector rather than go through all that. Since > I have to remove it anyway..yes? > > A mechanic will charge as much as a new injector. > > > > *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');> [mailto: > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');>] > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 26, 2016 12:53 PM > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');> > *Subject:* RE: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat > > > > > > I'd pull the injector and take it to a diesel mechanic. > > Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android > <https://overview.mail.yahoo.com/mobile/?.src=Android> > > > > > > Hello Newman! > > : ) > > > > Thanks all, especially Joe Demers. > > Here’s what I have done recently. > > I removed the intake side to look at that piece..is it flowing? The air > ‘filter’ is a bit gunked up but it does flow and I can feel the intake on > my hand. > > And to see the valve and watch it actuate to see if it’s actually > moving…and so satisfy my mechanical curiosity. > > A follow up conversation with Joe D suggests almost categorically that it > isn’t seating because on the compression stroke, I see a spray coming back > into the intake side. > > > > Since you asked: Yanmar YSM8. Single cyl, 8 bhp, no –pre-ignitor. > > Fuel tank - Racor filter – Lift pump – engine filter – injector pump – > Injector and a return line. > > 4 bleed points: Racor, engine filter, injector pump, injector. > > Yes, I did bleed the racor, the engine filter, the injector pump and the > injector. > > It all squirts fuel. > > In doing so, the bleed port on the engine filter stripped so I replaced > that entire assembly. > > > > I also bypassed it all and drew from a small quart bottle of fresh diesel > straight into the injector pump. > > I am considering pulling the head and sending it out for a re-work. > > My day job keeps me off the dock all day and recently, it’s been crazy > windy here in Monterey so I have not gone down to see her in the last few > days. > > And I’m moving also so my time is stretched thin. > > I agree that it **SHOULD** go and I see areas that can be > improved/repaired. I’m not giving up on the engine yet, much to the chagrin > of the local ‘mechanics that want to re-power. > > Actually, my next step is to set the engine timing..position the flywheel > to TDC and pull the head. > > Unless ‘you’ think otherwise. > > Thanks. > > > > ..tom > > > > > > > > *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');> [mailto: > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');>] > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 26, 2016 8:37 AM > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');>; TomDressler > *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat > > > > > > I am of the belief that old engines can be made to run just about forever > if well maintained. > > As a hobby I restore old Caterpillar dozers. I currently own one 1949 and > one 1955 D2 model machines. At one time I had four fully functional D2's, > but thinned out the herd the past couple of years. They are old four > cylinder slow turn diesels with two cylinder gas pony motor starters. These > old machines start and run great after all these years. > > > > In repairing anything it is divide and conquer. Methodically go through > all the systems, making sure things are correct. > > > > I am not totally familiar with your engine, so will just speak in general > terms or about my Yanmar. > > > > We have a Yanmar 3GM30F in our 1986 Cal 33-2. The original engine and it > runs fantastic. But I went through some heartache getting it to that point. > But mine was all fuel issues. Final problem as a small crack in the fuel > separator bowl allowing air to get into the fuel system. The engine would > just quit at the worst possible times. In repairing this problem I also > replaced all my rubber fuel line to and from the tank (in case it was > collapsing internally), put a check valve at the fuel tank and bought a new > fuel separator and fuel pump). I can cruise for hours no issues. But > definitely I found a small crack in the separator bowl that was letting in > air. I just wanted to kind of shotgun the fuel system since it was all > original and showing its age. > > > > If your engine has not been torn apart, then hopefully all the timing is > correct. So then you are dealing with air and fuel. The engine fires from > heat of compression, so no spark to worry with. > > > > Eliminate things. Install a fuel line from the fuel pump directly into a > container of diesel. Rule out the fuel separator and tank. I think you said > you bypassed the fuel system. > > > > Bleed everything. On my engine there is a bleed on the final fuel filter > and a bleed just before the injectors. I usually bleed at each injector as > well until fuel is coming out the line leading to the injector. When > bleeding have the compression lever flipped so no compression. Be aware not > to let water get into your cylinder, so have the salt water inlet closed. > Once you have fuel spitting out each injector line and you feel that all > the air is out, tighten those lines and flip the compression back on and > see if you can get it to pop. Does it pop at all? > > > > These old diesels will run just about forever. I had an old Caterpillar D7 > (1957 model year) that I bought from a farmer. The machine had sit in a > field for about 10 years, never started. He said "It was running when I > parked it!". I wanted it to clear some land, then resell. The pony engine > had a stuck piston and also ended up having a stuck valve. I freed that > stuff up and the darn pony fired up. Then I found two stuck injector pumps > on the diesel. The old Cat has a mechanical cam mechanism that works all > the injector pumps and two of the pump plungers were stuck up. Once I got > those free and cleaned the fuel system, changed the fluids, this old > machine sitting in a field for ten years rumbled to life. It was amazing. > > > > I talked to an old Caterpillar mechanic once who said that even when the > old engine had lost most of its compression and was belching oil, if you > could spin it long enough for