toe rail

Rog; We've discussed fixing the toe rail. I was at the boat this morning and it looks as though the caulking I did will not end the leak problem. I think I will have to, at least, take the toe rail off back to the shrouds to get the leaks. We talked about fixing that hull- deck joint. I can get the carbon fiber twill from Jamestown Distributers. It's expensive but it seems that it might be worthwhile to get a stiff strong joint. Wendy and Duncan used glass and filled the joint, then replaced the toe rail over it. I'm thinking that I want to replace the toe rail in sections so will want to fair in the surface for the spots between rail segments. Should the carbon wrap around the edge of the deck and go down to the cove stripe area ? Or would simply filling the joint back to the non- skid and to the turn of the deck be enough ? I may try to do the bow this spring and not do the rest until a year or two later. I thought I'd do this on list as other may have the problem and be thinking about it. What do you think ? Mike Kennedy Conquest Cal 40 # 96

Hi, Mike - Attached is a diagram that might be of help to you. 1. The scarf joint is important. As you begin to grind back, you will expose identifiable layers of reinforcement in the original laminate. The wider the scarf joint, the stronger the bond. Try to expose each layer of the original reinforcement like peeling back an onion so that each layer is at least an inch wide. This will not be perfect, but it will make sure that as you tie the new material in, to the greatest extent possible, one layer of carbon twill grips an individual layer of original reinforcement. Try to avoid any sharp bends or angles in the twill - that is, try to radius the corners so that the twill is not stressed across its fibers. Definitely use twill, since plain weave will not take the corners well. Do not use Kevlar, as it absorbs water and degrades over time. 2. You are absolutely right to do it in sections. The hull and deck will otherwise want to move away from each other. 3. Once you have several sections completed, you can tie them together linearly with a long layer of twill. Overlap the adjacent layers vertically as well to the extent possible as you build them up. 4. The innermost and outermost layers are mat to allow you to have a material to which you can fair. This will be sanded as smooth as possible and then covered with fairing compound and sanded again to the final fairness desired. 5. Do not allow any more time between start and finish of this job than possible to avoid the epoxy efflorescing and producing a hazy surface. If you see a haze before you start adding a new layer of laminate, wash it with fresh water to remove the blush. Hope this is helpful. \Rog Cal 29+ #1 Swiss Navy Cal 2-30 #77 St. Lori's Comet _____ From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael Kennedy Sent: Saturday, December 24, 2005 4:47 PM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cal_Boats] toe rail Rog; We've discussed fixing the toe rail. I was at the boat this morning and it looks as though the caulking I did will not end the leak problem. I think I will have to, at least, take the toe rail off back to the shrouds to get the leaks. We talked about fixing that hull- deck joint. I can get the carbon fiber twill from Jamestown Distributers. It's expensive but it seems that it might be worthwhile to get a stiff strong joint. Wendy and Duncan used glass and filled the joint, then replaced the toe rail over it. I'm thinking that I want to replace the toe rail in sections so will want to fair in the surface for the spots between rail segments. Should the carbon wrap around the edge of the deck and go down to the cove stripe area ? Or would simply filling the joint back to the non- skid and to the turn of the deck be enough ? I may try to do the bow this spring and not do the rest until a year or two later. I thought I'd do this on list as other may have the problem and be thinking about it. What do you think ? Mike Kennedy Conquest Cal 40 # 96 _____ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS * Visit your group "Cal_Boats <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Cal_Boats> " on the web. * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com <mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe> * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service. _____

On Dec 25, 2005, at 9:12 AM, Rog Jones wrote: > Hi, Mike – > > > > Attached is a diagram that might be of help to you. > > > > The scarf joint is important. As you begin to grind back, you will > expose identifiable layers of reinforcement in the original > laminate. The wider the scarf joint, the stronger the bond. Try to > expose each layer of the original reinforcement like peeling back > an onion so that each layer is at least an inch wide. This will not > be perfect, but it will make sure that as you tie the new material > in, to the greatest extent possible, one layer of carbon twill > grips an individual layer of original reinforcement. Try to avoid > any sharp bends or angles in the twill – that is, try to radius the > corners so that the twill is not stressed across its fibers. > Definitely use twill, since plain weave will not take the corners > well. Do not use Kevlar, as it absorbs water and degrades over time. I plan to do it in the water as hauling the hull may tweak the stresses at the joint and change the geometry. How far back should I make the scarf ? The nonskid is about 6 inches back from the turn of the hull-deck. I haven't measured but it seems about that. I don't recall how far Duncan ground back on Willow Wind but it wasn't much more. The non-skid will make it easy to match the paint and the cove on the hull makes a good spot to end it. I wish I could just have someone do it but I have so much money in this boat now that I will do as much as I can. I may have the painting done after the repair but have learned a lot the hard way the past year. What do you think of doing only the bow back to the shrouds at one time and waiting a year or two to do the rest ? > > > You are absolutely right to do it in sections. The hull and deck > will otherwise want to move away from each other. That's also the reason to do it in the water. Thanks for the help. The bow leak is kind of forcing my hand now. Mike Kennedy Conquest Cal 40 # 96

Mike - Six inches should be more than enough to grind back for the scarf. The theory is obvious. Wish I were closer - I'd be happy to give you a hand with this. Merry Christmas. \Rog Cal 29+ #1 Swiss Navy Cal 2-30 #77 St. Lori's Comet

I will be replacing the fifty year old teak toe rail on my CC36 question of the day. bed the entire rail in hopes of never allowing any salt under it anywhere while knowing that dream is impossible, versus sealing at each mounting bolt and let water flow under as best it can in hopes any rains and flushing will eliminate any salt buildup, another impossible dream. Reggie SV Submit Cal Cruising 36 Sent from Outlook<http://aka.ms/weboutlook>

On 1/24/2018 4:06 AM, r good my… [at] hotmail.com [Cal_Boats] wrote: > > > I will be replacing the fifty year old teak toe rail on my CC36 > > > question of the day. bed the entire rail in hopes of never allowing > any salt under it anywhere while knowing that dream is impossible, > versus sealing at each mounting bolt and let water flow under as best > it can in hopes any rains and flushing will eliminate any salt > buildup, another impossible dream. > I don't know what your rail's shape is, but it sounds like it's just sitting on the deck edge? If so, could you rout a groove on the underside and use butyl rubber tape, with the groove there as assurance against too much squeeze-out? Chris Campbell > > >