Removing items bedded with 5200

I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I secured a dryer vent I thought I’d never remove to the side of the house with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade is ideally shaped for the job. I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would work well for removing ports or hatches. YMMV Al Sent from Mail for Windows 10

Al, thanks for info.Here is my question: Is there any way to re-attach Fiberglas bulkhead tabbing to a fiberglass hull short of removing all the glass tabbing and redoing it from scratch? The old tabbing is intact.Some ideas I've had are:1] Cleaning the surface with acetone and reattaching using urethane mastic and super glue along the edges, or west systems and superglue and tape to hold the tabbing in place until the urethane or epoxy sets up.2] Is urethane mastic preferable to, say, Silicone II? Either mastic/sealant seem extremely tenacious and would be shock and vibration resistant. One member discourage using silicone since it leaves a hard to remove residue which would impede future attachment. Wouldn't acetone remove that residue? 3] What about using 3M 4200 or 5200 instead of something like Sikaflex? The stuff I've used is a roofing to flashing glue/sealant. Jerry On Sunday, March 5, 2017 7:53 PM, "aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I secured a dryer vent I thought I’d never remove to the side of the house with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade is ideally shaped for the job. I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would work well for removing ports or hatches. YMMV Al Sent from Mail for Windows 10 -- {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} {margin-bottom:10px;} .yiv5138099041ad {padding:0 0;} .yiv5138099041ad p {margin:0;} .yiv5138099041ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} {font-family:Arial;} {margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} .yiv5138099041ad {margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 0;} {font-family:Verdana;font-size:11px;padding:10px 0;} {background-color:#e0ecee;float:left;font-family:Verdana;font-size:10px;padding:10px;} span {font-weight:700;} span:first-child {text-transform:uppercase;} span a {color:#5085b6;text-decoration:none;} span span {color:#ff7900;} span .yiv5138099041underline {text-decoration:underline;} .yiv5138099041attach {clear:both;display:table;font-family:Arial;font-size:12px;padding:10px 0;width:400px;} .yiv5138099041attach div a {text-decoration:none;} .yiv5138099041attach img {border:none;padding-right:5px;} .yiv5138099041attach label {display:block;margin-bottom:5px;} .yiv5138099041attach label a {text-decoration:none;} blockquote {margin:0 0 0 4px;} .yiv5138099041bold {font-family:Arial;font-size:13px;font-weight:700;} .yiv5138099041bold a {text-decoration:none;} dd.yiv5138099041last p a {font-family:Verdana;font-weight:700;} dd.yiv5138099041last p span {margin-right:10px;font-family:Verdana;font-weight:700;} dd.yiv5138099041last p span.yiv5138099041yshortcuts {margin-right:0;} div.yiv5138099041attach-table div div a {text-decoration:none;} div.yiv5138099041attach-table {width:400px;} div.yiv5138099041file-title a, div.yiv5138099041file-title a:active, div.yiv5138099041file-title a:hover, div.yiv5138099041file-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;} div.yiv5138099041photo-title a, div.yiv5138099041photo-title a:active, div.yiv5138099041photo-title a:hover, div.yiv5138099041photo-title a:visited {text-decoration:none;} div p a span.yiv5138099041yshortcuts {font-family:Verdana;font-size:10px;font-weight:normal;} .yiv5138099041green {color:#628c2a;} .yiv5138099041MsoNormal {margin:0 0 0 0;} o {font-size:0;} div {float:left;width:72px;} div div {border:1px solid #666666;height:62px;overflow:hidden;width:62px;} div label {color:#666666;font-size:10px;overflow:hidden;text-align:center;white-space:nowrap;width:64px;} {font-size:77%;} {font-size:77%;} .yiv5138099041replbq {margin:4px;} div a:first-child {margin-right:2px;padding-right:5px;} {font-size:13px;font-family:Arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} table {font-size:inherit;font:100%;} select, input, textarea {font:99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} pre, code {font:115% monospace;} * {line-height:1.22em;} {padding-bottom:10px;} p a {font-family:Verdana;} p span {color:#1E66AE;font-weight:700;} {color:#ff7900;font-weight:700;} {margin-bottom:20px;padding:0px;} li a {font-size:130%;text-decoration:none;} li {font-size:77%;list-style-type:square;padding:6px 0;} ul {margin:0;padding:0 0 0 8px;} {font-family:Georgia;} p {margin:0 0 1em 0;} tt {font-size:120%;} ul li:last-child {border-right:none !important;}