the cylinders to get hot it would start and > run. And having a pony engine you can spin the engine as long as needed to > get them to fire. > > > > So, to condemn your old Yanmar I would think it would need to have lots > wrong with it. Broken rings, bad piston or some major problem, but even > then that stuff can be fixed. > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','tb… [at] verizon.net');> [Cal_Boats] < > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');>> wrote: > > > > Hello all, > > Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as > moral support. > > I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, > knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. > > I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been > challenging me lately. > > I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with *Joe Demers from Sound > Marine Diesel; LLC* > > > > SoundMarineDiesel.com <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> (860) 666-2184 > > > > AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, > CA. > > Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! > > > > I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other > things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. > > Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is > familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help > diagnose? > > I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except > charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because > it’s old. > > (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he > argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) > > “Well, it’s got No compression” > > “how do you know?” I asked. > > “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. > > I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, > that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it > quit. Should or can we measure it?” > > > > Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. > > > > But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase > cost and certainly not be a return. () > > I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a > $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what > isn’t necessary > > > > Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the > fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” > > I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. > > I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can > re-power for you” > > > > Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. > > I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh > engine. > > : ) > > > > Thanks. > > .tom.. > > > > > > *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');> [mailto: > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');>] > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM > *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com > <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com');> > *Subject:* [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat > > > > > > Hi, all, > > I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the > comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I > posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. > > We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners > to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the > problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. > Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known > vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). > There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, > when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. > Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of > used boats. Now there is. > > So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing > is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've > acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an > opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. > It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is > not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee > weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, > like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding > collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart > rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the > warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends > aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate > efficiently in whatever conditions we face. > > When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has > traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a > tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, > applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we > generally admire. > > For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. > We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the > hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing > a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, > with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in > short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could > let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral > deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other > boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer > 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of > mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way > that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, > but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My > little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, > and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that > already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. > > None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell > either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse > me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great > privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to > afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much > to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my > extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to > have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good > things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around > now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." > > Chris Campbell > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > > ------------------------------ > > [image: Avast logo] > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > > > > > ------------------------------ > [image: Avast logo] > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> > > >

