Re: [Cal_Boats] Money trouble for our club as racers don't drink enough

We humble sailors beg your indulgence, Exalted Captain, for damaging your oplnion of we lesser persons. Mike Farrell Capt. Yellow Jack US57313 1.515 tons From: "Travis E Owen sw… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Date: 03/08/2018 8:01 PM (GMT-08:00) To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com,Gerald Sobel <so… [at] yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Money trouble for our club as racers don't drink enough I thought this forum was about Cal boats, sailing and to refurb a classic sailboat not about folks crying about not making enough money off of others. What fee we charge to members and non-members or they want to charge us to use there bouy for a race. How about going back to the basics of what this forum was started about. Cal boats, re furbing them, sailing them, keeping there legacy alive for those to come. Travis E Owen, Captain, OUPV & Master 50 ton On Mar 9, 2018, at 07:39, Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Our Venture-MacGregor Fleet has charged $30 a year for 30 races on Tuesday Nite, going from the start to the end of Daylite Savings.. But... It's a non-landed club. Cal Yacht Club does significantly less races/season, and for its cruiser class, the race is at best half as long, doesn't start until half past six o'clock (vs. circa six for VMF), costs $15/race (and don't get no respect from the PHRF crazies..er..razors who think we're just getting in their way). Yet because of it's prestige, CYC has no shortage of participants, including easily 2/3rds or more of the same racers who participate in our Tuesday Nite Trials (TNT) races. But, since joining VMF, I'm not one of them. When "the clubs" found out we were using "their" Olympic Buoy's for our races, they wanted to charge us a $60 a race/fee. So, we set up our own buoys using bleach bottles, until last year, when they relented because so many of the TNT racers were members of landed yacht clubs. In the meantime, we came up with some amazingly imaginative races, for example, using the entire detached breakwater all 1/3 to half mile of it, as a windward buoy, and, some of the center channel buoys for the same purpose. And then, well, I'll let one of the Cal owners on this site tell you about the course he invented for our last five race segment. It was a doozy. (crash boom bam). We've been holding our after race gathering at a dive/sports bar in Playa del Rey, but lately, Pacific Mariner's YC has invited us to use their facilities. I think this will be really nice. We'll see. Jerry of Shpritz On Thursday, March 8, 2018 5:55 PM, "mike farrell ve… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: At GGYC members and nonmembers were charged the same entry fees for Friday night beer can series, $165? if memory serves... dinner was provided for crew. We mostly had two drinks for owner and crew. We had about 15/20 boats show up most Fridays, My Best, Mike Farrell Yellow Jack US57313 On ‎Thursday‎, ‎March‎ ‎8‎, ‎2018‎ ‎04‎:‎20‎:‎34‎ ‎PM‎ ‎PST, Allen Edwards al… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hi, Our beer can races are losing money because many fewer drinks are sold compared to 5 years ago. We need to make the races more profitable. We only have about 12 boats a week show up and I am guessing average of 4 crew per boat. Not every crew comes to the club after the race. Members race for free, non members $100. 17 races in 3 series. Dinner is cook your own burger, salad, sides, $7. Beer is $3. There are other expenses as there are 6 trophies per night in the two classes. There is also gas for the CB. I am wondering what other clubs charge for meals and race registration. Bar prices are club wide and can't change. Allen

I have to side with Allen and the other commenters. Yacht clubs are struggling not only with racers but members as well. Clubs help sailing by getting boats on the water NOT for the money they make off the racers but for sailing and youth sailing programs. I am on a couple of boards, one of the statistics that they had presented showed there was something like 900,000 boat sold last year and of that there were less than 90 thousand sailboats sold. RandyCal 2 29Out Patient Channel Islands Ca -------- Original message --------From: "Allen Edwards al… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Date: 3/8/18 8:15 PM (GMT-08:00) To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, Travis E Owen <sw… [at] yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Money trouble for our club as racers don't drink enough Wow, kind of grumpy are we? On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 8:01 PM, Travis E Owen sw… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I thought this