Cal 27 pop-top fastenings / seals

Hi, I've got a '73 Cal 27 pop-top which the previous owner converted to have the top permanently popped-up. The pop-top is supported by a wooden frame with thin plastic windows all the way around, removable with screens on the sides. He did a nice job, but it does interfere with forward visibility and access a bit, and isn't especially rugged or seaworthy, I'd like to return it to its original operation/condition. I've got all the snap-in canvas pop-top sides, the pop-top "legs" and brackets are still attached, and the top is still fixed to the slot in the mast. I have a couple of questions that hopefully someone here will be able to answer... 1) How was the top originally held down? There are some brackets on the inner edge of the deck opening that look like they would have been for securing the top in the lowered position, but I can't find any clues as to how they worked. I can't imagine relying just on the top's own weight to hold it in place. 2) Was there any sort of gasket to seal or cushion the top when closed? 3) For the canvas sides, I see snaps at the bottom, but I'm not sure how they would have been attached at the top. 4) Were the canvas sides usually left in place when the top was lowered, or removed? If anyone has, or can point me to, pictures of any of this, I'd greatly appreciate it! Thanks, Doug Fitz-Randolph Freeport, ME

hi. my name is vince. i have a 71 pop top. funny thing is, i am getting ready to build a permanent doghouse to replace my pop top. of course, i am going to use fiberglass and do it right. if the PO of yours didn't design a proper doghouse and make it structurally sound, i can't blame you for wanting to return it to it's original condition. just building sides to hold up the original top is not really a good permanent fix. to answer as many of your questions as i can: there are latches around the rim of the pop top. a bit like super heavy tool box type latches in design. there should be a 'hook' on the top at each of the 5 points and then the part on the boat has a lever and a loop. i believe the type of latch is pretty common on cockpit lockers. with age, the tightness of the top when down can begin to suffer. there is no seal. as far as a seaworthiness issue, the pop top design is not a water tight design. the PO of mine apparently tried weather stripping to get a better seal to keep out cold air during winter months. and, they do leak cold air during the winter months. i seal mine with duct tape during the winter to hold heat in. as far as i know, you take the canvass skirting down when you close the pop top. even if it could close with it on, i think the material would be in the way when moving forward on deck as it wold have to be on the outside (not hanging into the boat) to allow the top to latch down properly...at least that's the way mine looks to be made. i don't have the canvass skirting. there are not a lot of online resources for this particular boat. i would be glad to take some pics of mine to show you the latches. if you have all of the original pop top hardware, you are lucky. personally, i think the pop top was a bad idea and mr lapworth should have done a doghouse, like he did with the t2 variant that came out after the original cal 27s were already in production. but, if you don't plan to live aboard or do extensive cruising, i guess it's not quite as big of a pain. design-wise, it's the only element of the boat i don't like. although, i am going to have opening ports around my doghouse to maintain the visibility and ventilation given by the pop top. so, i guess it was a good inspirational element fo me. if there is anything specific i didn't answer or that you'd like to know, feel free to ask.not a lot of us that own these, from what i have seen. we need to stick together :) ---In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, <doug.fitzrandolph@...> wrote : Hi, I've got a '73 Cal 27 pop-top which the previous owner converted to have the top permanently popped-up. The pop-top is supported by a wooden frame with thin plastic windows all the way around, removable with screens on the sides. He did a nice job, but it does interfere with forward visibility and access a bit, and isn't especially rugged or seaworthy, I'd like to return it to its original operation/condition. I've got all the snap-in canvas pop-top sides, the pop-top "legs" and brackets are still attached, and the top is still fixed to the slot in the mast. I have a couple of questions that hopefully someone here will be able to answer... 1) How was the top originally held down? There are some brackets on the inner edge of the deck opening that look like they would have been for securing the top in the lowered position, but I can't find any clues as to how they worked. I can't imagine relying just on the top's own weight to hold it in place. 2) Was there any sort of gasket to seal or cushion the top when closed? 3) For the canvas sides, I see snaps at the bottom, but I'm not sure how they would have been attached at the top. 4) Were the canvas sides usually left in place when the top was lowered, or removed? If anyone has, or can point me to, pictures of any of this, I'd greatly appreciate it! Thanks, Doug Fitz-Randolph Freeport, ME