Aloha, my name is Bobby an I have a cal-2 30 on the big island. I recently went through hell with my Volvo MD7A getting her to run finally. Some tips that may help, you may or may not know these. I did all the filters an fuel cleaning etc an had to keep going. if you pull the injectors u can turn them around and hook up an see if they are spraying before just sending them out. I sent mine out an found out they were not the total issue. Adjust or check your valve adjustment because one might be loose causing loss of compression. Make sure you battery's are up when trying to start it. Big difference on mine Turning over with full battery's vs not in how long to heat up those cylinders. Compression gauges are not too expensive an you can check that yourself if the mechanics don't want to for you. Make sure you exhaust elbow isn't clogged where it leaves the head an joins with the water. I got mine runing great now, but it was a little bit of everything. I was waiting wating for some help and finally just went through everything one at a time and found many little problems that all added up. Best of luck to u! Bobby G Cal-2 30 Kona, Hi > On Apr 26, 2016, at 3:26 PM, NEWMAN d2… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > After your description then yes maybe a new injector. Injectors can also be tested. But probably just as cost effective to just replace it. > > >> On Tuesday, April 26, 2016, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >> >> I would first replace the injector rather than go through all that. Since I have to remove it anyway..yes? >> >> A mechanic will charge as much as a new injector. >> >> >> >> From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] >> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 12:53 PM >> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >> Subject: RE: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat >> >> >> >> >> >> I'd pull the injector and take it to a diesel mechanic. >> >> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android >> >> >> >> >> >> Hello Newman! >> >> : ) >> >> >> >> Thanks all, especially Joe Demers. >> >> Here’s what I have done recently. >> >> I removed the intake side to look at that piece..is it flowing? The air ‘filter’ is a bit gunked up but it does flow and I can feel the intake on my hand. >> >> And to see the valve and watch it actuate to see if it’s actually moving…and so satisfy my mechanical curiosity. >> >> A follow up conversation with Joe D suggests almost categorically that it isn’t seating because on the compression stroke, I see a spray coming back into the intake side. >> >> >> >> Since you asked: Yanmar YSM8. Single cyl, 8 bhp, no –pre-ignitor. >> >> Fuel tank - Racor filter – Lift pump – engine filter – injector pump – Injector and a return line. >> >> 4 bleed points: Racor, engine filter, injector pump, injector. >> >> Yes, I did bleed the racor, the engine filter, the injector pump and the injector. >> >> It all squirts fuel. >> >> In doing so, the bleed port on the engine filter stripped so I replaced that entire assembly. >> >> >> >> I also bypassed it all and drew from a small quart bottle of fresh diesel straight into the injector pump. >> >> I am considering pulling the head and sending it out for a re-work. >> >> My day job keeps me off the dock all day and recently, it’s been crazy windy here in Monterey so I have not gone down to see her in the last few days. >> >> And I’m moving also so my time is stretched thin. >> >> I agree that it *SHOULD* go and I see areas that can be improved/repaired. I’m not giving up on the engine yet, much to the chagrin of the local ‘mechanics that want to re-power. >> >> Actually, my next step is to set the engine timing..position the flywheel to TDC and pull the head. >> >> Unless ‘you’ think otherwise. >> >> Thanks. >> >> >> >> ..tom >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] >> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 8:37 AM >> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; TomDressler >> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat >> >> >> >> >> >> I am of the belief that old engines can be made to run just about forever if well maintained. >> >> As a hobby I restore old Caterpillar dozers. I currently own one 1949 and one 1955 D2 model machines. At one time I had four fully functional D2's, but thinned out the herd the past couple of years. They are old four cylinder slow turn diesels with two cylinder gas pony motor starters. These old machines start and run great after all these years. >> >> >> >> In repairing anything it is divide and conquer. Methodically go through all the systems, making sure things are correct. >> >> >> >> I am not totally familiar with your engine, so will just speak in general terms or about my Yanmar. >> >> >> >> We have a Yanmar 3GM30F in our 1986 Cal 33-2. The original engine and it runs fantastic. But I went through some heartache getting it to that point. But mine was all fuel issues. Final problem as a small crack in the fuel separator bowl allowing air to get into the fuel system. The engine would just quit at the worst possible times. In repairing this problem I also replaced all my rubber fuel line to and from the tank (in case it was collapsing internally), put a check valve at the fuel tank and bought a new fuel separator and fuel pump). I can cruise for hours no issues. But definitely I found a small crack in the separator bowl that was letting in air. I just wanted to kind of shotgun the fuel system since it was all original and showing its age. >> >> >> >> If your engine has not been torn apart, then hopefully all the timing is correct. So