On 3/6/2017 2:36 AM, Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] wrote: > > > Al, thanks for info. > Here is my question: Is there any way to re-attach Fiberglas bulkhead > tabbing to a fiberglass hull short of removing all the glass tabbing > and redoing it from scratch? The old tabbing is intact. My thinking is that for something structural, it's usually best to do it right--maybe even better than original. Seems to me the best practice is a large-radius tabbing, secured with epoxy. The large radius leaves some room for flex (as opposed to a tabbing that's poked down into the corner in a right angle). That avoids a hard spot. If the tabbing is loose, it means there's stress there. The hull flexes or the rigging pulls on it or something. Might as well do a good job and have a strong boat. My other boat has a bulkhead under the mast step (deck stepped mast) with the shrouds connected to chainplates secured to the bulkhead--a fairly common arrangement. The tabbing looks flimsy and completely inadequate. I'll look at it and think that I should re-do it. But then I stop and think that it has survived for 56 years of sailing, so maybe it's good enough. If it had broken loose, I would KNOW that it's NOT good enough. Chris Campbell

Jerry, Years ago I basically rebuilt the inside of a Cal-25 that had curious damage. The original owner ran into some power lines and LARGE currents (to the point that the headstay was cut as if a torch had been used) ran through the rig and out the port cockpit drain through hull at the companionway. The dinette, galley, and quarterberths were popped loose from the hull. Huge currents in a wire make the wire want to form a circle. My theory is that the currents flowing through the rigging torqued the hull and cracked the keel-hull fillet in addition to breaking the furniture loose. I was able to pull the tabbing tape off of the hull but it was well adhered to the bulkheads. I sanded the area and then laid in glass mat followed by tape with polyester resin. I didn’t do anything to hold it in place. I guess you could tack glass down with dots of superglue and then come in with resin as long as you were able to get it all saturated well. In my case there was an air gap between the bulkheads and the hull that I attributed to poor construction. I later read that that was done to avoid a hard point. If I had to do it over again I would lay down progressively narrower strips of glass along the bulkhead line and then bond the bulkhead to that. Stair-stepping the thickness of the glass under the bulkhead should avoid the potential for a hard point at the bulkheads. I wouldn’t use silicone. It is my understanding that nothing will remove the silicone adequately for anything to bond to an area where silicone was used. My processes are based on a limited knowledge of the current adhesive technology, however. If bond strength and resistance to shear are equivalent, a more modern adhesive might be appropriate. Al Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 2:44 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; aw… [at] bellsouth.net Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Removing items bedded with 5200 Al, thanks for info. Here is my question: Is there any way to re-attach Fiberglas bulkhead tabbing to a fiberglass hull short of removing all the glass tabbing and redoing it from scratch? The old tabbing is intact. Some ideas I've had are: 1] Cleaning the surface with acetone and reattaching using urethane mastic and super glue along the edges, or west systems and superglue and tape to hold the tabbing in place until the urethane or epoxy sets up. 2] Is urethane mastic preferable to, say, Silicone II? Either mastic/sealant seem extremely tenacious and would be shock and vibration resistant. One member discourage using silicone since it leaves a hard to remove residue which would impede future attachment. Wouldn't acetone remove that residue? 3] What about using 3M 4200 or 5200 instead of something like Sikaflex? The stuff I've used is a roofing to flashing glue/sealant. Jerry On Sunday, March 5, 2017 7:53 PM, "aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I secured a dryer vent I thought I’d never remove to the side of the house with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade is ideally shaped for the job. I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would work well for removing ports or hatches. YMMV Al Sent from Mail for Windows 10

Jerry, Trying to clean and prep for some super adhesive to avoid the rest of the process doesn’t make any sense to me, and I’ve done a lot of similar (short cut) things in my life and regretted it every time. You’ll end up doing just as much work and you will make a mess and risk annoying failure and end up having to do it right somewhere down the road and have yet another mess to clean up. In the most loving and friendly way I can state it — Suck it up and do it right, Jerry. It won’t cost you any more in the end and it will save you nightmares of problems. Just pull up the torn or loose tabbing with a putty knife and sand it down until you hit clean glass/wood/hull and lay some cloth tapes. You can overlap 4” tape in the center for a minimal sized tab, or better would be to overlap 6” tapes in the center. That way you have a graduated tab. On a boat your size, that should be adequate. USE EPOXY. If you sand and clean with acetone first the epoxy will absolutely