forum was about Cal boats, sailing and to refurb a classic sailboat not about folks crying about not making enough money off of others. What fee we charge to members and non-members or they want to charge us to use there bouy for a race.How about going back to the basics of what this forum was started about. Cal boats, re furbing them, sailing them, keeping there legacy alive for those to come. Travis E Owen, Captain, OUPV & Master 50 ton On Mar 9, 2018, at 07:39, Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Our Venture-MacGregor Fleet has charged $30 a year for 30 races on Tuesday Nite, going from the start to the end of Daylite Savings.. But... It's a non-landed club. Cal Yacht Club does significantly less races/season, and for its cruiser class, the race is at best half as long, doesn't start until half past six o'clock (vs. circa six for VMF), costs $15/race (and don't get no respect from the PHRF crazies..er..razors who think we're just getting in their way). Yet because of it's prestige, CYC has no shortage of participants, including easily 2/3rds or more of the same racers who participate in our Tuesday Nite Trials (TNT) races. But, since joining VMF, I'm not one of them. When "the clubs" found out we were using "their" Olympic Buoy's for our races, they wanted to charge us a $60 a race/fee. So, we set up our own buoys using bleach bottles, until last year, when they relented because so many of the TNT racers were members of landed yacht clubs. In the meantime, we came up with some amazingly imaginative races, for example, using the entire detached breakwater all 1/3 to half mile of it, as a windward buoy, and, some of the center channel buoys for the same purpose. And then, well, I'll let one of the Cal owners on this site tell you about the course he invented for our last five race segment. It was a doozy. (crash boom bam). We've been holding our after race gathering at a dive/sports bar in Playa del Rey, but lately, Pacific Mariner's YC has invited us to use their facilities. I think this will be really nice. We'll see. Jerry of Shpritz On Thursday, March 8, 2018 5:55 PM, "mike farrell ve… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: At GGYC members and nonmembers were charged the same entry fees for Friday night beer can series, $165? if memory serves... dinner was provided for crew. We mostly had two drinks for owner and crew. We had about 15/20 boats show up most Fridays, My Best, Mike Farrell Yellow Jack US57313 On ‎Thursday‎, ‎March‎ ‎8‎, ‎2018‎ ‎04‎:‎20‎:‎34‎ ‎PM‎ ‎PST, Allen Edwards al… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hi, Our beer can races are losing money because many fewer drinks are sold compared to 5 years ago. We need to make the races more profitable. We only have about 12 boats a week show up and I am guessing average of 4 crew per boat. Not every crew comes to the club after the race. Members race for free, non members $100. 17 races in 3 series.Dinner is cook your own burger, salad, sides, $7. Beer is $3. There are other expenses as there are 6 trophies per night in the two classes. There is also gas for the CB. I am wondering what other clubs charge for meals and race registration. Bar prices are club wide and can't change. Allen

And, it’s WINTER still in many areas. People talk about things that are indirectly related to the boat itself. And there are frequently NEW owners, trying to learn and understand more than just the activity itself. One of my motorcycle lists…we anticipate that. “Winter coming. Here we go. What’s the best oil? Best tires for my new-to-me bike?” Conversation while standing indoors with a cup of coffee..looking out the window..waiting for the right weather. Oh, wait! That’s a glass of wine in my hand..not coffee. : -) I can start a fresh one: what’s the best bedding compound for my deck hardware? From: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com [mailto:Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com] Sent: Friday, March 09, 2018 9:13 AM To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com; Allen Edwards; Travis E Owen Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Money trouble for our club as racers don't drink enough I have to side with Allen and the other commenters. Yacht clubs are struggling not only with racers but members as well. Clubs help sailing by getting boats on the water NOT for the money they make off the racers but for sailing and youth sailing programs. I am on a couple of boards, one of the statistics that they had presented showed there was something like 900,000 boat sold last year and of that there were less than 90 thousand sailboats sold. Randy Cal 2 29 Out Patient Channel Islands Ca From: "Allen Edwards al… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Date: 3/8/18 8:15 PM (GMT-08:00) To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, Travis E Owen <sw… [at] yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Money trouble for our club as racers don't drink enough Wow, kind of grumpy are we? On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 8:01 PM, Travis E Owen sw… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I thought this forum was about Cal boats, sailing and to refurb a classic sailboat not about folks crying about not making enough money off of others. What fee we charge to members and non-members or they want to charge us to use there bouy for a race. How about going back to the basics of what this forum was started about. Cal boats, re furbing them, sailing them, keeping there legacy alive for those to come. Travis E Owen, Captain, OUPV & Master 50 ton On Mar 9, 2018, at 07:39, Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Our Venture-MacGregor Fleet has charged $30 a year for 30 races on Tuesday Nite, going from the start to the end of Daylite Savings.. But... It's a non-landed club. Cal Yacht Club does significantly less races/season, and for its cruiser class, the race is at best half as long, doesn't start until half past six o'clock (vs. circa six for VMF), costs $15/race (and don't get no respect from the PHRF crazies..er..razors who think we're just getting in their way). Yet because of it's prestige, CYC has no shortage of participants, including easily 2/3rds or more of the same racers who participate in our Tuesday Nite Trials (TNT) races. But, since joining VMF, I'm not one of them. When "the clubs" found out we were using "their" Olympic Buoy's for our races, they wanted to charge us a $60 a race/fee. So, we set up our own buoys using bleach bottles, until last year, when they relented because so many of the TNT racers were members of landed yacht clubs. In the meantime, we came up with some amazingly imaginative races, for example, using the entire detached breakwater all 1/3 to half mile of it, as a windward buoy, and, some of the center channel buoys for the same purpose. And then, well, I'll let one of the Cal owners on this site tell you about the course he invented for our last five race segment. It was a doozy. (crash boom bam). We've been holding our after race gathering at a dive/sports bar in Playa del Rey, but lately, Pacific Mariner's YC has invited us to use their facilities. I think this will be really nice. We'll see. Jerry of Shpritz On Thursday, March 8, 2018 5:55 PM, "mike farrell ve… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: At GGYC members and nonmembers were charged the same entry fees for Friday night beer can series, $165? if memory serves... dinner was provided for crew. We mostly had two drinks for owner and crew. We had about 15/20 boats show up most Fridays, My Best, Mike Farrell Yellow Jack US57313 On ‎Thursday‎, ‎March‎ ‎8‎, ‎2018‎ ‎04‎:‎20‎:‎34‎ ‎PM‎ ‎PST, Allen Edwards al… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hi, Our beer can races are losing money because many fewer drinks are sold compared to 5 years ago. We need to make the races more profitable. We only have about 12 boats a week show up and I am guessing average of 4 crew per boat. Not every crew comes to the club after the race. Members race for free, non members $100. 17 races in 3 series. Dinner is cook your own burger, salad, sides, $7. Beer is $3. There are other expenses as there are 6 trophies per night in the two classes. There is also gas for the CB. I am wondering what other clubs charge for meals and race registration. Bar prices are club wide and can't change. Allen

On 3/9/2018 2:34 PM, 'TomDressler' tb… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] wrote: > > > I can start a fresh one: what’s the best bedding compound for my deck > hardware? > This list won me over to butyl rubber tape from the RV store--especially if you bevel the holes (deck & hardware) with a countersink to form a little ring of the stuff around the fasteners, and don't over-tighten so as to squish it all out. Chris Campbell

Randy, can you reword you letter? I read that both 900k sailboats were solar last year, and of that number 90K were sold. Did you mean 900k sailboats in existence or registered, and of that number one tenth of them (90k) were sold?Jerry of Shpritz On Friday, March 9, 2018 9:20 AM, "saylorran sa… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I have to side with Allen and the other commenters. Yacht clubs are struggling not only with racers but members as well. Clubs help sailing by getting boats on the water NOT for the money they make off the racers but for sailing and youth sailing programs. I am on a couple of boards, one of the statistics that they had presented showed there was something like 900,000 boat sold last