then you are dealing with air and fuel. The engine fires from heat of compression, so no spark to worry with. >> >> >> >> Eliminate things. Install a fuel line from the fuel pump directly into a container of diesel. Rule out the fuel separator and tank. I think you said you bypassed the fuel system. >> >> >> >> Bleed everything. On my engine there is a bleed on the final fuel filter and a bleed just before the injectors. I usually bleed at each injector as well until fuel is coming out the line leading to the injector. When bleeding have the compression lever flipped so no compression. Be aware not to let water get into your cylinder, so have the salt water inlet closed. Once you have fuel spitting out each injector line and you feel that all the air is out, tighten those lines and flip the compression back on and see if you can get it to pop. Does it pop at all? >> >> >> >> These old diesels will run just about forever. I had an old Caterpillar D7 (1957 model year) that I bought from a farmer. The machine had sit in a field for about 10 years, never started. He said "It was running when I parked it!". I wanted it to clear some land, then resell. The pony engine had a stuck piston and also ended up having a stuck valve. I freed that stuff up and the darn pony fired up. Then I found two stuck injector pumps on the diesel. The old Cat has a mechanical cam mechanism that works all the injector pumps and two of the pump plungers were stuck up. Once I got those free and cleaned the fuel system, changed the fluids, this old machine sitting in a field for ten years rumbled to life. It was amazing. >> >> >> >> I talked to an old Caterpillar mechanic once who said that even when the old engine had lost most of its compression and was belching oil, if you could spin it long enough for the cylinders to get hot it would start and run. And having a pony engine you can spin the engine as long as needed to get them to fire. >> >> >> >> So, to condemn your old Yanmar I would think it would need to have lots wrong with it. Broken rings, bad piston or some major problem, but even then that stuff can be fixed. >> >> >> >> >> >> On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> Hello all, >> >> Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well as moral support. >> >> I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. >> >> I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been challenging me lately. >> >> I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with Joe Demers from Sound Marine Diesel; LLC >> >> SoundMarineDiesel.com (860) 666-2184 >> >> AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, CA. >> >> Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! >> >> >> >> I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. >> >> Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help diagnose? >> >> I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because it’s old. >> >> (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) >> >> “Well, it’s got No compression” >> >> “how do you know?” I asked. >> >> “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. >> >> I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it quit. Should or can we measure it?” >> >> >> >> Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. >> >> >> >> But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase cost and certainly not be a return. () >> >> I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into a $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what isn’t necessary >> >> >> >> Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish the fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” >> >> I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. >> >> I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can re-power for you” >> >> >> >> Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. >> >> I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh engine. >> >> : ) >> >> >> >> Thanks. >> >> .tom.. >> >> >> >> >> >> From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] >> Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM >> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >> Subject: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat >> >> >> >> >> >> Hi, all, >> >> I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the >> comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I >> posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try again. >> >> We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners >> to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the >> problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. >> Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known >> vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). >> There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, >> when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. >> Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of >> used boats. Now there is. >> >> So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing >> is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've >> acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an >> opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. >> It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is >> not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee >> weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, >> like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding >> collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart >> rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the >> warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends >> aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate >> efficiently in whatever conditions we face. >> >> When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has >> traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a >> tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, >> applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we >> generally admire. >> >> For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. >> We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the >> hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing >> a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, >> with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in >> short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could >> let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral >> deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other >> boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer >> 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of >> mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way >> that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, >> but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My >> little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, >> and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that >> already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. >> >> None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell >> either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse >> me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great >> privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to >> afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much >> to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my >> extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to >> have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good >> things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around >> now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." >> >> Chris Campbell >> > >> > >> >> >> >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> www.avast.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> www.avast.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> www.avast.com >> > >

With any repair you divide and conquer. Sounds like the engine was running fine, then wouldn't start. Could be anything really. Normally valves don't just stop working all of a sudden unless something major fails. Cam lobe gets wiped, push rod bends, valve sticks, stuff like that. These little diesels are pretty basic and durable. I go for the simple stuff first such as what it sounds like you are doing, fuel supply, intake air, exhaust not clogged. The engine has no glow plugs, starts from heat of compression. Intake valve lets in air then closes, injector squirts in atomized fuel, valves are both closed and there is combustion when the piston reaches near TDC. The exhaust valve opens and lets the combustion gases exit on the piston's next stroke. All that happens in the correct timing. You need fuel, air and compression. So, you go through all the stuff that makes that happen. Leslie On Wed, Apr 27, 2016 at 3:25 AM, Bob Guarino <hr… [at] yahoo.com> wrote: > Aloha, my name is Bobby an I have a cal-2 30 on the big island. I recently > went through hell with my Volvo MD7A getting her to run finally. Some tips > that may help, you may or may not know these. I did all the filters an fuel > cleaning etc an had to keep going. if you pull the injectors u can turn > them around and hook up an see if they are spraying before just sending > them out. I sent mine out an found out they were not the total issue. > Adjust or check your valve adjustment because one might be loose causing > loss of compression. Make sure you battery's are up when trying to start > it. Big difference on mine Turning over with full battery's vs not in how > long to heat up those cylinders. Compression gauges are not too expensive > an you can check that yourself if the mechanics don't want to for you. Make > sure you exhaust elbow isn't clogged where it leaves the head an joins with > the water. I got mine runing great now, but it was a little bit of > everything. I was waiting wating for some help and finally just went > through everything one at a time and found many little problems that all > added up. Best of luck to u! > Bobby G > Cal-2 30 > Kona, Hi > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Apr 26, 2016, at 3:26 PM, NEWMAN d2… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] < > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > > After your description then yes maybe a new injector. Injectors can also > be tested. But probably just as cost effective to just replace it. > > On Tuesday, April 26, 2016, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net [Cal_Boats] < > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > >> >> I would first replace the injector rather than go through all that. Since >> I have to remove it anyway..yes? >> >> A mechanic will charge as much as a new injector. >> >> >> >> *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] >> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 26, 2016 12:53 PM >> *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >> *Subject:* RE: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat >> >> >> >> >> >> I'd pull the injector and take it to a diesel mechanic. >> >> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android >> <https://overview.mail.yahoo.com/mobile/?.src=Android> >> >> >> >> >> >> Hello Newman! >> >> : ) >> >> >> >> Thanks all, especially Joe Demers. >> >> Here’s what I have done recently. >> >> I removed the intake side to look at that piece..is it flowing? The air >> ‘filter’ is a bit gunked up but it does flow and I can feel the intake on >> my hand. >> >> And to see the valve and watch it actuate to see if it’s actually >> moving…and so satisfy my mechanical curiosity. >> >> A follow up conversation with Joe D suggests almost categorically that it >> isn’t seating because on the compression stroke, I see a spray coming back >> into the intake side. >> >> >> >> Since you asked: Yanmar YSM8. Single cyl, 8 bhp, no –pre-ignitor. >> >> Fuel tank - Racor filter – Lift pump – engine filter – injector pump – >> Injector and a return line. >> >> 4 bleed points: Racor, engine filter, injector pump, injector. >> >> Yes, I did bleed the racor, the engine filter, the injector pump and the >> injector. >> >> It all squirts fuel. >> >> In doing so, the bleed port on the engine filter stripped so I replaced >> that entire assembly. >> >> >> >> I also bypassed it all and drew from a small quart bottle of fresh diesel >> straight into the