stick and you will be done. West System is not the only epoxy brand — you can order epoxy online for cheap. The West System manuals show the prep process. Use thickened West in place of matt if your surface isn’t smooth. Avoid hard spots as Al suggests. Do the tabbing in sections to avoid repositioning everything. Good luck. Do it! Wilkie > On Mar 6, 2017, at 7:38 AM, aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > [Attachment(s) <x-msg://4/#TopText> from aw… [at] bellsouth.net <mailto:aw… [at] bellsouth.net> included below] > > Jerry, > > Years ago I basically rebuilt the inside of a Cal-25 that had curious damage. The original owner ran into some power lines and LARGE currents (to the point that the headstay was cut as if a torch had been used) ran through the rig and out the port cockpit drain through hull at the companionway. The dinette, galley, and quarterberths were popped loose from the hull. Huge currents in a wire make the wire want to form a circle. My theory is that the currents flowing through the rigging torqued the hull and cracked the keel-hull fillet in addition to breaking the furniture loose. > > I was able to pull the tabbing tape off of the hull but it was well adhered to the bulkheads. I sanded the area and then laid in glass mat followed by tape with polyester resin. I didn’t do anything to hold it in place. > > I guess you could tack glass down with dots of superglue and then come in with resin as long as you were able to get it all saturated well. In my case there was an air gap between the bulkheads and the hull that I attributed to poor construction. I later read that that was done to avoid a hard point. If I had to do it over again I would lay down progressively narrower strips of glass along the bulkhead line and then bond the bulkhead to that. Stair-stepping the thickness of the glass under the bulkhead should avoid the potential for a hard point at the bulkheads. > > I wouldn’t use silicone. It is my understanding that nothing will remove the silicone adequately for anything to bond to an area where silicone was used. > > My processes are based on a limited knowledge of the current adhesive technology, however. If bond strength and resistance to shear are equivalent, a more modern adhesive might be appropriate. > > Al > > > Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10 > > From: Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 2:44 AM > To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>; aw… [at] bellsouth.net <mailto:aw… [at] bellsouth.net> > Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Removing items bedded with 5200 > > Al, thanks for info. > Here is my question: Is there any way to re-attach Fiberglas bulkhead tabbing to a fiberglass hull short of removing all the glass tabbing and redoing it from scratch? The old tabbing is intact. > Some ideas I've had are: > 1] Cleaning the surface with acetone and reattaching using urethane mastic and super glue along the edges, or west systems and superglue and tape to hold the tabbing in place until the urethane or epoxy sets up. > 2] Is urethane mastic preferable to, say, Silicone II? Either mastic/sealant seem extremely tenacious and would be shock and vibration resistant. One member discourage using silicone since it leaves a hard to remove residue which would impede future attachment. Wouldn't acetone remove that residue? > 3] What about using 3M 4200 or 5200 instead of something like Sikaflex? The stuff I've used is a roofing to flashing glue/sealant. > Jerry > > > On Sunday, March 5, 2017 7:53 PM, "aw… [at] bellsouth.net <mailto:aw… [at] bellsouth.net> [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > > > I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I secured a dryer vent I thought I’d never remove to the side of the house with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade is ideally shaped for the job. > > I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would work well for removing ports or hatches. > > YMMV > > Al > > > Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10 > > > > > > >

Pardon my ignorance but what, exactly, is a vibrating multi-tool? I've got some cracked and crazed ports on my Cal 2 34 that I cannot seem to pry out of the window casing with any tool. Taking the whole assembly off the cabin is easy, getting the plexi to separate from the "frame" is impossible. Thanks, Faith S/V Sea Jewel On 2017-03-05 19:53, aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats] wrote: > I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I secured a dryer vent I thought I'd never remove to the side of the house with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade is ideally shaped for the job. > > I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would work well for removing ports or hatches. > > YMMV > > Al > > Sent from Mail [1] for Windows 10 > > Links: ------ [1] https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986 [2] https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Cal_Boats/conversations/messages/42591;_ylc=X3oDMTJyZ3RnY3NmBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NDg1Njk1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA2NTc5MgRtc2dJZAM0MjU5MQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzE0ODg3NzIzOTU-?act=reply&amp;messageNum=42591 [3] https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Cal_Boats/conversations/newtopic;_ylc=X3oDMTJmMmNhbGNoBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NDg1Njk1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA2NTc5MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNudHBjBHN0aW1lAzE0ODg3NzIzOTU- [4] https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Cal_Boats/conversations/topics/42591;_ylc=X3oDMTM3aHJraTE2BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NDg1Njk1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA2NTc5MgRtc2dJZAM0MjU5MQRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzE0ODg3NzIzOTUEdHBjSWQDNDI1OTE- [5] https://yho.com/1wwmgg [6] https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Cal_Boats/info;_ylc=X3oDMTJmajIzNmE5BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzE2NDg1Njk1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA2NTc5MgRzZWMDdnRsBHNsawN2Z2hwBHN0aW1lAzE0ODg3NzIzOTU- [7] https://groups.yahoo.com/neo;_ylc=X3oDMTJlb2txYmpkBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzE2NDg1Njk1BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTA2NTc5MgRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNnZnAEc3RpbWUDMTQ4ODc3MjM5NQ-- [8] https://info.yahoo.com/privacy/us/yahoo/groups/details.html [9] https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/

Well, I got the name close…. Here is what I used: http://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result?q=oscillating+multi+tool Al Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: fs… [at] torchlake.com Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 11:51 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; aw… [at] bellsouth.net Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Removing items bedded with 5200 Pardon my ignorance but what, exactly, is a vibrating multi-tool? I've got some cracked and crazed ports on my Cal 2 34 that I cannot seem to pry out of the window casing with any tool. Taking the whole assembly off the cabin is easy, getting the plexi to separate from the "frame" is impossible. Thanks, Faith S/V Sea Jewel On 2017-03-05 19:53, aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats] wrote: I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I secured a dryer vent I thought I'd never remove to the side of the house with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade is ideally shaped for the job. I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would work well for removing ports or hatches. YMMV Al Sent from Mail for Windows 10

I love the tool, but the blade costs has been just horrible. And I don't get a lot of life from the wood cutting blades. I do see that Harbor Freight blade costs are about a third of say Home Depot. But what I find with most Harbor Freight anything (except maybe chip brushes) is their stuff is really poorly made crap. I have the DeWalt tool and love it, but again, blades are its Achilles heel. I've used the tool to run down the side of a screened porch, cutting the decking boards so we could replace the exposed wood with that composite decking. Allowed me to make a nice clean cut along where the porch met the deck. Saws all could do the same job, but not as clean. But I suspect a single saws all blade would have done the job that it took three of the mutlitool blades to do. The tile blades lasted much better. I used the tool to get up a bathroom tile floor and it was the ticket. Especially running down the grout joints where I needed to preserve some tiles. http://www.dewalt.com/products/power-tools/oscillating-tools/oscillating-multitool-kit/dwe315k On Mon, Mar 6, 2017 at 10:38 AM, aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats] < Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > [Attachment(s) <#m_-4089131688988557261_TopText> from > aw… [at] bellsouth.net included below] > > Jerry, > > > > Years ago I basically rebuilt the inside of a Cal-25 that had curious > damage. The original owner ran into some power lines and LARGE currents (to > the point that the headstay was cut as if a torch had been used) ran > through the rig and out the port cockpit drain through hull at the > companionway. The dinette, galley, and quarterberths were popped loose > from the hull. Huge currents in a wire make the wire want to form a > circle. My theory is that the currents flowing through the rigging torqued > the hull and cracked the keel-hull fillet in addition to breaking the > furniture loose. > > > > I was able to pull the tabbing tape off of the hull but it was well > adhered to the bulkheads. I sanded the area and then laid in glass mat > followed by tape with polyester resin. I didn’t do anything to hold it in > place. > > > > I guess you could tack glass down with dots of superglue and then come in > with resin as long as you were able to get it