Just get a T/2. It is the pop-top with a glassed in pop-top and better headroom in the v'berth. Reggie Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook> From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> on behalf of mo… [at] aol.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 3:22 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Re: Cal 27 pop-top fastenings / seals hi. my name is vince. i have a 71 pop top. funny thing is, i am getting ready to build a permanent doghouse to replace my pop top. of course, i am going to use fiberglass and do it right. if the PO of yours didn't design a proper doghouse and make it structurally sound, i can't blame you for wanting to return it to it's original condition. just building sides to hold up the original top is not really a good permanent fix. to answer as many of your questions as i can: there are latches around the rim of the pop top. a bit like super heavy tool box type latches in design. there should be a 'hook' on the top at each of the 5 points and then the part on the boat has a lever and a loop. i believe the type of latch is pretty common on cockpit lockers. with age, the tightness of the top when down can begin to suffer. there is no seal. as far as a seaworthiness issue, the pop top design is not a water tight design. the PO of mine apparently tried weather stripping to get a better seal to keep out cold air during winter months. and, they do leak cold air during the winter months. i seal mine with duct tape during the winter to hold heat in. as far as i know, you take the canvass skirting down when you close the pop top. even if it could close with it on, i think the material would be in the way when moving forward on deck as it wold have to be on the outside (not hanging into the boat) to allow the top to latch down properly...at least that's the way mine looks to be made. i don't have the canvass skirting. there are not a lot of online resources for this particular boat. i would be glad to take some pics of mine to show you the latches. if you have all of the original pop top hardware, you are lucky. personally, i think the pop top was a bad idea and mr lapworth should have done a doghouse, like he did with the t2 variant that came out after the original cal 27s were already in production. but, if you don't plan to live aboard or do extensive cruising, i guess it's not quite as big of a pain. design-wise, it's the only element of the boat i don't like. although, i am going to have opening ports around my doghouse to maintain the visibility and ventilation given by the pop top. so, i guess it was a good inspirational element fo me. if there is anything specific i didn't answer or that you'd like to know, feel free to ask.not a lot of us that own these, from what i have seen. we need to stick together :) ---In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, <doug.fitzrandolph@...> wrote : Hi, I've got a '73 Cal 27 pop-top which the previous owner converted to have the top permanently popped-up. The pop-top is supported by a wooden frame with thin plastic windows all the way around, removable with screens on the sides. He did a nice job, but it does interfere with forward visibility and access a bit, and isn't especially rugged or seaworthy, I'd like to return it to its original operation/condition. I've got all the snap-in canvas pop-top sides, the pop-top "legs" and brackets are still attached, and the top is still fixed to the slot in the mast. I have a couple of questions that hopefully someone here will be able to answer... 1) How was the top originally held down? There are some brackets on the inner edge of the deck opening that look like they would have been for securing the top in the lowered position, but I can't find any clues as to how they worked. I can't imagine relying just on the top's own weight to hold it in place. 2) Was there any sort of gasket to seal or cushion the top when closed? 3) For the canvas sides, I see snaps at the bottom, but I'm not sure how they would have been attached at the top. 4) Were the canvas sides usually left in place when the top was lowered, or removed? If anyone has, or can point me to, pictures of any of this, I'd greatly appreciate it! Thanks, Doug Fitz-Randolph Freeport, ME