injector pump. >> >> I am considering pulling the head and sending it out for a re-work. >> >> My day job keeps me off the dock all day and recently, it’s been crazy >> windy here in Monterey so I have not gone down to see her in the last few >> days. >> >> And I’m moving also so my time is stretched thin. >> >> I agree that it **SHOULD** go and I see areas that can be >> improved/repaired. I’m not giving up on the engine yet, much to the chagrin >> of the local ‘mechanics that want to re-power. >> >> Actually, my next step is to set the engine timing..position the flywheel >> to TDC and pull the head. >> >> Unless ‘you’ think otherwise. >> >> Thanks. >> >> >> >> ..tom >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] >> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 26, 2016 8:37 AM >> *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; TomDressler >> *Subject:* Re: [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat >> >> >> >> >> >> I am of the belief that old engines can be made to run just about forever >> if well maintained. >> >> As a hobby I restore old Caterpillar dozers. I currently own one 1949 and >> one 1955 D2 model machines. At one time I had four fully functional D2's, >> but thinned out the herd the past couple of years. They are old four >> cylinder slow turn diesels with two cylinder gas pony motor starters. These >> old machines start and run great after all these years. >> >> >> >> In repairing anything it is divide and conquer. Methodically go through >> all the systems, making sure things are correct. >> >> >> >> I am not totally familiar with your engine, so will just speak in general >> terms or about my Yanmar. >> >> >> >> We have a Yanmar 3GM30F in our 1986 Cal 33-2. The original engine and it >> runs fantastic. But I went through some heartache getting it to that point. >> But mine was all fuel issues. Final problem as a small crack in the fuel >> separator bowl allowing air to get into the fuel system. The engine would >> just quit at the worst possible times. In repairing this problem I also >> replaced all my rubber fuel line to and from the tank (in case it was >> collapsing internally), put a check valve at the fuel tank and bought a new >> fuel separator and fuel pump). I can cruise for hours no issues. But >> definitely I found a small crack in the separator bowl that was letting in >> air. I just wanted to kind of shotgun the fuel system since it was all >> original and showing its age. >> >> >> >> If your engine has not been torn apart, then hopefully all the timing is >> correct. So then you are dealing with air and fuel. The engine fires from >> heat of compression, so no spark to worry with. >> >> >> >> Eliminate things. Install a fuel line from the fuel pump directly into a >> container of diesel. Rule out the fuel separator and tank. I think you said >> you bypassed the fuel system. >> >> >> >> Bleed everything. On my engine there is a bleed on the final fuel filter >> and a bleed just before the injectors. I usually bleed at each injector as >> well until fuel is coming out the line leading to the injector. When >> bleeding have the compression lever flipped so no compression. Be aware not >> to let water get into your cylinder, so have the salt water inlet closed. >> Once you have fuel spitting out each injector line and you feel that all >> the air is out, tighten those lines and flip the compression back on and >> see if you can get it to pop. Does it pop at all? >> >> >> >> These old diesels will run just about forever. I had an old Caterpillar >> D7 (1957 model year) that I bought from a farmer. The machine had sit in a >> field for about 10 years, never started. He said "It was running when I >> parked it!". I wanted it to clear some land, then resell. The pony engine >> had a stuck piston and also ended up having a stuck valve. I freed that >> stuff up and the darn pony fired up. Then I found two stuck injector pumps >> on the diesel. The old Cat has a mechanical cam mechanism that works all >> the injector pumps and two of the pump plungers were stuck up. Once I got >> those free and cleaned the fuel system, changed the fluids, this old >> machine sitting in a field for ten years rumbled to life. It was amazing. >> >> >> >> I talked to an old Caterpillar mechanic once who said that even when the >> old engine had lost most of its compression and was belching oil, if you >> could spin it long enough for the cylinders to get hot it would start and >> run. And having a pony engine you can spin the engine as long as needed to >> get them to fire. >> >> >> >> So, to condemn your old Yanmar I would think it would need to have lots >> wrong with it. Broken rings, bad piston or some major problem, but even >> then that stuff can be fixed. >> >> >> >> >> >> On Fri, Apr 22, 2016 at 12:51 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] verizon.net >> [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> Hello all, >> >> Continuing this mindset..I’m asking the group for some physical as well >> as moral support. >> >> I have a Cal 2-25 with a Yanmar YSM8 single. I purchased it last October, >> knowing little about sailing except that I wanted to learn how. >> >> I named her Resa..Italian for surrender, and I have but she’s been >> challenging me lately. >> >> I’ve been working on the phone and e-mail with *Joe Demers from Sound >> Marine Diesel; LLC* >> >> >> >> SoundMarineDiesel.com <http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/> (860) 666-2184 >> >> >> >> AWESOME guy! The problem is that he’s in Connecticut and I’m in Monterey, >> CA. >> >> Jeez, I even weighed the cost of flying you out here Joe! >> >> >> >> I’ve replaced filters, bled the fuel system many times and tried other >> things. It seems like it should go unless..rings, valves or worse. >> >> Is there anyone on this list that lives in the Monterey area that is >> familiar with the engine could help me at least ‘look’ at it or help >> diagnose? >> >> I’ve been told by two ‘mechanics’, without a lot of them debugging except >> charging me to bleed the fuel lines, that I simply should repower, because >> it’s old. >> >> (one of them told me I need a new glow plug. All diesels