all saturated well. In my > case there was an air gap between the bulkheads and the hull that I > attributed to poor construction. I later read that that was done to avoid > a hard point. If I had to do it over again I would lay down progressively > narrower strips of glass along the bulkhead line and then bond the bulkhead > to that. Stair-stepping the thickness of the glass under the bulkhead > should avoid the potential for a hard point at the bulkheads. > > > > I wouldn’t use silicone. It is my understanding that nothing will remove > the silicone adequately for anything to bond to an area where silicone was > used. > > > > My processes are based on a limited knowledge of the current adhesive > technology, however. If bond strength and resistance to shear are > equivalent, a more modern adhesive might be appropriate. > > > > Al > > > > > > Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for > Windows 10 > > > > *From: *Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] > <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > *Sent: *Monday, March 6, 2017 2:44 AM > *To: *Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; aw… [at] bellsouth.net > *Subject: *Re: [Cal_Boats] Removing items bedded with 5200 > > > > > > Al, thanks for info. > > Here is my question: Is there any way to re-attach Fiberglas bulkhead > tabbing to a fiberglass hull short of removing all the glass tabbing and > redoing it from scratch? The old tabbing is intact. > > Some ideas I've had are: > > 1] Cleaning the surface with acetone and reattaching using urethane mastic > and super glue along the edges, or west systems and superglue and tape to > hold the tabbing in place until the urethane or epoxy sets up. > > 2] Is urethane mastic preferable to, say, Silicone II? Either > mastic/sealant seem extremely tenacious and would be shock and vibration > resistant. One member discourage using silicone since it leaves a hard to > remove residue which would impede future attachment. Wouldn't acetone > remove that residue? > > 3] What about using 3M 4200 or 5200 instead of something like Sikaflex? > The stuff I've used is a roofing to flashing glue/sealant. > > Jerry > > > > On Sunday, March 5, 2017 7:53 PM, "aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats]" < > Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > > > > I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I > secured a dryer vent I thought I’d never remove to the side of the house > with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried > driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow > going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the > wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade > is ideally shaped for the job. > > > > I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency > to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that > surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would > work well for removing ports or hatches. > > > > YMMV > > > > Al > > > > > > Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for > Windows 10 > > > > > > > > >

On 3/6/2017 12:03 PM, aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats] wrote: > [Attachment(s) <#TopText> from aw… [at] bellsouth.net included below] > > Well, I got the name close…. > I call it a "cast cutter." Back in the days of plaster casts for broken bones, doctors used oscillating saws to remove them. The saw would cut rigid plaster, but would not hurt skin if contact was made--the skin and flesh would move back & forth with the blade. My oscillating saw is, in fact, a cast cutter. The blades will fit it and it was free. I've actually got two--an old one from my Dad and a newer one from my brother-in-law. Chris Campbell > >

You need to look at multifitblades. They have nice parts for that tool > On Mar 6, 2017, at 11:18 AM, NEWMAN d2… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > I love the tool, but the blade costs has been just horrible. And I don't get a lot of life from the wood cutting blades. I do see that Harbor Freight blade costs are about a third of say Home Depot. But what I find with most Harbor Freight anything (except maybe chip brushes) is their stuff is really poorly made crap. I have the DeWalt tool and love it, but again, blades are its Achilles heel. > I've used the tool to run down the side of a screened porch, cutting the decking boards so we could replace the exposed wood with that composite decking. Allowed me to make a nice clean cut along where the porch met the deck. Saws all could do the same job, but not as clean. But I suspect a single saws all blade would have done the job that it took three of the mutlitool blades to do. The tile blades lasted much better. I used the tool to get up a bathroom tile floor and it was the ticket. Especially running down the grout joints where I needed to preserve some tiles. > > http://www.dewalt.com/products/power-tools/oscillating-tools/oscillating-multitool-kit/dwe315k > > > > >> On Mon, Mar 6, 2017 at 10:38 AM, aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >> >> [Attachment(s) from