year and of that there were less than 90 thousand sailboats sold. RandyCal 2 29Out Patient Channel Islands Ca -------- Original message --------From: "Allen Edwards al… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Date: 3/8/18 8:15 PM (GMT-08:00) To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, Travis E Owen <sw… [at] yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Money trouble for our club as racers don't drink enough Wow, kind of grumpy are we? On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 8:01 PM, Travis E Owen sw… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I thought this forum was about Cal boats, sailing and to refurb a classic sailboat not about folks crying about not making enough money off of others. What fee we charge to members and non-members or they want to charge us to use there bouy for a race.How about going back to the basics of what this forum was started about. Cal boats, re furbing them, sailing them, keeping there legacy alive for those to come. Travis E Owen, Captain, OUPV & Master 50 ton On Mar 9, 2018, at 07:39, Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Our Venture-MacGregor Fleet has charged $30 a year for 30 races on Tuesday Nite, going from the start to the end of Daylite Savings.. But... It's a non-landed club. Cal Yacht Club does significantly less races/season, and for its cruiser class, the race is at best half as long, doesn't start until half past six o'clock (vs. circa six for VMF), costs $15/race (and don't get no respect from the PHRF crazies..er..razors who think we're just getting in their way). Yet because of it's prestige, CYC has no shortage of participants, including easily 2/3rds or more of the same racers who participate in our Tuesday Nite Trials (TNT) races. But, since joining VMF, I'm not one of them. When "the clubs" found out we were using "their" Olympic Buoy's for our races, they wanted to charge us a $60 a race/fee. So, we set up our own buoys using bleach bottles, until last year, when they relented because so many of the TNT racers were members of landed yacht clubs. In the meantime, we came up with some amazingly imaginative races, for example, using the entire detached breakwater all 1/3 to half mile of it, as a windward buoy, and, some of the center channel buoys for the same purpose. And then, well, I'll let one of the Cal owners on this site tell you about the course he invented for our last five race segment. It was a doozy. (crash boom bam). We've been holding our after race gathering at a dive/sports bar in Playa del Rey, but lately, Pacific Mariner's YC has invited us to use their facilities. I think this will be really nice. We'll see. Jerry of Shpritz On Thursday, March 8, 2018 5:55 PM, "mike farrell ve… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: At GGYC members and nonmembers were charged the same entry fees for Friday night beer can series, $165? if memory serves... dinner was provided for crew. We mostly had two drinks for owner and crew. We had about 15/20 boats show up most Fridays, My Best, Mike Farrell Yellow Jack US57313 On ‎Thursday‎, ‎March‎ ‎8‎, ‎2018‎ ‎04‎:‎20‎:‎34‎ ‎PM‎ ‎PST, Allen Edwards al… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hi, Our beer can races are losing money because many fewer drinks are sold compared to 5 years ago. We need to make the races more profitable. We only have about 12 boats a week show up and I am guessing average of 4 crew per boat. Not every crew comes to the club after the race. Members race for free, non members $100. 17 races in 3 series.Dinner is cook your own burger, salad, sides, $7. Beer is $3. There are other expenses as there are 6 trophies per night in the two classes. There is also gas for the CB. I am wondering what other clubs charge for meals and race registration. Bar prices are club wide and can't change. Allen

Jerry, The data he presented showed 900,000 new boats sold, of that, 90,000 were sailboats. Randy -------- Original message --------From: "Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Date: 3/9/18 7:54 PM (GMT-08:00) To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, saylorran <sa… [at] yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Money trouble for our club as racers don't drink enough Randy, can you reword you letter? I read that both 900k sailboats were solar last year, and of that number 90K were sold. Did you mean 900k sailboats in existence or registered, and of that number one tenth of them (90k) were sold?Jerry of Shpritz On Friday, March 9, 2018 9:20 AM, "saylorran sa… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I have to side with Allen and the other commenters. Yacht clubs are struggling not only with racers but members as well. Clubs help sailing by getting boats on the water NOT