sure. if i had the extra cash, i would have. that's like saying, instead of hopping up your chevy, why not just buy a porche. great if you have the money. i bought my cal 27 for 300 bucks off of the lean dock and have slowly been scraping together cash and fixing it up myself; not because i needed another project but, because that's the way i could afford a keelboat. i'd love to have a few Gs in my pocket so i could go but a t2, or a cal 28, or...since i am talking pretend....a falmouth 34. but, that's not my situation. so, i take what i can get and do my best to make it what i want. kind of like we say in the motorcycle world: chop what ya got. ...now, if i could find someone with a beat t2 that they were scrapping out and i could get the doghouse for a little bit of change....well, that would save me a bit of work. lol ---In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, <my1972ih@...> wrote : Just get a T/2. It is the pop-top with a glassed in pop-top and better headroom in the v'berth. Reggie Sent from Outlook http://aka.ms/weboutlook From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> on behalf of motorcyclejack2@... [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2016 3:22 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] Re: Cal 27 pop-top fastenings / seals hi. my name is vince. i have a 71 pop top. funny thing is, i am getting ready to build a permanent doghouse to replace my pop top. of course, i am going to use fiberglass and do it right. if the PO of yours didn't design a proper doghouse and make it structurally sound, i can't blame you for wanting to return it to it's original condition. just building sides to hold up the original top is not really a good permanent fix. to answer as many of your questions as i can: there are latches around the rim of the pop top. a bit like super heavy tool box type latches in design. there should be a 'hook' on the top at each of the 5 points and then the part on the boat has a lever and a loop. i believe the type of latch is pretty common on cockpit lockers. with age, the tightness of the top when down can begin to suffer. there is no seal. as far as a seaworthiness issue, the pop top design is not a water tight design. the PO of mine apparently tried weather stripping to get a better seal to keep out cold air during winter months. and, they do leak cold air during the winter months. i seal mine with duct tape during the winter to hold heat in. as far as i know, you take the canvass skirting down when you close the pop top. even if it could close with it on, i think the material would be in the way when moving forward on deck as it wold have to be on the outside (not hanging into the boat) to allow the top to latch down properly...at least that's the way mine looks to be made. i don't have the canvass skirting. there are not a lot of online resources for this particular boat. i would be glad to take some pics of mine to show you the latches. if you have all of the original pop top hardware, you are lucky. personally, i think the pop top was a bad idea and mr lapworth should have done a doghouse, like he did with the t2 variant that came out after the original cal 27s were already in production. but, if you don't plan to live aboard or do extensive cruising, i guess it's not quite as big of a pain. design-wise, it's the only element of the boat i don't like. although, i am going to have opening ports around my doghouse to maintain the visibility and ventilation given by the pop top. so, i guess it was a good inspirational element fo me. if there is anything specific i didn't answer or that you'd like to know, feel free to ask.not a lot of us that own these, from what i have seen. we need to stick together :) ---In Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, <doug.fitzrandolph@...> wrote : Hi, I've got a '73 Cal 27 pop-top which the previous owner converted to have the top permanently popped-up. The pop-top is supported by a wooden frame with thin plastic windows all the way around, removable with screens on the sides. He did a nice job, but it does interfere with forward visibility and access a bit, and isn't especially rugged or seaworthy, I'd like to return it to its original operation/condition. I've got all the snap-in canvas pop-top sides, the pop-top "legs" and brackets are still attached, and the top is still fixed to the slot in the mast. I have a couple of questions that hopefully someone here will be able to answer... 1) How was the top originally held down? There are some brackets on the inner edge of the deck opening that look like they would have been for securing the top in the lowered position, but I can't find any clues as to how they worked. I can't imagine relying just on the top's own weight to hold it in place. 2) Was there any sort of gasket to seal or cushion the top when closed? 3) For the canvas sides, I see snaps at the bottom, but I'm not sure how they would have been attached at the top. 4) Were the canvas sides usually left in place when the top was lowered, or removed? If anyone has, or can point me to, pictures of any of this, I'd greatly appreciate it! Thanks, Doug Fitz-Randolph Freeport, ME