aw… [at] bellsouth.net included below] >> Jerry, >> >> >> >> Years ago I basically rebuilt the inside of a Cal-25 that had curious damage. The original owner ran into some power lines and LARGE currents (to the point that the headstay was cut as if a torch had been used) ran through the rig and out the port cockpit drain through hull at the companionway. The dinette, galley, and quarterberths were popped loose from the hull. Huge currents in a wire make the wire want to form a circle. My theory is that the currents flowing through the rigging torqued the hull and cracked the keel-hull fillet in addition to breaking the furniture loose. >> >> >> >> I was able to pull the tabbing tape off of the hull but it was well adhered to the bulkheads. I sanded the area and then laid in glass mat followed by tape with polyester resin. I didn’t do anything to hold it in place. >> >> >> >> I guess you could tack glass down with dots of superglue and then come in with resin as long as you were able to get it all saturated well. In my case there was an air gap between the bulkheads and the hull that I attributed to poor construction. I later read that that was done to avoid a hard point. If I had to do it over again I would lay down progressively narrower strips of glass along the bulkhead line and then bond the bulkhead to that. Stair-stepping the thickness of the glass under the bulkhead should avoid the potential for a hard point at the bulkheads. >> >> >> >> I wouldn’t use silicone. It is my understanding that nothing will remove the silicone adequately for anything to bond to an area where silicone was used. >> >> >> >> My processes are based on a limited knowledge of the current adhesive technology, however. If bond strength and resistance to shear are equivalent, a more modern adhesive might be appropriate. >> >> >> >> Al >> >> >> >> >> >> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >> >> >> >> From: Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] >> Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 2:44 AM >> To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; aw… [at] bellsouth.net >> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Removing items bedded with 5200 >> >> >> >> >> >> Al, thanks for info. >> >> Here is my question: Is there any way to re-attach Fiberglas bulkhead tabbing to a fiberglass hull short of removing all the glass tabbing and redoing it from scratch? The old tabbing is intact. >> >> Some ideas I've had are: >> >> 1] Cleaning the surface with acetone and reattaching using urethane mastic and super glue along the edges, or west systems and superglue and tape to hold the tabbing in place until the urethane or epoxy sets up. >> >> 2] Is urethane mastic preferable to, say, Silicone II? Either mastic/sealant seem extremely tenacious and would be shock and vibration resistant. One member discourage using silicone since it leaves a hard to remove residue which would impede future attachment. Wouldn't acetone remove that residue? >> >> 3] What about using 3M 4200 or 5200 instead of something like Sikaflex? The stuff I've used is a roofing to flashing glue/sealant. >> >> Jerry >> >> >> >> On Sunday, March 5, 2017 7:53 PM, "aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I secured a dryer vent I thought I’d never remove to the side of the house with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade is ideally shaped for the job. >> >> >> >> I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would work well for removing ports or hatches. >> >> >> >> YMMV >> >> >> >> Al >> >> >> >> >> >> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >

If you go to Home Depot (or other hardware with a good stock of power tools and accessories) they have carbide blades that are supposed to last many times longer than the steel ones. There are also blades designed to cut thru concrete...carbide or industrial diamond. I bought one but haven't used it yet. I guess you have to be careful not to cut thru the hull accidentally, or your fingers. But if you do, you can always replace them with hooks, like a certain captain by the same name.Jerry of Shpritz On Monday, March 6, 2017 2:23 PM, "NEWMAN d2… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I love the tool, but the blade costs has been just horrible. And I don't get a lot of life from the wood cutting blades. I do see that Harbor Freight blade costs are about a third of say Home Depot. But what I find with most Harbor Freight anything (except maybe chip brushes) is their stuff is really poorly made crap. I have the DeWalt tool and love it, but again, blades are its Achilles heel.I've used the tool to run down the side of a screened porch, cutting the decking boards so we could replace the exposed wood with that composite decking. Allowed me to make a nice clean cut along where the porch met the deck. Saws all could do the same job, but not as clean. But I suspect a single saws all blade would have done the job that it took three of the mutlitool blades to do. The tile blades lasted much better. I used the