for the money they make off the racers but for sailing and youth sailing programs. I am on a couple of boards, one of the statistics that they had presented showed there was something like 900,000 boat sold last year and of that there were less than 90 thousand sailboats sold. RandyCal 2 29Out Patient Channel Islands Ca -------- Original message --------From: "Allen Edwards al… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> Date: 3/8/18 8:15 PM (GMT-08:00) To: Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com, Travis E Owen <sw… [at] yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Cal_Boats] Money trouble for our club as racers don't drink enough Wow, kind of grumpy are we? On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 8:01 PM, Travis E Owen sw… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: I thought this forum was about Cal boats, sailing and to refurb a classic sailboat not about folks crying about not making enough money off of others. What fee we charge to members and non-members or they want to charge us to use there bouy for a race.How about going back to the basics of what this forum was started about. Cal boats, re furbing them, sailing them, keeping there legacy alive for those to come. Travis E Owen, Captain, OUPV & Master 50 ton On Mar 9, 2018, at 07:39, Gerald Sobel so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Our Venture-MacGregor Fleet has charged $30 a year for 30 races on Tuesday Nite, going from the start to the end of Daylite Savings.. But... It's a non-landed club. Cal Yacht Club does significantly less races/season, and for its cruiser class, the race is at best half as long, doesn't start until half past six o'clock (vs. circa six for VMF), costs $15/race (and don't get no respect from the PHRF crazies..er..razors who think we're just getting in their way). Yet because of it's prestige, CYC has no shortage of participants, including easily 2/3rds or more of the same racers who participate in our Tuesday Nite Trials (TNT) races. But, since joining VMF, I'm not one of them. When "the clubs" found out we were using "their" Olympic Buoy's for our races, they wanted to charge us a $60 a race/fee. So, we set up our own buoys using bleach bottles, until last year, when they relented because so many of the TNT racers were members of landed yacht clubs. In the meantime, we came up with some amazingly imaginative races, for example, using the entire detached breakwater all 1/3 to half mile of it, as a windward buoy, and, some of the center channel buoys for the same purpose. And then, well, I'll let one of the Cal owners on this site tell you about the course he invented for our last five race segment. It was a doozy. (crash boom bam). We've been holding our after race gathering at a dive/sports bar in Playa del Rey, but lately, Pacific Mariner's YC has invited us to use their facilities. I think this will be really nice. We'll see. Jerry of Shpritz On Thursday, March 8, 2018 5:55 PM, "mike farrell ve… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats]" <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: At GGYC members and nonmembers were charged the same entry fees for Friday night beer can series, $165? if memory serves.... dinner was provided for crew. We mostly had two drinks for owner and crew. We had about 15/20 boats show up most Fridays, My Best, Mike Farrell Yellow Jack US57313 On ‎Thursday‎, ‎March‎ ‎8‎, ‎2018‎ ‎04‎:‎20‎:‎34‎ ‎PM‎ ‎PST, Allen Edwards al… [at] gmail.com [Cal_Boats] <Ca… [at] yahoogroups.com> wrote: Hi, Our beer can races are losing money because many fewer drinks are sold compared to 5 years ago. We need to make the races more profitable. We only have about 12 boats a week show up and I am guessing average of 4 crew per boat. Not every crew comes to the club after the race. Members race for free, non members $100. 17 races in 3 series.Dinner is cook your own burger, salad, sides, $7. Beer is $3. There are other expenses as there are 6 trophies per night in the two classes. There is also gas for the CB. I am wondering what other clubs charge for meals and race registration. Bar prices are club wide and can't change. Allen

Did I really say that many boats were "solar" last year? I better check for missing marbles! Until I locate them, watch where you step. I've heard their more dangerous than banana peels. Jerry of Shpritz

On 3/12/2018 7:57 PM, so… [at] yahoo.com [Cal_Boats] wrote: > > > Did I really say that many boats were "solar" last year? I better > check for missing marbles! Until I locate them, watch where you step. > I've heard their more dangerous than banana peels. When you're in school, "the dog ate my homework." For adults who get fumble-fingered, it's "damn that spell-check that keeps changing my words." Chris Campbell