have ‘em, he >> argued, after I said..this single does not. He said..yes it does) >> >> “Well, it’s got No compression” >> >> “how do you know?” I asked. >> >> “you can tell by the sound”, he replied. >> >> I followed with” But when I open the compression release and close it, >> that’s affecting compression. Sounds the same as it did last month when it >> quit. Should or can we measure it?” >> >> >> >> Fine, I’ll consider a repower if it’s proven to me that I need that. >> >> >> >> But it seems that the cost of that will equal/exceed the initial purchase >> cost and certainly not be a return. () >> >> I know, that should not be a factor, but I can’t see putting $5,000 into >> a $4500 boat. I'm not expecting a $-$ return, but I don’t want to do what >> isn’t necessary >> >> >> >> Helen, your guy, Kevin won’t come down until I “pay the yard to polish >> the fuel, remove and clean the fuel tank” >> >> I bypassed the fuel supply with a remote supply. >> >> I’m paying so-called mechanics to give me little feedback, except “we can >> re-power for you” >> >> >> >> Joe, I know you read this list. This is not about your INCREDIBLE support. >> >> I need someone local that has experience, before I “add to cart” a fresh >> engine. >> >> : ) >> >> >> >> Thanks. >> >> .tom.. >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] >> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 05, 2016 8:03 AM >> *To:* Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com >> *Subject:* [Cal_Boats] Owning and selling a boat >> >> >> >> >> >> Hi, all, >> >> I typed up this response to the thread on selling a 2-27, with all the >> comments about selling at a loss and poor market for used boats. I >> posted it but then it bounced back with an error message so I'll try >> again. >> >> We all need to take a deep breath and realize that if we're boat owners >> to make a profit, we're in the wrong line of work. First of all, the >> problem isn't so much that sailing is dying, but that the boats aren't. >> Fiberglass sailboats are pretty durable, despite the known >> vulnerabilities (core rot, blisters, stainless corrosion, old engines). >> There are lots of choices out there, more very year. Way back in 1968, >> when we acquired my other boat, there were very few choices locally. >> Fiberglass was still relatively new and there wasn't a huge inventory of >> used boats. Now there is. >> >> So why do we own these money sinks? Easy, it's to go sailing. Sailing >> is like drinking coffee or beer--it's an acquired taste. But once you've >> acquired the taste, it's like my morning cup--I need it. Sailing is an >> opportunity to develop and use skills. The learning can go on and on. >> It's a challenge, an opportunity to face and surmount dangers. Water is >> not our natural element, and we have an imperfect ability to foresee >> weather or what's under the water. Usually the risks are small ones, >> like getting off the mooring cleanly, getting the sails up and avoiding >> collisions with other boats. Sometimes the challenges raise the heart >> rate a lot more. Sometimes we get wet and cold. Then there are the >> warm sunny days with the wind just right, and a good set of friends >> aboard. And always there the simple challenge of making the boat operate >> efficiently in whatever conditions we face. >> >> When we go sailing, we join a very old human activity. Our species has >> traveled under wind power on the water for generations. We enlist in a >> tradition when we become sailors. It's a tradition of self-reliance, >> applied skills, adaptability, and a bit of courage. Those are things we >> generally admire. >> >> For me, it's important that my boats look like somebody gives a damn. >> We should give a damn about a craft that's going to take us into the >> hostile environment that the water is. When I was just starting sailing >> a local guy had a Mercer 44, a stunningly lovely boat from Bill Tripp, >> with a dark blue hull. He was not inclined toward maintenance so in >> short order the boat looked shabby. I figured that anybody who could >> let such a gorgeous boat look crummy must have some significant moral >> deficiency. My annual ritual of maintenance has started on the other >> boat, a 1961 Bill Tripp design that isn't as breathtaking as that Mercer >> 44, but still catches the eye. She's got spruce spars and lots of >> mahogany--toe rails, coamings, hatches--and it's all maintained in a way >> that says "somebody cares." At 55 years old, it takes a lot of work, >> but once she's launched the compliments begin. "Hey, pretty boat!" My >> little Cal 20 attracts compliments, too. She's polished up each year, >> and the mahogany rudder and tiller are varnished. I've started on that >> already. She's a happy boat that gets sailed a lot. >> >> None of that work would be reimbursed adequately if I were to sell >> either one. I have no illusions about that. But both boats reimburse >> me each summer in the joy of making the boat go. One of the great >> privileges of living in the USA in the 21st century is being able to >> afford simple luxuries like our boats. As a young person I found much >> to be unhappy about. As an old person I have come to appreciate my >> extraordinary fortune to have been born in this age and location and to >> have encountered people who helped me become a sailor (among other good >> things). In short, I have become my father and I wish he were around >> now so I could say "Hey, Dad, you were right. Let's go sailing." >> >> Chris Campbell >> > >> > >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> www.avast.com >> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> >> >> >> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> >> >> >> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> [image: Avast logo] >> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> >> >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> www.avast.com >> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> [image: Avast logo] >> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> >> >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> www.avast.com >> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> >> >> > >