tool to get up a bathroom tile floor and it was the ticket. Especially running down the grout joints where I needed to preserve some tiles. http://www.dewalt.com/products/power-tools/oscillating-tools/oscillating-multitool-kit/dwe315k On Mon, Mar 6, 2017 at 10:38 AM, aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: [Attachment(s) from aw… [at] bellsouth.net included below] Jerry, Years ago I basically rebuilt the inside of a Cal-25 that had curious damage. The original owner ran into some power lines and LARGE currents (to the point that the headstay was cut as if a torch had been used) ran through the rig and out the port cockpit drain through hull at the companionway. The dinette, galley, and quarterberths were popped loose from the hull. Huge currents in a wire make the wire want to form a circle. My theory is that the currents flowing through the rigging torqued the hull and cracked the keel-hull fillet in addition to breaking the furniture loose. I was able to pull the tabbing tape off of the hull but it was well adhered to the bulkheads. I sanded the area and then laid in glass mat followed by tape with polyester resin. I didn’t do anything to hold it in place. I guess you could tack glass down with dots of superglue and then come in with resin as long as you were able to get it all saturated well. In my case there was an air gap between the bulkheads and the hull that I attributed to poor construction. I later read that that was done to avoid a hard point. If I had to do it over again I would lay down progressively narrower strips of glass along the bulkhead line and then bond the bulkhead to that. Stair-stepping the thickness of the glass under the bulkhead should avoid the potential for a hard point at the bulkheads. I wouldn’t use silicone. It is my understanding that nothing will remove the silicone adequately for anything to bond to an area where silicone was used. My processes are based on a limited knowledge of the current adhesive technology, however. If bond strength and resistance to shear are equivalent, a more modern adhesive might be appropriate. Al Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 2:44 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; aw… [at] bellsouth.net Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Removing items bedded with 5200 Al, thanks for info.Here is my question: Is there any way to re-attach Fiberglas bulkhead tabbing to a fiberglass hull short of removing all the glass tabbing and redoing it from scratch? The old tabbing is intact.Some ideas I've had are:1] Cleaning the surface with acetone and reattaching using urethane mastic and super glue along the edges, or west systems and superglue and tape to hold the tabbing in place until the urethane or epoxy sets up.2] Is urethane mastic preferable to, say, Silicone II? Either mastic/sealant seem extremely tenacious and would be shock and vibration resistant. One member discourage using silicone since it leaves a hard to remove residue which would impede future attachment. Wouldn't acetone remove that residue?3] What about using 3M 4200 or 5200 instead of something like Sikaflex? The stuff I've used is a roofing to flashing glue/sealant.Jerry On Sunday, March 5, 2017 7:53 PM, "aw… [at] bellsouth.net [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I secured a dryer vent I thought I’d never remove to the side of the house with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade is ideally shaped for the job. I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would work well for removing ports or hatches. YMMV Al Sent from Mail for Windows 10

I love the tool. Does cutting at edges beautifully. Not real fast, but very clean. Fein originally built the thing as the cast cutter Chris mentioned. They had a patent and the tool was extremely expensive. Now that the patent has ended, the price dropped to less than half. (Imagine that!) I have a Fein Multimaster and a Rockwell Sonicrafter. Either is very good. Here is how I used the vibrating saw to replace the cabinet faces in my Cal 25. With shopping, I think the blades would be $5-6 a pop. I don’t think I changed blades during this piece of my project. That is a Sonicrafter sitting on the part. Harbor Freight is the place to go for tools you don’t intend to use often or for very long. A lot of them have plastic bearings. I believe that once you start using the vibrating saw, you will find many more uses for it. Therefore I recommend getting a good one. Multifitblades looks like a good deal for the accessories. Cheers Charlie From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, March 06, 2017 9:02 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; NEWMAN <d2… [at] gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Removing items bedded with 5200 You need to look at multifitblades. They have nice parts for that tool On Mar 6, 2017, at 11:18 AM, NEWMAN d2… [at] gmail.com <mailto:d2… [at] gmail.com> [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > wrote: I love the tool, but the blade costs has been just horrible. And I don't get a lot of life from the wood cutting blades. I do see that Harbor Freight blade costs are about a third of say Home Depot. But what I find with most Harbor Freight anything (except maybe chip brushes) is their stuff is really poorly made crap. I have the DeWalt tool and love it, but again, blades are its Achilles heel. I've used the tool to run down the side of a screened porch, cutting the decking boards so we could replace the exposed wood with that composite decking. Allowed me to make a nice clean cut along where the porch met the deck. Saws all could do the same job, but not as clean. But I suspect a single saws all blade would have done the job that it took three of the mutlitool blades to do. The tile blades lasted much better. I used the tool to get up a bathroom tile floor and it was the ticket. Especially running down the grout joints where I needed to preserve some tiles. http://www.dewalt.com/products/power-tools/oscillating-tools/oscillating-multitool-kit/dwe315k On Mon, Mar 6, 2017 at 10:38 AM, aw… [at] bellsouth.net <mailto:aw… [at] bellsouth.net> [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > wrote: [Attachment(s) from aw… [at] bellsouth.net <mailto:aw… [at] bellsouth.net> included below] Jerry, Years ago I basically rebuilt the inside of a Cal-25 that had curious damage. The original owner ran into some power lines and LARGE currents (to the point that the headstay was cut as if a torch had been used) ran through the rig and out the port cockpit drain through hull at the companionway. The dinette, galley, and quarterberths were popped loose from the hull. Huge currents in a wire make the wire want to form a circle. My theory is that the currents flowing through the rigging torqued the hull and cracked the keel-hull fillet in addition to breaking the furniture loose. I was able to pull the tabbing tape off of the hull but it was well adhered to the bulkheads. I sanded the area and then laid in glass mat followed by tape with polyester resin. I didn’t do anything to hold it in place. I guess you could tack glass down with dots of superglue and then come in with resin as long as you were able to get it all saturated well. In my case there was an air gap between the bulkheads and the hull that I attributed to poor construction. I later read that that was done to avoid a hard point. If I had to do it over again I would lay down progressively narrower strips of glass along the bulkhead line and then bond the bulkhead to that. Stair-stepping the thickness of the glass under the bulkhead should avoid the potential for a hard point at the bulkheads. I wouldn’t use silicone. It is my understanding that nothing will remove the silicone adequately for anything to bond to an area where silicone was used. My processes are based on a limited knowledge of the current adhesive technology, however. If bond strength and resistance to shear are equivalent, a more modern adhesive might be appropriate. Al Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10 From: Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 2:44 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> ; aw… [at] bellsouth.net <mailto:aw… [at] bellsouth.net> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Removing items bedded with 5200 Al, thanks for info. Here is my question: Is there any way to re-attach Fiberglas bulkhead tabbing to a fiberglass hull short of removing all the glass tabbing and redoing it from scratch? The old tabbing is intact. Some ideas I've had are: 1] Cleaning the surface with acetone and reattaching using urethane mastic and super glue along the edges, or west systems and superglue and tape to hold the tabbing in place until the urethane or epoxy sets up. 2] Is urethane mastic preferable to, say, Silicone II? Either mastic/sealant seem extremely tenacious and would be shock and vibration resistant. One member discourage using silicone since it leaves a hard to remove residue which would impede future attachment. Wouldn't acetone remove that residue? 3] What about using 3M 4200 or 5200 instead of something like Sikaflex? The stuff I've used is a roofing to flashing glue/sealant. Jerry On Sunday, March 5, 2017 7:53 PM, "aw… [at] bellsouth.net <mailto:aw… [at] bellsouth.net> [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> > wrote: I made an interesting discovery today while working around the house. I secured a dryer vent I thought I’d never remove to the side of the house with 5200. Well, it got broken and I needed to take it off. I tried driving a putty knife between the vent and the house, but it was slow going. I wondered if my vibrating multi-tool would be useful. I used the wood/plastic saw blade and it went through the 5200 like butter. The blade is ideally shaped for the job. I was taking a plastic vent off a stucco wall, but there was no tendency to cut the plastic, and if the blade did scratch a fiberglass surface, that surface would be under the flange of a mounted part. I think this would work well for removing ports or hatches. YMMV Al Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10